Consensus matchup chart

Thelo · February 1, 2010, 8:31pm

Here is a matchup chart I made to try to aggregate the matchup rating opinions of most players, with strong players getting more weight in their opinion. The numbers come from all over this forum, and from personal discussions with other players. I try to keep it updated as I get new opinions.

Each A-B matchup rating means the average number of games that a strong player of character A would win against an equally skilled player of character B, in a hypothetical series of 10 games. For instance, if Ryu has a rating of 7 against E. Honda, that means that the Ryu player would win 7 games out of 10, on average (so Ryu has advantage over E. Honda).

Feel free to comment and offer corrections to the chart.

Last updated 2010-02-05:


        Ryu Ken E.H Chu Bla Zan Gui Dha T.H Cam Fei Dee Bal Veg Sag M.B    Total
Ryu     -   6   7.5 6   6   6   5.5 4   6   7   6   6.5 4.5 4   4.5 5.5    85
Ken     4   -   7.5 5.5 6   6   4.5 4   7   6.5 6   5   4   4   4.5 6      80.5
E.Honda 2.5 2.5 -   4.5 6   7.5 4   5.5 7.5 7   6.5 3.5 5   6   4.5 5.5    78
Chun Li 4   4.5 5.5 -   5.5 6   5   6   4.5 5.5 3.5 5   4.5 4.5 4.5 5.5    74
Blanka  4   4   4   4.5 -   7   6.5 5   6.5 5   4   3   3   4   4.5 5      70
Zangief 4   4   2.5 4   3   -   3.5 4.5 5   4   4.5 3.5 6   4   3   5.5    61
Guile   4.5 5.5 6   5   3.5 6.5 -   3.5 6.5 7   5   5.5 3   3.5 5   4.5    74.5
Dhalsim 6   6   4.5 4   5   5.5 6.5 -   4   3.5 6.5 6   5   4   7   4.5    78
T.Hawk  4   3   2.5 5.5 3.5 5   3.5 6   -   3   4   3.5 4   3   4   4      58.5
Cammy   3   3.5 3   4.5 5   6   3   6.5 7   -   5   4   5.5 5   4   4      69
Fei Long4   4   3.5 6.5 6   5.5 5   3.5 6   5   -   3   3.5 3.5 5.5 4.5    69
Dee Jay 3.5 5   6.5 5   7   6.5 4.5 4   6.5 6   7   -   4   4.5 5   6      81
Balrog  5.5 6   5   5.5 7   4   7   5   6   4.5 6.5 6   -   5.5 6   5.5    85
Vega    6   6   4   5.5 6   6   6.5 6   7   5   6.5 5.5 4.5 -   5.5 4      84
Sagat   5.5 5.5 5.5 5.5 5.5 7   5   3   6   6   4.5 5   4   4.5 -   5      77.5
M.Bison 4.5 4   4.5 4.5 5   4.5 5.5 5.5 6   6   5.5 4   4.5 6   5   -      75

Sorted by total points:


        Ryu Ken E.H Chu Bla Zan Gui Dha T.H Cam Fei Dee Bal Veg Sag M.B    Total
Ryu     -   6   7.5 6   6   6   5.5 4   6   7   6   6.5 4.5 4   4.5 5.5    85
Balrog  5.5 6   5   5.5 7   4   7   5   6   4.5 6.5 6   -   5.5 6   5.5    85
Vega    6   6   4   5.5 6   6   6.5 6   7   5   6.5 5.5 4.5 -   5.5 4      84
Dee Jay 3.5 5   6.5 5   7   6.5 4.5 4   6.5 6   7   -   4   4.5 5   6      81
Ken     4   -   7.5 5.5 6   6   4.5 4   7   6.5 6   5   4   4   4.5 6      80.5
E.Honda 2.5 2.5 -   4.5 6   7.5 4   5.5 7.5 7   6.5 3.5 5   6   4.5 5.5    78
Dhalsim 6   6   4.5 4   5   5.5 6.5 -   4   3.5 6.5 6   5   4   7   4.5    78
Sagat   5.5 5.5 5.5 5.5 5.5 7   5   3   6   6   4.5 5   4   4.5 -   5      77.5
M.Bison 4.5 4   4.5 4.5 5   4.5 5.5 5.5 6   6   5.5 4   4.5 6   5   -      75
Guile   4.5 5.5 6   5   3.5 6.5 -   3.5 6.5 7   5   5.5 3   3.5 5   4.5    74.5
Chun Li 4   4.5 5.5 -   5.5 6   5   6   4.5 5.5 3.5 5   4.5 4.5 4.5 5.5    74
Blanka  4   4   4   4.5 -   7   6.5 5   6.5 5   4   3   3   4   4.5 5      70
Cammy   3   3.5 3   4.5 5   6   3   6.5 7   -   5   4   5.5 5   4   4      69
Fei Long4   4   3.5 6.5 6   5.5 5   3.5 6   5   -   3   3.5 3.5 5.5 4.5    69
Zangief 4   4   2.5 4   3   -   3.5 4.5 5   4   4.5 3.5 6   4   3   5.5    61
T.Hawk  4   3   2.5 5.5 3.5 5   3.5 6   -   3   4   3.5 4   3   4   4      58.5

2010-02-05 changelist

Spoiler

Balrog v Chun
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 5-5
MiloDC: 6-4

2010-02-05 new rating: 5.5-4.5

Balrog v Fei
Orig chart: 6.5-3.5
Aqua Snake: 6.5-3.5
Jumpsuit: 7-3

Keep 6.5-3.5 for now

Balrog v Guile
Orig chart: 4-6
Battosai: 3-7
IrrepressibleGuile: 3-7

2010-02-05 new rating: 3-7

Balrog v Ken
Orig chart (damdai): 6-4
1hitparry: 5-5 or 4.5-5.5

2010-02-05 rating: 5.5-4.5

Zero1_: 6-4

2010-02-05 new rating: 6-4

Balrog v Blanka
Orig chart: 6-4
Empirion: 7-3

2010-02-02 rating: 6.5-3.5

BlueTallCans: 8-2
Decoy: 7-3

2010-02-05 new rating: 7-3

Balrog v Sagat
Orig chart: 6-4
orochizoolander: 6.5-3.5

Stay at 6-4 for now

Blanka v Cammy
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
Empirion: 4-6
Noriega: 6-4 (unsure)
BlueTallCans: 4.5-5.5
Decoy: 5.5-4.5
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 5-5

Blanka v Chun
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
Empirion: 4-6

2010-02-02 rating: Stay at 4.5-5.5 for now

skankin garbage: 4-6
BlueTallCans: 4.5-5.5
Decoy: 4.5-5.5
MiloDC: 6-4

2010-02-05 rating: Stay at 4.5-5.5

Blanka v Deejay
Orig chart (BruceLB): 4-6
Empirion: 3-7
BlueTallCans: 3-7
Decoy: 3-7

2010-02-05 new rating: 3-7

Blanka v Dhalsim
Orig chart: 5.5-4.5
Empirion: 4-6

2010-02-02 rating: 5-5

BlueTallCans: 5-5
Decoy: 5-5

Keep 5-5

Blanka v Fei
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
Empirion: 4-6
Aqua Snake: 4-6

New rating: 4-6

BlueTallCans: 4-6
Decoy: 4.5-5.5
Jumpsuit: 4.5-5.5

Keep 4-6

Blanka v Guile
Orig chart: 6.5-3.5
BlueTallCans: 5-5 (!)
Decoy: 6.5-3.5
IrrepressibleGuile: 6-4

Keep 6.5-3.5

Blanka v Honda
Orig chart (Thelo, EA Megaman, Kuroppi): 4-6
BlueTallCans: 4-6
Decoy: 4.5-5.5

Keep 4-6

Blanka v Ken
Orig chart: 4-6
BlueTallCans: 4-6
Empirion: 4-6 (?)
Decoy: 4.5-5.5

Keep 4-6

Blanka v M.Bison
Orig chart: 5-5
Empirion: 5-5 (?)
BlueTallCans: 5-5
Decoy: 6-4

Keep 5-5 for now

Blanka v Sagat
Orig chart: 5-5
Empirion: 4-6

Stay at 5-5 for now

BlueTallCans: 4-6
Decoy: 5-5
orochizoolander: 4.5-5.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Blanka v Ryu
Orig chart: 4-6
Empirion: 4-6 (?)
BlueTallCans: 3-7
Decoy: 4-6
SteveTren: 4-6

Keep 4-6

Blanka v T.Hawk
Orig chart (JigglyNorris?): 6.5-3.5
Kuroppi: 7-3
BlueTallCans: 6.5-3.5
Decoy: 7-3

2010-02-05 rating: Keep 6.5-3.5

Blanka v Vega
Orig chart: 4-6
BlueTallCans: 4-6
Decoy: 3.5-6.5

Keep 4-6

Blanka v Zangief
Orig chart: 7-3
BlueTallCans: 7-3
Decoy: 7-3

Keep 7-3

Cammy v Chun
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
Norieaga: 4.5-5.5
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5

Cammy v Deejay
Orig chart: 4-6
Norieaga: 4-6
MiloDC: 2-8 (!)

Keep 4-6 for now

Cammy v Dhalsim
Orig chart: 6-4
Norieaga: 6-4
MiloDC: 7.5-2.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 6.5-3.5

Cammy v Fei
Orig chart (detailed below): 5.5-4.5
-Norieaga (old): 6-4
-Aqua Snake: 5.5-4.5
-Eventhubs guy: 5-5
-Sirlin: "About even"
Norieaga (new rating): 8-2 or 7.5-2.5
Aqua Snake (same rating): 5.5-4.5

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

MiloDC: 4.5-5.5
Jumpsuit: 4-6

2010-02-05 rating: 5-5

Cammy v Guile
Orig chart: 3-7
Silver Rain 007: 3.5-6.5
Noriega: 3.5-6.5

New rating: 3.5-6.5

IrrepressibleGuile: 3-7
MiloDC: 2.5-7.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 3-7

Cammy v Honda
Orig chart (Thelo): 3.5-6.5
Silver Rain 007: 3-7 (or worse)
Noriega: 2-8
Kuroppi: 2-8
MiloDC: 2.5-7.5

2010-02-05 rating: 3-7

Cammy v Ken
Orig chart: 3.5-6.5
Zero1_: 4-6
Noriega: 3-7
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5

Keep 3.5-6.5

Cammy v M.Bison
Orig chart: 4-6
Norieaga: 5-5
VirtuaFighterFour: 2-8
MiloDC: 4-6

Keep 4-6

Cammy v Sagat
Orig chart: 5-5
Norieaga: 4.5-5.5

2010-02-02 rating: 4.5-5.5

orochizoolander: 3.5-6.5
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 4-6

Cammy v T.Hawk
Orig chart: 7-3
Norieaga: 7-3
Kuroppi: 7-3
MiloDC: 7-3

Cammy v Ryu
Orig chart: 3.5-6.5
Noriega: 3-7
MiloDC: 2-8
SteveTren: 3.5-6.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 3-7

Cammy v Vega
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
Noriega: 5-5

2010-02-02 rating: 5-5

MiloDC: 5.5-4.5

Keep 5-5 for now

Cammy v Zangief
Orig chart: 7-3
rcaido: 6-4
Norieaga: 6-4
Kuroppi: 6-4

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

MiloDC: 6-4

Chun v Deejay
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 5-5
MiloDC: 4.5-5.5

Keep 5-5

Chun v Dhalsim
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 6-4
MiloDC: 6.5-3.4

Keep 6-4

Chun v Fei
Orig chart: 5.5-4.5
skankin garbage: 4-6
Aqua Snake: 3.5-6.5

2010-02-02 rating: 4-6

MiloDC: 3-7
Jumpsuit: 3-7

2010-02-05 new rating: 3.5-6.5

Chun v Guile
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 5-5
Battosai: 6-4
IrrepressibleGuile: 6-4
MiloDC: 4-6

Keep 5-5

Chun v Honda
Orig chart: 5.5-4.5
-Thelo: 4.5-5.5
-Zass: 4-6
-skankin garbage: 6-4
-arstal: 6.5-3.5
EA Megaman: 5.5-4.5
Kuroppi: 5.5-4.5
MiloDC: 6-4

Stay at 5.5-4.5

Chun v Ken
Orig chart: 5.5-4.5
skankin garbage: 4-6

2010-02-02 rating: 4.5-5.5

Zero1_: 5-5
MiloDC: 4-6

Keep 4.5-5.5

Chun v M.Bison
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 6-4
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5 (!)

Chun v Ryu
Orig chart: 4-6
skankin garbage: 3.5-6.5
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5
SteveTren: 4-6

Keep 4-6

Chun v Sagat
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 4-6
orochizoolander: 4-6
MiloDC: 3-7

Keep 4-6

Chun v T.Hawk:
Orig chart (detailed below): 5.5-4.5
-Zass: 4-6 ## removed vote
-JigglyNorris: 4.5-5.5
-Eventhubs guy: 5-5
-skankin garbage: 6-4
-Ouroborus: “Chun’s worst matchup”
-gridman: "Hawk splash still kills Chun Li"
VirtuaFighterFour: 6.5-3.5
MiloDC: 2.5-7.5

Controversial, wait for some actual matches

Chun v Vega
Orig chart: 5-5
MiloDC: 3.5-6.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Chun v Zangief
Orig chart (skankin garbage): 7-3
Kuroppi: 5.5-4.5

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

MiloDC: 6-4

Deejay v Fei
Orig chart (BruceLB): 7-3
Aqua Snake: 6-4
Jumpsuit: 7-3

Keep at 7-3

Deejay v Guile
Orig chart: 5-5
IrrepressibleGuile: 4-6

2010-02-05 rating: 4.5-5.5

Deejay v Sagat
Orig chart: 5-5
orochizoolander: 4.5-5.5

Stay at 4.5-5.5 for now

Dhalsim v Fei
Orig chart: 5.5-4.5
Aqua Snake: 6.5-3.5

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

Jumpsuit: 6.5-3.5

2010-02-05 new rating: 6.5-3.5

Dhalsim v Guile
Orig chart: 6-4
Axel Kelly: 7-3

2010-02-02 rating: 6.5-3.5

IrrepressibleGuile: 7-3

Dhalsim v M.Bison
Orig chart: 5-5
VirtuaFighterFour: 5-5 (?)
SweetJohnnyV: 4-6

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Dhalsim v Sagat
Orig chart: 7-3
orochizoolander: 7-3

Fei v Guile
Orig chart: 4-6
Coth_X: “More even than that” (4.5-5.5 ?)
TecmoSuperBowl: “At least even, if not in Fei’s favor” (5-5 to 5.5-4.5)
Aqua Snake: 5-5

2010-02-02 rating: 5-5

IrrepressibleGuile: 5-5
Jumpsuit: 3-7

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Fei v Honda
Orig chart (Thelo): 3.5-6.5
EA Megaman: 3.5-6.5 (?)
Kuroppi: 3.5-6.5
Aqua Snake: 3.5-6.5
Jumpsuit: 4-6

Keep 3.5-6.5

Fei v Ken
Orig chart: 4-6
Aqua Snake: 4-6
Jumpsuit: 4.5-5.5

Fei v M.Bison
Orig chart: 5-5
Percy: "More in Fei’s favour"
Aqua Snake: 5-5
Mackdaddi: 6-4
VirtuaFighterFour: 5-5 (?)

2010-02-02 rating: 5.5-4.5

Jumpsuit: 2-8

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Fei v Ryu
Orig chart: 4-6
Aqua Snake: 4-6
Jumpsuit: 4-6
SteveTren: 4-6

Keep 4-6

Fei v Sagat
Orig chart: 5.5-4.5
-Sirlin: 6-4 (my interpretation)
Aqua Snake: 5.5-4.5
orochizoolander: 4-6
Jumpsuit: 6-4

Stay at 5.5-4.5

Fei v T.Hawk
Orig chart (JigglyNorris?): 6-4
Aqua Snake: 5-5

2010-02-02 rating: 5.5-4.5

Jumpsuit: 7-3

2010-02-05 new rating: 6-4

Fei v Vega
Orig chart: 4-6
Aqua Snake: 4-6
Jumpsuit: 3-7

2010-02-05 new rating: 3.5-6.5

Fei v Zangief
Orig chart: 7-3
rcaido: 5-5
Aqua Snake: 6-4
Kuroppi: 6-4

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

Jumpsuit: 5-5

2010-02-05 rating: 5.5-4.5

Guile v Honda
Orig chart (Thelo): 6-4
EA Megaman: 6-4 (?)
Kuroppi: 6-4
IrrepressibleGuile: 6-4

Stay at 6-4

Guile v Ken
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
IrrepressibleGuile: 4-6

Guile v M.Bison
Orig chart: 5-5
VirtuaFighterFour: 4.5-5.5

2010-02-02 rating: 4.5-5.5

IrrepressibleGuile: 6-4

Guile v Ryu
Orig chart: 5-5
Battosai: 4-6
IrrepressibleGuile: 4-6
SteveTren: 5-5

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Guile v Sagat
Orig chart: 4-6
IrrepressibleGuile: 6-4
Axel Kelly: "Maybe 5-5, no way Guile wins it"
AudioCG: “In Guile’s favor or dead even”

2010-02-02 rating: 5-5

orochizoolander: 4-6

Guile v T.Hawk
Orig chart: 6-4
Kuroppi: 6-4
JigglyNorris: 6-4
gridman: 7-3

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

IrrepressibleGuile: 7-3

2010-02-05 rating: 6.5-3.5

Guile v Vega
Orig chart: 3.5-6.5
Battosai: 2-8
IrrepressibleGuile: 4-6

Stay at 3.5-6.5

Guile v Zangief
Orig chart: 6.5-3.5
Kuroppi: 6.5-3.5
Zero1_: 7-3
IrrepressibleGuile: 7-3

Keep 6.5-3.5

Honda v Sagat
Orig chart (Thelo): 4.5-5.5
orochizoolander: 4.5-5.5

Keep 4.5-5.5

Honda v Zangief
Orig chart (Thelo): 7.5-2.5
Kuroppi: 6.5-3.5 (!)
EA Megaman: 7.5-2.5 (?)
Zero1_: 8-2

Stay at 7.5-2.5

Ken v Sagat
Orig chart: 4.5-5.5
damdai (old): 5-5
orochizoolander: 4.5-5.5

Keep 4.5-5.5

Ken v Zangief
Orig chart: 5-5
Kuroppi: 6-4

2010-02-02 rating: 6-4

Zero1_: 6-4

Keep 6-4

M.Bison v Sagat
Orig chart: 5-5
orochizoolander: 4.5-5.5

Stay at 5-5 for now

M.Bison v T.Hawk
Orig chart: 5-5
VirtuaFighterFour: 7-3
Kuroppi: 4-6
Mackdaddi: 4-6
JigglyNorris: 7-3

2010-02-05 new rating: 6-4

M.Bison v Vega
Orig chart: 6-4
blitzfu: 6-4

Ryu v Zangief
Orig chart: 5-5
Kuroppi: 6-4
Zero1_: 6-4
SteveTren: 6-4

Ryu v Sagat
Orig chart: 5-5
damdai (old): 4-6
orochizoolander: 4.5-5.5
SteveTren: 5-5

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Ryu v Vega
Orig chart: 4-6
SteveTren: 4-6
Ganelon: 4-6
blitzfu: 3-7

Sagat v T.Hawk
Orig chart: 6.5-3.5
Kuroppi: 6.5-3.5
gridman: 5.5-4.5
orochizoolander: 6-4

2010-02-05 new rating: 6-4

Sagat v Vega
Orig chart: 4-6
orochizoolander: 5-5

2010-02-05 new rating: 4.5-5.5

Sagat v Zangief
Orig chart: 7-3
orochizoolander: 7-3

Keep 7-3

IrrepressibleGuile · February 1, 2010, 8:38pm

6-4 guile vs sagat is questioniabe, I’d say guile has a slight advantage in that matchup IMO 6-4 guile

Shari · February 1, 2010, 8:56pm

I find it strange that apparently Vega is higher in ranking in HDR than in ST.

Coth_X · February 1, 2010, 9:57pm

I could go with that, but I feel like fei vs guile is more even than that.

GoldenArch · February 1, 2010, 10:06pm

Hmm…the Cammy players won’t like it. :bgrin:

Percy · February 1, 2010, 10:07pm

Dic - Fei 5-5? I think that matchup is a little more in Fei’s favour, he can really shut Dic down. Thats the only thing that stands out to me straight away… Other than that good job! I like the idea of the whole work in progress thing too

Thelo · February 1, 2010, 10:26pm

I’d appreciate if others can comment on any of the proposed changes on matchups they feel comfortable with, and say if they agree of disagree with the change.

For instance, Guile - Sagat is currently written as 4-6, but IrrepressibleGuile thinks the inverse is true (6-4 in Guile’s favor). Can anyone else weigh in on Guile vs Sagat?

As a dedicated Honda player, I can only rely on others for non-Honda matchups.

Axel_Kelly · February 1, 2010, 10:38pm

You’re insane if you think Guile has an advantage in that match. Maybe a 5-5, but there’s no way Guile wins it.

Also I think Guile vs Sim is more like 3-7. Guile vs Blanka and Claw are down as 3.5-6.5 (which sounds about right), but the Sim fight is harder than both of those

mad_possum · February 1, 2010, 10:50pm

Other than maybe a .5 here or there I’d say you’re Honda match-ups are spot on Thelo (not surprising).

How about some details with the arguments? People are shouting out numbers without giving out reasons. For instance I’d like to hear from Mr.Irrepressible why he thinks the Guile- Sagat match-up (which sucked for Guile in ST) is now in Guile’s favor? Other than the fact that there’s not as many good Sagat players around anymore, LOL.

Silver_Rain_007 · February 1, 2010, 11:11pm

Ummm… well we don’t like lots of things…

I would say though that I can’t justify having Cammy / Guile at 3/7 and Cammy / Honda at 3.5 / 6.5 .

You at least have to flip those and I still personally believe Cammy / Honda is something like 2-8 but that’s just me. The rest of those numbers would be nitpicking for Cammy as far as I’m concerned, in other words, nice job Thelo!

fatboy · February 1, 2010, 11:15pm

I commend the effort in trying to make a chart everyone agrees on. However, I would invest to much time into it.
Its only a matter of time befoe its giong to turn into a epic battle of pointless debate of personal opionion. Good luck though.

EDIT: Seems like I may be wrong. PPL are posting tons of stuff. Looks like I’m the troll this time. My bad.

cheezface_immortal · February 1, 2010, 11:17pm

Thank you. This was my first thought when I saw the chart. Vega was generally considered about 4th in ST behind various random orders of Sagat, Dhalsim, and Balrog. Sirlin made some balance changes in this game and while some characters got better in various ways there were others, including Vega, who got worse. Also remember that he made a few changes (like Zangief cr. fierce for example) just specifically to work against Vega so he basically singled this character out more than any other character.

But the key point I made is that he got worse. I love my fake walldive but if you give the choice of HDR Vega vs. ST Vega it’ll take me .1 seconds to respond ST Vega easy!!! I’ll take stored flipkick and knockdown walldive every day and twice on Sunday’s over HDR Vega and his fake walldive. There is no way in my mind that he could have jumped up 3 spots let along catapult to the #1 spot overall.

I’m curious, Thelo, who were the Vega players you consulted with for this chart? And apparently some of the people playing other characters thought Vega was just a terrible matchup for them suddenly? Like you, for example, as an E. Honda player. You can’t honestly tell me you’d rather play this matchup in ST over HDR, now can you? Be honest.

Oh goodness!!! Ok this is the last thing I will harp on. I don’t mean to bash on this at all because I know everyone has their own opinions and this chart is based on opinions obviously but there is no way M. Bison sunk waaaaaaay the hell below Chun Li. Just no! :nono: They were both strong characters in ST. They are both still good characters in this game but they went in opposite directions. This chart has it backwards. Chun Li is the one who got worse and should go down. M. Bison is the one who got better and should go up. That is exactly why you see someone like NKI switching from Chun Li to M. Bison.

Actually at this point, can we get the complete list of folks who gave input for this chart? I’m just curious.

Grog · February 1, 2010, 11:29pm

Who’s this scrub Vega/Immortal wannabe fanboy? :arazz:

I’ve always felt that lists and charts like this were better suited for other fighters than ST/HDR. ST is a very matchup heavy game where with the same character you can completely dominate (Sim vs Guile) and then with the same character you can get your shit pushed in (Sim vs Vega) so in saying Sim is “top” can be situational, where saying Yun is top in 3S has a bit more stability. The magic of ST is that literally everyone has a chance to win, nothing is unwinnable - just sometimes more difficult.

skankin_garbage · February 2, 2010, 12:26am

I’m pretty sure that every super-competitive Chun player on this board feels that Fei vs Chun is 6-4 Fei.

Also, I think Chun v Ken is 6-4 Ken. It’s definitely not in her favor anymore, imo.

AudioCG · February 2, 2010, 12:32am

I concur with the matchup being in Guiles favor or dead even, Gat has no easy solutions in that match.

zass · February 2, 2010, 12:58am

I used to think that Chun beat Honda, but after we played a good series of games, I’m inclined to agree with you Thelo that this is advantage Honda. I would agree to 6-4 in Honda’s favor.

EA_Megaman · February 2, 2010, 1:08am

Hmm… Maybe online, but I don’t really agree with this when there is no latency. I think Thelo’s current assessment is more correct. 5.5/4.5 in Chun’s favor.

rcaido · February 2, 2010, 1:15am

Ryu 4.5 - Fake fireball give Ryu the edge
Guile 4 -Faster Running bear grab helps improve this matchup
Cammy 4 or 4.5 - Maybe its the people i play but i dont struggle with the "All-star Cammy’s) Never played Jangra though
Fei 5 Actually this is almost even IMO, maybe even giving the advantage to gief
Deejay 3 - Deejay deals more damage then Guile, that slide kick is also annoying
Balrog 5.5 - i cant really comment as i dont play too many Balrogs, i struggle at times
Vega 3 - Maybe its the lag

Kuroppi · February 2, 2010, 1:16am

I agree. Thelo, your Honda numbers look pretty much spot-on to me as well. I think Honda’s numbers are maybe .5 too high against a few characters but I won’t nitpick over .5. The only big disagreement I would have is Honda vs Ryu. I think that should be 2-8 at best and honestly I would probably put it even lower.

EA_Megaman · February 2, 2010, 1:18am

I also agree. If it were my ranking chart I’d say 9-1 but I’ll live with 8-2 because well, I guess Honda might get lucky twice.