My tier list for playing as dan since forever high level and going to tournaments.
Rufus - 4:6
Akuma - 0:10 <-- seriously air/ground fb/teleport x3 any direction :d
Abel - 4:6
Bison - 3:7
Balrog - 3:7
Ryu - 4:6
Chun-Li - 2:8
Ibuki - 4:6
Zangief - 1:9
Honda - 1:9
Blanka - 3:7
Sagat - 4:6
Guile - 3:7
T.Hawk - 4:6
Juri - 4:6
El Fuerte - 4:6
Dhalsim - 1:9
Cammy - 4:6
Fei Long - 3:7
Ken - 4:6
Seth - 2:8
C.Viper - 2:8
Deejay - 5:5
Dudley - 4:6
Adon - 5:5
Cody - 5:5
Gouken - 3:7
Vega - 3:7
Rose - 2:8
Gen - 5:5
Hakan - 5:5
Guy - 4:6
Makoto - 5:5
Sakura - 4:6
i’m not so sure about the Elf match up being a bad one… my friend is a great Elf, and he struggles… The thing is, he can’t afford to trade(low health) and it’s not that had to get out of his trap. Focus his attacks, back dash>>Ex-Dankyu PUNISHES him bad. You can knock him out of his wall jumps with a quick jump lk>Dankyu. 5-5 sure, but i can’t see it 4-6… I’m no pro, but i don’t feel pressured in this fight.
Akuma is broken against Dan… it’s the most FRUSTRATING game of chasey you could play… i played 3 ranked game last night, in a row against 3 different Akuma’s… all ran away and fire balled the whole match… i TRIED to be patient and taunt them into attacking but to no avail… I won the odd round when i DID get in, but damn… that was a lot of work for little reward. Ultra 1 in this match up gives us an opening IMO, managed to land that a few times(especially in response to their Super/Ultra)
I’m also not sure Fei Long is a 3-7… i’ve only faced one player, (and he was much better then me - 4500 points) but he struggled to win. Maybe he wasn’t used to Dan, but he only won in 3 close rounds 2-1. i never felt ‘outmatched’ here. He has to approach, and we have tools to deal with that, and we wanna be in close. Again back dash>>EX Dankyu hurts him.
Really Zangief 1-9??? I haven’t been outmatched by Gief YET. I’ve won several easy matches against Gief. He ONLY has Green hand to approach, we can punish Lariat, and Gadoukan is effective against him(he’s slow, and has short jumps). I think it’s one of the few matchups i look FORWARD too…
Now, do i just not know what i’m talking about, or what?
1-9 might be a bit of an exaggeration, but it is definitely in Zangief’s favor. He can walk forward to approach, that is all he needs to do against Dan. Gadouken’s can be good, but Zangief can hit Dan’s hand because it extends so far forward with Gadouken. Zangief’s footsies beat Dan’s footsies. Even with Zangief’s nerfs, I still would say 6-4 sounds like giving too much credit to Dan. Dan can’t zone well, or poke that well. This is basically a matchup Zangief is looking for. I am not sure how Zangief’s new Ultra changes the matchup, but I don’t see this matchup changing that much from SF4 other than Zangief doing less damage.
Akuma matchup sucks, but runaway fireball isn’t really the worst they can do. Even if Dan does get in, Akuma is better than Dan up close. Akuma has a way better wakeup game than Dan. Akuma’s pokes in general just seem a lot better. I think his sweep is faster than Dan’s cr.mk. You struggle to get in, and even when you do get in, Akuma still seem to have the advantage.
A comment on Zangief’s new Ultra, I was worried it would make the matchup a lot harder by messing up Dan’s ability to jump in safely on Zangief with the Knee, but thus far I haven’t noticed a problem at all. The few times I’ve fought a Zangief using Siberian Blizzard, and he’s tried it against my Knee, the little hop the Knee does has avoided the move entirely, even when I thought he’d be close enough to catch me. Unfortunate for poor Zangy. 
Heh score, we’ve still effectively removed his Lariat AA option then.
Speaking of AA you can use Haoh Gadouken to hit people out of the air quite easily due to its pretty massive size and relatively slow speed. Perfect distance is if they stupidly try to jump over a regular Gadouken around half screen away (so end of HP Gadouken’s effective range), even from this distance you can land a LP KRK easily but doing a Haoh Gadouken during the peak of their jump is guaranteed to catch them it seems :bgrin:
re people mentioned that Dan should be played like Ryo from KoF, it’s funny that Capcom put Dan in the game to make fun of Ryo, because he was so similar to Ryu.
he was nat made to make fun of ryo but made to make fun of robert
What do you guys generally tend to do when it comes to knee pressure? Because as of late I’m just getting thrown out of it. s.MP > Knee > s.MP has been getting me thrown, so ive been opting for s.MP > Knee > c. LK > Knee instead. Any tips would be appreciated.
On a separate subject, is there any particular strategy to landing his crossup on wakeup? After playing Adon and having one of the best in the game, and going back to Dan’s made me realize how bad his is (or how bad i am at landing it)
Edit: Been also trying to experiment with Aerial HK Danku if there is any use of it whatsoever. I’ve found the following:
The last hit of Air MK and HK Danku Juggles, so you can follow that up with EX Koryu fadc U2 in the corner.
N. jump HK Danku will raise your height slightly, and can sometimes make LP shoryus whiff and you’ll land on the other side of them. (Extremely Risky, doubt its of any real use)
Anti Air EX Gadouken > ground HK Danku (last hit only) connects against Zangief (Might work on other characters)
I use it to run away, to build meter when I’m jumping fireballs, and to mess up timing and distance on my jumps in order to bait. Also to tag back dash happy types, and the odd jump back.
You gotta judge your advantage after blocked Knee, how close it was blocked and whether they were standing or crouching. Also need to read your opponents when it comes to this stuff, after two blocked Knees you should have an understanding for what they’ll do (keep blocking, throw, c.LP, throw tech (c.LK), spam reversal, etc.) so you’ll know how to counter what you’re expecting them to do. Trying to throw them straight off is probably the safest way of testing the water, if you succeed then keep throwing until they learn then it’s time to start mixing it up. If they tech your throw (or you end up teching) then you can try nj.HP > s.MP xx Knee combo to get back in their face, risk an LP KRK or do HP KRK FADC or back dash and try to catch them with a surprise EX Dankuu. If they don’t block it up close then using c.LP/c.LK xx Knee is a good way to keep in their face and hopefully won’t get you thrown or could try c.LK xx EX Dankuu. Further back when the end of the Knee’s animation is getting block if you’re still in range you can try s.MP xx Knee, if s.MP is out of range to be close then c.MP/c.MK xx Knee or HK Dankuu will allow you to push up again. You can also try to catch them trying to tech, walk forward a bit then KRK FADC > fun. Those are just a few things that come to mind, just need to remember not to use the slower normals when up close and save them for when the Knee is blocked later.
I basically have 3 ways of easily landing a cross-up:
- Back throw > walk back a bit > j.MK
- s.MP xx Knee > dash > j.MK (if they quick recover but can be caught by reversals)
- Any knock down in the corner that gives you enough time to safely cross-up
Yeah, Air MK/HK Dankuu are just too unsafe to warrant using, need to have a pretty clear read of your opponent to get away with it.
If you manage to snag an AA EX Gadouken (both hits) in the corner you can juggle into Haoh, pretty tricky though.
You gotta judge your advantage after blocked Knee, how close it was blocked and whether they were standing or crouching. Also need to read your opponents when it comes to this stuff, after two blocked Knees you should have an understanding for what they’ll do (keep blocking, throw, c.LP, throw tech (c.LK), spam reversal, etc.) so you’ll know how to counter what you’re expecting them to do. Trying to throw them straight off is probably the safest way of testing the water, if you succeed then keep throwing until they learn then it’s time to start mixing it up. If they tech your throw (or you end up teching) then you can try nj.HP > s.MP xx Knee combo to get back in their face, risk an LP KRK or do HP KRK FADC or back dash and try to catch them with a surprise EX Dankuu. If they don’t block it up close then using c.LP/c.LK xx Knee is a good way to keep in their face and hopefully won’t get you thrown or could try c.LK xx EX Dankuu. Further back when the end of the Knee’s animation is getting block if you’re still in range you can try s.MP xx Knee, if s.MP is out of range to be close then c.MP/c.MK xx Knee or HK Dankuu will allow you to push up again. You can also try to catch them trying to tech, walk forward a bit then KRK FADC > fun. Those are just a few things that come to mind, just need to remember not to use the slower normals when up close and save them for when the Knee is blocked later.
I basically have 3 ways of easily landing a cross-up:
- Back throw > walk back a bit > j.MK
- s.MP xx Knee > dash > j.MK (if they quick recover but can be caught by reversals)
- Any knock down in the corner that gives you enough time to safely cross-up
Yeah, Air MK/HK Dankuu are just too unsafe to warrant using, need to have a pretty clear read of your opponent to get away with it.
If you manage to snag an AA EX Gadouken (both hits) in the corner you can juggle into Haoh, pretty tricky though.
saikyo all day
general matchup guide
-correctly spaced lk knee will beat out most moves on wakeup. do these early to show opponent you can do them. do this until they find a way to counter.
-lk knee will lose to many ex-wakeup moves. bait these ex-reversals. (focus then dash as they rise, or stand there) ultra if you have it.
-crossup frequently against safe opponents. (j.mk s.mp lk.knee safe on block)
-if lk knee is blocked, throw after. if opponent techs use c.lp c.lp c.lp block string mixup (tick, backdash knees, ex gadouken, dash forward grab, or zone with s.mk)
-zone with s.mk, c.mk hp.gadouken
-backdash a lot
-super taunt can be used to ‘catch’ opponent specials and some pokes into U1. (similar to scar cancel). don’t use unless you have a good read.
-taunt often
If the lk knee is blocked, and you are in range for a close s.mp i think going for the knee frametrap till it ends is better than the blockstring. this way you push your opponent towards the corner and get some guranteed chip, as well as a better mixup game than the traditional blockstring.
Gouken was made to eat the knee trap. I dont know if he has any new tricks in SSF4, (I only have a few online matches under my belt). Once you circumnavigate the fb spam, you can pretty much cr.mk > knee until he has ultra, just pay attention to the ultra meter. You can almost be 100% sure once that Ultra is ready they will bust it out, expecting you to continue the onslaught.
For the love of God someone tell me how to compete with Ibuki, Ive been able to learn to play most of the new characters, but I am suprised I am not double perfected with every Ibuki I face, its giving me nightmares of when I first started playing blanka in vanilla.
I cant seem to land anything, She has a good keep away game and very deceptive attacks. So any strategies are most welcome. T.hawk, Adon, Dudely Deejay, Cody, Juri, Makato (havent played a hakkan yet) Ive had no problem adjusting to their play style. Ibuki is killin me.
Ibuki is so annoying, a crappy one can win just by cheesing kunai all day long and catching you with the odd surprise Neck Breaker. Neck Breakers are unsafe but they’re not unsafe enough for a decent punish (which sucks considering it’s fast, goes full screen, hits low and breaks Focus), go for a simple throw after you block it.
Her Dragon Kick or whatever it’s called is kinda like Dudley’s Jet Upper, can be tricky to punish properly and annoyingly has good priority/invincibility too. Not sure but think it will beat Knee, you’ll have to try Knee up close and hopefully it’ll miss but then if they just crouch block Knee will miss them 
Spin Kicks also seem pretty safe, in fact I believe that MK version is even on block without the follow-up and some Ibuki will do two in a row knowing that fact.
Also another annoying thing she has is that command dash that goes through you, dunno what it is but even when standing she seems to recover quicker that you. I see her dash past me and try to throw her but eat a c.HK, WTF?
Her overhead is very slow but recovers practically instantaneously, this is some retarded shit IMO since after blocking high it seems impossible to block low quick enough for the likely c.HK follow-up (maybe it’s just lag).
That stupid penguin kick thing is also made safe by kunai, think she’s too far away for EX KRK to catch up to her too and the EX version makes her bounce behind you too (both hit high).
Also be aware of her vortex after a Neck Breaker; cross-up kunai into target combo xx Neck Breaker, rince and repeat.
We all know the main issue with her is getting close and TBH I don’t really have any good suggestions how to do it Try jumping over kunai and you’ll most likely eat a random Neck Breaker on landing, Focus kunai and you’ll eat a Neck Breaker, only real option is to approach slowly like you would vs Blanka.
I was pretty happy to see the character join the cast, but now she just pisses me off immensely 
Hakan is pretty easy, abuse Knee and you’ve won 
Just be careful of when he’s oiled then he can SPD you “immediately” after a blocked Knee. If he has Oil Coaster (720 grab Ultra) Knee on wake-up, if he has Oil Combo Hold (anti-air) then do something like a s.MP xx Knee on wake-up instead.
So basically I can expect to lose against Ibuki a hell of a lot until I get used to her, just as was the case with blanka/honda.
Yeah, I think you’ll have better luck against a good Ibuki vs a bad one since the good ones actually play her rush down (like she’s meant to be played) rather than like a ghetto-Akuma pussy
I think dan has a problem in general against runaways or characters that turtle and can punish from turtling (charge characters like blanka, honda, as well as 360 throwers like gief and thawk). If they really close, it’s so hard to get in and do any damage without getting countered. I really do wish he had an overhead, I hardly think it would make him overpowered
I pretty much never win against honda and blanka. I slow play it but really, you have to get inside and throw out strings. Mix grabs and lows and watch out for your own crossups as they seem to lose against their AA. Gadoken can be used here, but it’s so tough to time it w/o being punished or whiffing. It’s insanely hard to beat Honda in the grabbing game with his special grab. in the end, they are just bad match ups so don’t feel bad if you lose.
With Ibuki, I use Danku to fly over her slides. For Kunai, air danku isn’t that bad or even air taunt. With her, let her make all the moves and counter her. Most ibuki players will spam kunai/slide or rush. Punish the sliding kick with a throw and block. I probably wouldn’t focus much against her KRK her on wakeups works as does a gadoken. Once you get inside going Aerial isn’t a bad idea. You will probably trade on a danku to her AA kicks, but she will get less dmg on you with a single hit.
But these are my experiences. I’m probably 66% win rate against Ibuki with only a handful of matches. I’m about a 13% win rate against honda and blanka if even that high.