Online, I BEAT Ken’s fierce shoryuken on reversal wakeup with lk Dankukyaku. If you could do this consistently, this is RIDICULOUS. If this is possible against the other shotos as well, it means that Dan can effectively remove non-EX shoryukens from the wakeup equation. It’s like a safe jump that does chip damage that you can mix up with throw!
Dan for top tier, baby!
I’ve also had Dan Knee beat Ryu Reversal Shoryu cleanly, but it’s reaaallly weird and inconsistent it seems like.
I hope I’m wrong on that.
I’m finally getting a hang of using Dan better, my strategy is mostly playing poking with c.mk, s.mk and s.mp (mp stuffs so many attacks it’s ridiculous). Sometimes I’ll pressure with low kicks followed by light Dan Kicks (safe on block yay!), and I use my Super stocks on c.mk xx EX Dan Kick. If I have no super stocks, then c.mk xx Gadoken I never start any combos by jumping in, just too unsafe imo. If I do jump then I air taunt for height (rarely) or Air Dan Kick just to get close and possibly beat any of their jumping attacks. If they jump and I’m grounded, free Koryuken.
I just Ultra on reaction when I see an opening, or any time I land a focus attack.
A lot of times I will not approach and I’ll just let the opponent come to me. It’s fun watching Ken/Ryus get tired of throwing Hadoukens then they get bored and approach me. I mostly play a reaction-counter style, playing it safe.
EDIT: Anyone ever whiffed a Super and then the opponent misjudges it and eats the last hit? Lmao i’ve won quite a few matches that way >_> also caused a few disconnects lmao
meaty lk.dan kicks are really effective on opponents wake up…as long as its not ex or better…
if I see no ex bar…i go…lk.dan kick meaty, if blocked at the right distance, cr.lp>lk.dankick and keep doing it, if its too far for a cr.lp to hit…then skip the lp and lk dankick again to get into jab range…and start the loop
Everyone I play eats it :lol: I think it’s because the last hit has crazy range
[media=youtube]380A5sMXsDg&fmt=35[/media]
Thoughts gentlemen?
I know it doesn’t have much but it can give us a basic template to work on an Abel match-up.
I thought everyone stayed away from EX Dan Kick cause of its horrible damage? Or is that you dont do it when you are already in the middle of a hit confirmed combo and dont want to waste EX?
Yeah right man, ex dan kick is great. It’s great after a hit confirm close standing strong to jab/short, great when buffered into crouching medium kick and jab/shorts in footsie games, and great as a random move in footsie games. Dan is extremely dependent on meter, for ex dan kick, for an occasional ex fireball in footsies, and for focus attack dash canceling his dragon punch.
Dan’s s.mp seems to be fast enough and have enough that it can reliably stuff Blanka balls mid-flight. A little more damage than just s.lp and smaller margin of error than koryu. And c.fp xx danku does NOT work on Blanka, he goes back too far and can block the kicks in time. However, Blanka’s odd hitbox makes it so that even if he’s crouching, dankus will always connect, so s.fp xx danku will work even if he was crouching.
And pointless observation, if Ken does a wakeup ex shoryu and Dan does an ex koryu at the same time, the koryu wins out in the air.
I’ve been using standing and crouching jab to beat horizontal Blanka balls. It’ll actually beat horizontal balls most of the time, but the once or twice out of five or six times it misses results in so much more damage for you than all those jabs did for Blanka that it’s not just not worth using rapid fire jab as a defense. If Blanka does a ball from like half a screen away or more, you should be able to jab him out of it on reaction.
The Gief players have started doing jab xx jab green hand on reaction to balls to both knock Blanka out of the air and move forward while Blanka is in recovery and be done with the green hand early enough so that Gief can pressure Blanka again as Blanka gets up. Gotta try out crouching jab xx short dan kick or something.
Heh, that disparity in damage is exactly why I started looking for alternatives. I’m gonna start working on my s.mp timing for stopping it. I think 2 of those equals one blanka ball, which is much better than 5 or 6.
But I wonder if you can jab -> dash and possibly make it to the other side as Blanka’s landing. A crossup would be a nice bonus for the crap damage your getting for jabbing his ball
dankick has a really slow start up…it wont work…
so far the only counter ive figured out against a blanka ball is when you block an EX…in which case…if I remember correctly…dash foward after block and dan kick…I think…someone double check this…maybe im thinking of the rainbow roll thing…ahh…ill have to mess around with it…
He’s talking about after you interrupt the ball before it hits you.
The situation is while a Blanka ball is coming at you, you jab him in mid-air. Then, while Blanka’s flipping backwards in his recover animation, you cancel that jab into a dan knee (which will whiff) solely to close space. My guess is that Blanka will recover before Dan with enough time to reversal ball all of Dan’s options except ex koryu. I really hope I’m wrong.
Against a blocked ball out in the open, I still haven’t found anything that punishes Blanka at all. Dash -> ex danku comes so close :shake:
Yeah, that’s right EC. I should have been clearer. And when I said “should be able” to jab Blanka out of Blanka ball when he does it from half screen, what I meant was that you can in fact always use a properly timed jab to knock Blanka out of horizontal ball, but when he does it from midscreen you should be able to press jab on reaction. I usually can.
According to the latest (and a little more sensible, imo) match-up chart posted on some random Japanese website, Dan’s matchups are:
[LIST]
[]Horrible (2-8): Honda, Blanka, Boxer
[]Bad (3-7): Ryu, Chun, Gief, Guile, Sagat, Dictator, Rufus, Akuma, Seth, Feilong, Cammy
[]Uphill(4-6): Ken, Gouken, Rose
[]Even(5-5): Dhalsim, Claw, ELF, Viper, Abel, Sakura, Gen
[/LIST]
Thoughts?
I don’t think Dhalsim is an even match-up. He’s not so scary upclose and his stamina is bad, but simple fires along with s.FP and j.FP makes things very hard for Dan to close space, even with his good dash. I think 4-6 at best.
I’m also not too sure about Claw being even, but I personally suck at playing against the character, especially online, so I dunno.
I don’t think Feilong and Cammy are 3-7. I haven’t seen too many good ones, but neither are really frightening upclose. At worst 4-6, but I’d go so far to say that these are even matchups.
Can’t you just lk Dan Kick over Yoga Fire? What’s he gonna do, counterpoke through the crazy priority of Dan Knee? And aerial Dan Knee should beat all of his air-to-air as well.
the list gives the general idea…and I somewhat agree with it…
if it was me…just based on experiences…2-8 and 3-7 are the same thing…so when I look all the matchups that would require spectacular play and opponent mistakes…just to win…its heartbreaking…one day…I hope…dan can be 5-5 material across the board…Im not even asking to be a favorite lmao…
the 3 toughest matchups for me are honda,chun,blanka…I mean a chun with a brain…just totally makes you look bad by stuffing all your attacks…blanka and honda…they dont have to be good to win…
On the even matchups…I think everyone except fuerte is the favorite against dan…they should have dan beat 6-4… fuerte vs dan…is a toss up…
I dont fear cammy at all…havent fought an awesome one yet…but ive fought decent ones…I think fei is a 6-4 on dan…he has a better arsenal…and a good fei can put ur hp low real fast…
the more I try and progress with dan…the more it hurts…because i feel like im almost at his limit…and im getting wrecked by players way worse than me…maybe its my own fault for maining him lol…but SF4 is starting to take its toll on me
This is definitely not true. The difference between these two is as big as the difference between 6-4 and 7-3. For example, Abel is 6-4 versus Sagat. This is a hard matchup, but if you play smarter than your opponent, you will win. A 7-3 like Abel vs Zangief is heartbreaking by comparison. All Abel can to is Tornado Throw in this matchup, that’s IT. He can NEVER roll ever, because Zangief is going to be trying to SPD. He can’t try ANY close normals because Zangief can reversal SPD everything, which catches him out of everything he might try to do to get away besides FADC back. For an 8-2 matchup, look at Seth vs. Zangief. Zangief literally cannot get close to Seth because of teleport, wall jump, sonic boom, and dhalsim pokes. His lariats are easily punished, Seth’s SPD beats Zangief’s, Seth can shoryuken jump-ins… Zangief has almost NO options. All he can do is sit there and die.
im not talking about other chars and their matchups…I meant a 2-8 and 3-7 feels like the same when im playing with dan…
plus all these characters you mentioned…have favorable matchups…and its not bad if they have 1 or 2 crappy matchups thats the world of street fighter…
I dont think im putting dan as a favorite in any matches if its 2 skilled players…so for dan to be the underdog in pretty much every matchup is whats heartbreaking to me…
Eh, I don’t disagree too seriously with the general thrust of this, namely that Dan is kinda crappy, although I think some individual matchups aren’t as bad as is listed. Here’s how I’d probably put it right now:
[LIST]
[]Horrible (2-8): Honda, Blanka
[]Bad (3-7): Ryu, Chun, Gief, Sagat, Dictator
[]Uphill(4-6): Ken, Gouken, Boxer, Dhalsim, Rufus, Guile, Akuma, Seth
[]Even(5-5): Claw, Fuerte, Viper, Abel, Sakura, Gen, Fei, Cammy, Rose
[/LIST]
Maybe Boxer is 3-7, but I don’t think he’s as bad as Blanka and Honda. I think Dan is fairly crappy, but I think that matchup chart kinda overstates his level of crappiness.