In this post on the Long Island MvC2 blog:
It shows a technique that Josh360 and Sanford used to take back the initiative when they were getting rushed down. Let me know what you guys think of the post. This isn’t anything new but I never have seen anyone talk about this little strategy.
that example you put up doesn’t work. player A has msp and player B has msp. Player A knocks down player B and both people have magnus on point. Well if player A times his hit properly, player B never jumps up EVER. Player B gets hit for free every time if your execution is good. The only way that counter works is if there’s bigger room for the FS like if the FS happens near the corner but not in it or if the other player miss times their c.lk.
Doing that hld up counter is ALL RISK. Your banking on your opponent not timing their normal properly because you have to dedicate to hld up.
There IS NO reversal in mvc2. Any meaty attack will hit the opponent every time if you time it right. Since there is no reversal, you see players try the FASTEST option. either jup or fast super if they have it.
also, I believe that every character in marvel has a different jump speed. Its already been proven that cable reacts differently to block stun than magneto. I wouldn’t be surprised if characters had different NJup speeds.
that strategy above is good if you block low first, then nj when you visually confirm that he is not going low at the first possible frame, then your nj will beat their “not immediate” d+short a lot of the times…bascially if you break down the very first part of the mixup the options for him are:
If he does option 1, then you block the low and the game goes on…
If he does option 2, then you ducked for a frame and then nj/sj out of whatever he is doing…
I respect your opinion but I’d like to say the following:
[1] If it doesn’t work, what was going on in this match. No one is perfect, we all get away with stuff.
[2] I didn’t guarantee that this works 100% of the time but it can be helpful. In fighting games, you may need to take risks
[3] You can measure distance and see if they are going to get to you fast enough.
[4] Magneto c lk is one frame, in the beginning of the match, I believe most of the characters can dodge the c lk by holding up.
More research needs to be done to evaluate other c lk etc. Cable’s c lp seems to beat jumps because it hits higher. When both Magneto and Cable do the switch trick, despite the fact that magnetos’ c lk is faster then cables c lp frame wise, they trade hits.
[5] There isn’t a reversal in mvc2, just Assist Alpha Counter :yawn:
[6] Of course a meaty will beat out any attempts to jump etc. I am not disputing that. We didn’t make claims that this is going to pwn every c lk in the world. You can anticipate my jump and punish me.
You brought up some good points and I agree with most of them.
i’m apparently wrong on this lol!!! sorry for trying to shit all over your thread. I have learned a vital lesson today. I will test everything before I post =p
i tested it pretty thoroughly earlier and you’re right and so is spider dan. He had mentioned something to me a few days ago and I thought the opposite is true. I’m sure he’ll come across this post.
The thing is, I have hit people low after flying screen knock down and I didn’t get it today @ all. Tried it vs a human and vs cpu, no difference. There’s a player in new orleans who constantly complains about this and he swears you can tag them low, I’ve seen it. I’ve been hit low while trying to hold up.
truth be told, I think there’s something funky going on with this. I’m going to experiment with this for a good while. Thnx for the input and if you have ANY OTHER tips, plz post them!
i think it depends on who’s c.lk it is
also it may have to do with the mvc2 1/5 frame cycle, like maybe you can’t jump out 1/5 of the time if you get up exactly on that frame?
…
I dunno exactly what to say. I think most people hold n.jump in wakeup situations… who is just low blocking and hoping they don’t get mixed up or thrown?
It’s really good advice… but not 100% safe… and I think most people do it at least sometimes if not most of the time.
Some flying screen situations (many many of them from an air combo) leave the victim recovering LATER than you… and you can stick out an attack ahead of time… that cannot be n.jumped over even if n.jump comes out in negative 2 frames…
This technique works not so good after magneto fierce fierce combo wakeup, but better after magneto fierce fierce, roundhouse roundhouse combo wakeup because the timing is different. Even after fp fp rh rh wakeup combo its still not safe tho. I think Row does crossup trijump lk, lk or crossup trijump rh as they wake up to snuff this option on wakeup.
any overhead string into assist followed by more attacks is a shitty situation that will happen.
I just want to clear a few things up on this tactic:
1st, nj straight up can be hit by magneto even in the very beginning on the match ONLY if done manually at the correct timing on the c.lk.
2nd, try jump counters this and prevents the character from jumping when timed correctly.
3rd, during the flying screen situation there is one solid way to land c.lk on someone trying to hold up, the moment that you can dash on the ground with magneto, do it so that your rubbing up against the character waking up from fs, and time the lk as they wake up, it cannot be jumped.
There is only one problem with this that sanford exploited and that i do now too, when put into block stun, you cannot jump immediatly after the first short, if i call any assit and you blocked my first short your character will only standup then being exposed to the second short.
Any questions from anyone on this feel free to ask.
That’s true I have been hit by the delayed 2nd short before…also whiff tri jump then throw will beat it…the tactic is not failsafe but it eliminates a lot of their primary options, unfortunately Magnus has a lot of secondary options lol…good shit pointing that out.
ughhhhhhhhh
Its a overall good strategy, but like one said the window of oppurtunity has to be pretty big (considering the fast pace). Most Magneto’s will attempt rushdown, then move around (especially if its a MSP mirror match). That Mags crouched coming in, which allowed the counter rushdown. But most Mags will airdash or sj after trying an attack. So trying that may open you up to another Psylocke assist. But most likely what will happen in that scenario is that you and your opponent (including both assist) will all be cancelled out, meaning all of you will be knocked to the ground because of simultaneous assist. Its great if you have a Mags opponent who tends to try cr.lk/Psylocke repeatedly. Good stuff though…
^^^
A ‘good’ Magzzz is one who can react to a small opening as if it were a “pretty big” window of opportunity. So, it’s all relative. You’re right though it’s certainly situational-- as to whether its best to try to counter tri or to wait it out and see what your options are in the next rush.
Fact is, you can only block so long ( not very long :] )
Yeah, your Mags has to be pretty damn good because Psylocke is just waiting to show her ass again right after she just came out. So, your timing and execution have to be near perfect because you dont want to eat Psylocke pop-up trying to counter. It was noted that its not a strategy to depend on, but its helpful in those situations though. Im thinking that may be more useful against Cable trying quick cr.lk poke xx ahvb. Cable isnt teaming up with Psylocke anytime soon, and Caps doesnt have the same effect as Psylocke. Or even Sentinel trying cr.lk xx fly lk,hk you may be able to punish Sent before he can cancel to fly. So, I would try that strategy against teams that dont have pop-up assist like Psylocke.