That sucks but I don’t think classic fighting games do well in arcades anymore. When I went to Long Beach everything was fifty cents from 3S to CVS2 to MVC2. There was an old Hyper Fighting machine there for 25 cents. For a while a resurrected a Hyper Fighting scene lol. I had like a 20 game winning streak against a big crowd and had to leave it because I had to go to class.
But ya I think that college arcades are no longer a place for fighting games. Especially with tuition being up. They need more mainstream gaming to pump more money in the school. Fighting game arcades in So Cal have their best shot in a public place with a big parking lot.
Switching topics what is this stuff I keep hearing about Gems being in Street Fighter Vs Tekken? Are they really going back to the Marvel Super Heroes and Gem Fighter days? Is it like while you’re fighting gems are gonna fall down and you’re gonna pick them up? What the hell is going on here? What is Capcom thinking?
I wish it were like MVS or Gem Fighter (Gem Fighter Ibuki plays like Rolento but worse, lol). >>
Essentially, the gems work like perks. You “equip” gems onto your characters (both of them), and they activate based upon specific conditions during play. For example, you can get a damage modifier of 10% if you land 3 random normals. Other conditions may include 3 random specials, taking 3 random hits, doing a combo, and so on, but you can’t “drop” gems, nor punish them, per se. The problem is that these gems are mandatory no matter which mode you’re playing, and not every gem is included in the game. In fact, there are exclusive store deals as far as what gems you’ll get, so your SFxT bought from Amazon will probably be different from my SFxT from Target. Buying the limited edition gets you all of them OUTSIDE of any DLC gems.
If I seriously wanted an edge in a fighting game, I would be fine with something like Rage from Tekken, Burst from GG, BB, and P4U, or even something as broken as X-factor in Marvel. However, SFxT feels like it wants to be 8 games in one. People forget that this is the first SF game with a bound/OTG mechanic. That’s a BIG deal and changes everything. Same goes for cross-assault, the launcher that’s unpublishable low, cross-arts, chargeable supers that can be dash canceled into counter hit option selects, universal chain combos, Pandora, Alpha Counters, tag cancels, half a roster full of rush-down/mix-up characters with more tools than the traditional SF cast, non-cancel-able normals (or rather, you can’t cancel into specials properly; you need to do links), and…Jesus…I don’t get it, Don! D8
I always like reading your posts. So indepth when talking about fighting game mechanics.
So speaking of SFvsT Ring Pop System: Is it like after you beat Alpha 3 World Tour mode and you get to custom your Ism only this time you have to buy the upgrades? Or like CVS2 on console where you get to custom your groove but only this time you have to pay for each custom on DLC? Basically like buying costumes in AE but instead of costumes you buy upgrades?
As far as functionality goes, I’d compare it to a toned down version of MSH’s gem system + X-factor (everything from speed up gems to auto-block gems that consume meter). It’s not really…I don’t know how to really put this…“practical” in a competitive environment, though. Gem activation seems kind of specific, and the rewards are worth the skewed play. It’s like meter building 2.0; BS around with some specials, “hey, my strength bonus is on! 8D”. Oddly enough, I don’t think the meta-game will be about countering gems. No one is going to keep track of their opponent’s 10 gems all at once. Since gems stack (Strength can go upwards to +40% with 3 gems on), you’ll probably see combos with characters specifically designed to simultaneously trigger gems into near death combos. In other words, we’re talking about heavily tiered gem builds that encourages some of the stupidest rushdown ever. =P
Here, again, brings me to why I don’t like the sound of this game: the Tekken characters utilize bound and certain other tools whereas the SF characters are still mostly the same. Ono gave the Tekken characters a lot of nice tools. Julia has half of Yun’s moveset minus some BnB’s. Powerhouse SF characters like Sagat and dominate footsies characters like Chun benefit from speed gems, chain combos, and – you guessed it – power gems! CvS2 is different. That game gives you different types of tools and mechanics. Gems simply give you mini-x-factor stats and jail-free cards with multiple activation windows…and it’ll be at every major tourney near you because it’s a Capcom game that deserves praise no matter how ill-conceived half of it’s mechanics are. -_-
Edit: Oh, and yeah, there are supposed to be defensive gems, too, but the reality is that super armor and stamina values kind of don’t matter when you have the means to neutralize a character with effective options and tools that lead into safe damage.
So Capcom took the WOW business model and applied to fighting games. No wonder it’s not coming out for the arcade. It’s all about the DLC’s. This game is gonna be funny. Overkill times Overkill:p
At this point, I just want to see how people approach this and the metagame. I don’t plan on digging into this game (I bought everything they ever made for MvC3 including the overpriced stick-- I’m entitled to not care anymore this one time), but what will REALLY piss me off is if this game ends up being the main event in tournaments and streams, shows it’s true colors, gets all this attention and hype even if 50% of the cast isn’t viable, and overshadows games that “get it” and don’t just throw anything together (I’mma say it…I didn’t want to say it…Skullgirls – OH, I SAID IT! D8)
Hey John you asked me if I had a MAS stick to sell you. Lavell is bringing his MAS stick this Friday and he wants to sell it for $125. It’s just like the one I sold you but it’s Xbox 360 only.
He’ll bring it this Friday. It’s a great stick. Just like mine.
So tomorrow we shall have a gathering. Everyone and anyone is invited. The more the merrier. Anyone new please text me at 310 344 9367. Hope to see you tomorrow:)
So last night I played AE at Alex Arcade and I had to say I had a lot of fun. I think I like playing AE on the machine way better then I do the console. So I was thinking and not to sound like a snob again but I think that fighting games, particularly Capcom fighting games, are really meant to only be played on an arcade machine for quarters. Yes I know it’s extreme and old fashioned but a game like Street Fighter is really made only for the arcade and it’s atmosphere. It’s more competitive and more skillful and really serious. Training mode and practicing at home is unnecessary. IMO everything should be learned in the arcade patiently little by little quarter by quarter. Players today have no patience anymore.
The consoles kills the spirit of fighting games like Street Fighter because they make the experience of understanding a game go by too fast. It enables a lot of players to skip a lot of details, find easy answers like tier whoring, and miss a lot of the subtle stuff hence not fully understanding the game. This is why fighting games should be machine only. The coin/quarter system plays a big part in fighting games being fun. Without it it’s kind of meaningless. You’re suppose to put a coin in, in every match. The money is suppose to be a part of the game because it adds more tension to the battle. I admit there is something lost when you put a game on freeplay and just keep pressing the start button. You lose the sense of urgency.
Like chess, not everyone should have easy access to a fighting game. You shouldn’t be able to go to the store and buy it and play it at home. Everything shouldn’t be that easy. Fighting games should not be for everyone. And that’s what they’re trying to do with the new games. Make it for everyone. It is my dream to get an AE machine and run everything here on quarters. But relax that day may never come:p. Highly unlikely.
So tonight we shall have a gathering. Everyone and anyone is invited. The more the merrier. I’ll be going around to collect the E fee so please have it ready when I ask for it. Anyone new who is interested please text me at 310 344 9367. Hope to see you tonight. Let’s make it a good one tonight.
Funny thing is, Capcom never necessarily dropped their coin-op design when they went about their newer fighters – they just rolled with it. Ever since SF2 (heck, SF1, honestly), their mentality was “pay a quarter, pick a simple to understand character, mash buttons, take a round”. Specials and supers were never announced in the older games because they were meant to be “a secret”, just like fatalities in the old MK games. Discovering motion/charge inputs was your reward for tinkering with SF1 and SF2 if you put up enough money for that time. In fact, what we consider kara inputs and negative edge inputs now were originally meant to be delayed input windows for specials, because they WANTED you to mash out specials, and figure out what you did, gradually.
Where I would say the line was crossed (lol, SFxT pun), was SF3. Don, even you have to admit that SF3 is so demanding that unless you know stuff out the gate, it’s the ultimate money waster. The risk of losing is higher in that game, but parry seems to make wins you otherwise wouldn’t have had, that much sweeter. Truth be told though, if SF3 were released on consoles first, I don’t think it would have had a long life span since it was an arcade exclusive game for so long for all the reasons you brought up with SF4. The problem is that it’s hard to learn from your mistakes in SF3 since the game expects you to know what you did wrong, adjust, and come up with a new strategy on a dime (…or a quarter). That wasn’t a huge problem with SF2 or even SF4 and the old Marvel games since, at least, you didn’t have to adapt to a completely different meta game every single moment like in SF3, which makes the initial investment and attempt a bit more reasonable (hence SF2’s success and SF3’s financial failure).
I still keep that question in mind that you asked me about playing SF3 on coin-op. I’m sure that every fight would be a fight for my life – I can more than believe it if I’m getting salty over dropping a soda after 20 loses from Minh or Grant. However, the reality of it is that you’re asking me to play this game for years on end just to justify every-single-quarter dropped into a machine to be good at that game to make due on my initial investments, realistically. At that point, yes, I would play Ibuki over Chun, any day. My truthful answer, however, is that I think I would play SF4 or ST over 3S in this sort of environment. @_@
I’m not sure what you mean by this, it’s pretty easy to get a chess board and learn how to play. I feel the opposite, I like the fact that things are on console. It gives a lot of people the ability to play the game who don’t have access to an arcade.
Yes I’m a player from the old era and now I live in a new era in which new era players have different views. But that’s a good thing since we now have a diverse and multi-generaltional community.
I don’t know I learned SF2 and SF3 on machine and on both occasions the competition was fierce. I learned and played 3S in the competitive environments of SHGL, FFA, Camelot, and Regency. Since it was a quarter, not only did I have to learn on the fly but I also had to win so I wouldn’t be blowing away too much money which I also did. And I didn’t have a lot of money back then myself. There was a time when I was a scrub that only used Shinshoryuken Ryu and Denjin Ryu so I could just compete and stay with the competition much less win. I also couldn’t parry for anything. I just liked the game so much I was willing to spend money to play it. And to me that was money well spent. And since I spent money I felt I was investing in my gameplay. The intention was the more I played/spent in the beginning the less I spent in the future when I got better. It was also fun taking everyone’s quarters. But remember unlike the newer players today I accepted the coin-op system and standing in line since that was the way to play SF. That was the process of Street Fighter and I think that is the way the game is originally meant to be played.
Lol I meant chess club that not everyone has easy access to. I watch the movie Searching For Bobby Fischer a lot and when they play in hardcore chess environments that play for money, the collection of talent is better, the competition on the average is just better, and the game is more meaningful and exciting. Yes the game gets more exposure when it gets on console. That’s the good thing about it. But it doesn’t necessarily make the population of gamers better on the whole. It actually waters down the playing field and spirit of competition. Say for 3SO for instance, there may be a lot of people who download the game but I feel that it doesn’t make the player base as a whole better. People will own the game but I don’t think there will be a lot of people who will play the game on a high level on the average. IMO a game like 3S thrives in an arcade environment since it’s a high skilled game and since you have to play to pay, it makes the pretenders stay home and welcomes the people who really want to get good and compete. But you know this already since you went to FFA before.
That’s true that culture changes but once it changes it becomes different hence loses it’s original meaning. One guy I know who studied economics told me that computers are not meant for Wall Street since it just makes everything go by too fast and it messes up the trading game. It also gives more people access to trading who shouldn’t be trading. But that’s something else.
I didn’t make it sound like law I’m just stating that IMO any “pure” Street Fighter whether it be Alpha, 2,3, or 4 is originally meant to be played on an coin-op machine. The way the game is originally designed requires a machine with it’s coin slots and it’s two joysticks. Once the game is converted to a console or even to an Iphone it starts to lose it’s original meaning. When it goes to console, people start playing the game on pad and since they have unlimited credits it starts having this “mass production” gameplay style. It loses it’s craftsmanship and it’s art. Look at the Japanese and how they play because they mainly play on coin op there’s still a craft and personalize style on how they play. Maybe that’s due to the coin op machine. I think, I don’t know. IMO console Street Fighter “democratizes” the game too much when Street Fighter isn’t suppose to be democratized. It’s something like what social commentary writer Fran Lebowitz said: “I don’t believe that there should be a democracy in culture. It’s good for society to have a democracy but not culture. Culture should have a hierarchy of talent. Not everybody should be good because some people are more talented than others. And when you have the best producing the culture, you get the best art.”. I think the same applies to the way Street Fighter should be played. The machine forces the game to be played on a “survival of the fittest level”. Those who aren’t willing to invest, for lack of better terms, are immediately unworthy and cut off.
All I’m trying to say basically is that SF is meant to be played on an arcade machine. When you play it in the arcade with coins you get the full meaning of the game. You learn more and it’s just more entertaining. But of course not everyone has access to arcades. But we live in So Cal and I have a So Cal bias. We still have arcades here and I think that is the reason why we have a lot of strong players here and some of them are the strongest in the world. Hell a lot of people visit So Cal just to play Street Fighter.
But the system is all messed up now IMO. Instead of making the players invest in dlc’s and patches, they should be made to invest in their gameplay with quarters. Putting money into your gameplay makes it more justifiable on why you are better instead of investing in gems lol.
I heard really good things about that.
If there is a crowd and a line around a Street Fighter machine. You don’t spend that much money. You’re just waiting a long time. A three hour night could end up costing $5. Maybe less.
But this is probably how arcades should work today I guess. You play at home to practice. You go to the arcade to show off to a bunch of people.
