Great stuff guys, trying to step up my match up knowledge, maybe we can sticky this one and delete the other thread?
How should I be trying to fight Viper? I never feel comfortable doing max outs because of seismo. I don’t want to sit on downback because she should just make me eat seismo chip all round. I’ve done ok playing semi-random and being turtly, but I don’t have much confidence in that approach.
I have trouble with Fuerte too. Just not sure what my overall strategy should be on characters who are anti-zoning in design.
I find just keep moving with a good amount of vertical jumps helps,Jump back fierce kick is GLK against her, Deejay beats her in the air, and don’t fall for her cancels and seismo gimmicks.
Try and manage your meter well. watch for seismo patterns, most people have them. once you see a pattern use your EX Double Rolling Sobat kick to get a knock down then just go in on her. once you loose that advantage retreat a bit but not too far back. stay in Double Rolling Sobat kick range. When you play Viper you have to just go in without fear.
Forte is another matter. don’t waste meter on ex max outs, use that for body splash AA or to escape. with Double Rolling Sobat kick
Focus Dash can also help. when he has ultra one, try not to jump too much.
Hope that helps.
Once you get him on the floor you can try and bait his U2 out on wakeup by doing early jumps but this is risky. Be vary careful about sobat or sliding him because he can U2 your Sobat’s all day, he may even be able to U2 a sobat FADC Backdash if you do it too deep, I’m not sure. EX Sobats aren’t bad to use for escaping but sometimes a good Elf will be able to U2 that on reaction or get you with a body splash/grab.
Basicaly just pile on him and build some good meter before he gets Ultra because his wakeup is ass before he has that. Once he’s got ultra make him come to you and counter his attacks to wittle down his health until he is dead. Try to be as safe as you can and don’t give him any chances to land U2 because it does so much damage. If he does though he’s back open for business and you can start going on the offensive again.
I’d also say it’s not a good idea to throw too many fireballs (apart from the ocasional EX AS or Sobat if he’s run happy), you don’t want to give him too many chances to focus them and build that Ultra meter.
This post is the reason Elf’s U2 needs nerfing.
You can EX MGU on wakeup to beat both the Splash and the Grab so if you see him leave the ground after a Habanero on your wakeup you can just default to EX MGU.
Thanks guys. I haven’t really been throwing any fireballs at either Fuerte or Viper. That EX MGU info should be really handy. Fuerte’s U2 is just annoying. About on par with online abels mashing breathless through combos and hitting you with it when the lag leads to a dropped combo.
I think DeeJay vs. Viper is 6-4 DeeJay. I rush that shit down through the whole match. Do not let her breath. Light, medium and heavy sobaits are usually safe even if they are not spaced good. If Viper wants to get cute with the fancy cancels, just mash down back until she makes a move or Sobait kick her. DeeJay shuts down all the burn kick cross ups… ahh man I Love upkicks.
The knee shot stops her whole air game. Viper also has a goofy Dp that whiffs against knee shots or sometimes knee shots trades. You can also put her in the vortex because cross up mk will stuff her Dp if timed correctly. Her other wake up option is an ex burn kick thingy. You can up kick that on reaction if she tries that on your cross ups. Blocking also works.Her ex seismo can be a little tricky. If you sniff that out during your cross up, tech the throw. Just look for her to flash.
You’ll be suprised how sobaits and knee shots wreck her shenanigans. The biggest thing to watch for is her safe jumps and I wouldnt recommend air slashers at all in this matchup unless it ends a combo. I think she can punish ex sobait kicks with U1, but that depends on the spacing.
Forward jump Fierce is a beast of an air to air move. Does so much damage and never looses 
The amount of damage I’ve gotten from just throwing a fullscreen lp AS, walking behind it and smashing them in the air when they inevitably jump it is silly. They should make the lp AS even slower like in rainbow edition lmao.
Thanks for the tips. Played a fuerte today and jump fierce OWNED him.
Random tidbit: Fighting Guy, I find that I can use far st.rh to stuff non-EX hozantos on reaction. That’s some good counterhit damage too.
I’ve been messing around in the training room with U1 against Bison. U1`auto corrects psycho crushers easily by buffering back and forward 5-6 times during block stun. It punished all versions of the move and it also punishes Bison’s U1. So I tried some empty jump/safe jump setups after an untechable knockdown. U1 punished wake up psycho crushers. I need to test this out more against good opponents.
If that beats wakeup EX PCs that would be pretty great. Bison’s love to do that on wakeup all the time.
Does anybody know if Gen can punish properly spaced lk Sobats?
As far as I know, the only thing that can punish PROPERLY spaced lk sobats is flash kick.
Maybe super, or something. Gen’s specials don’t really move him forward enough to be effective in that sense. Except for his little vega roll thing, but that’s hella slow.
Zangief match is cake.
Just lame it out and chuck max outs. Anti air him effectively and stay the fuck out of ex hand range. That shit decides whole games sometimes
As for elf… Stay on the offensive. He can ex run out of pressure and it soaks two hits so lk dread is good if he’s ex running.
Ex guac is scary but it fails at autocorrect a lot so crossips be fine.
You don’t really need to use max outs except for baiting, as he has several anti fireball options
Yo how thefuck do you counter Juris pinwheel kick? It seems so safe on block…
cl.lk or c.mk most of the time. im pretty sure you can ultra her on block against EX pinwheel. im not too familiar with Juri
in vanilla ssf4, you can do cr. MK usually, and for EX pinwheels you can reversal HK sobat.
Maybe reversal LK super normal ones, and HK sobat xx super her EX version.
My standard punish is cr. lk xx air slasher. Not massively damaging, but do that twice or thrice and they won’t throw it out to end blockstrings anymore.
beating rose’s cr mp x lk soul spiral
at first i thought i needed meter but it turns out you don’t.
cr. mp x soul spiral loses to mk upkicks.
if they space it so your upkicks don’t come up do cl lk x fa2 > u2