If crMK was a low risk option vs dive kicks then Cody’s worst mus wouldn’t almost all be dive kick characters and you would hear Alex Valle saying on stream “Cody suffers dive kick characters. Really suffers” it works vs a lot of jump ins. It’s very good for side switching by sliding under a jump in. It is NOT good vs dive kicks whatsoever.
This image is the 5th frame of the startup of crMK
This is the 5th active frame IIRC
Here is Cody attempting to anti air Akuma’s non-demon flip dive kick (Down+MK)
If you want to ever beat a dive kick clean you need to have the opponents hitbox positioned in this gap otherwise it will trade or get stuffed.
If you don’t have the opponents hitbox in that very specific spot then you get these results:
Cammy - MK/EX Dive beats crMK clean. HK Trades often but not 100%
Seth - Trades every time vs dive kicks aimed at his feet (where the crMK hitbox is)
Yun - Cody wins vs all dive kicks aimed at his feet
Yang - Cody wins vs all dive kicks aimed at his feet
Evil Ryu - Cody wins vs all dive kicks aimed at his feet
Akuma - Trades every time when aimed at his feet.
Rufus - trades or beats crMK every time. Never stuffed
Gouken - Trades every time
Makoto - Cody wins or trades vs normal axe kick. Loses vs 2nd hit of EX Axe Kick every time.
Dhalsim - D+MK dive kick trades, never gets stuffed when hitting with Cody’s legs.
Adon - EX Air Jaguar wins every time. Regulars get stuffed.
As you can see, other than Yun/Yang/Evil Ryu. Every other character is a trade NOT a consistent clean win. Plus it’s only if they are trying to dive kick in front of where you are. If they dive kick where you currently are then there is a decent chance they will either go over you due to low profile, or hit you in the face.
It’s a solid option for TRADES but it is not a consistent anti air that BEATS dive kicks and you have to do it fairly early due to 7F startup + not low profiling until 5F.
I’m fairly certain all of the videos were made at the same time. The reason for not releasing any video on monday was likely due to Memorial Day (a USA holiday: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memorial_Day ) and I guess they decided not to release videos on tuesday. I highly suspect there will be a video release today but I could be wrong. Previously I thought monday but I forgot about memorial day.
My test results are definitely different from yours. Here I use cody’s slide to anti air gouken’s dive kick at ideal different ranges and not once did it trade as oppose “every time” from your tests. Along with the other divekicks, I also got favorable results. Based of my own experience I find it to be a useful anti air. If you’re getting trades I suggest practicing your timing. I’m still of the opinion that it’s a good answer to divekicks.
Even if 2 out of the 4 was due to it being the “sweet spot” as you mentioned It’s still a good anti air for many of these dive kicks. However I’m gonna chalk it up to poor timing in your video because the slide is clearly being pressed too late. Compare the timing with my video and see how the slide is being press much later. Remember slide has tons of active frames at 7 total so there’s a large margin for adjusting the timing. That being said, I’d say it safer to be early than late.
HK Ruffian has a standing hitbox and requires a fireball motion, so many times you have to be a little preemptive to anti air with it else it’s a little dangerous to do it on reaction to a jump or while walking forward or back. Slide is 1 directional button and mk so it’s much easier to do purely based off reactions. Of course if you’re able to, HK ruffian is better any day. However characters rufus yang and yun can fake dive kick and cop out early.
Did you watch ALL of the 30second video I posted? I changed timings. Later on I’m doing it on the later frames. At one point I do it early enough that the frames ran out before dive kick hit. If it was a good option vs dive kicks you’d see it used in those matchups to anti air dive kicks more often. It’s much better to simply swap sides vs dive kicks as MOST dive kicks are being aimed not to land in front of you were you can anti air them free (or throw them) but at your feet / waist where if you do an early crMK you’ll get smacked in the face or switch sides.
Not counting after a knockdown watch where Velociraptor aims his dive kicks and when/where he uses them
Julio only does LK Dive Kick whiffed at a range where crMK couldn’t reach or would be too slow if it did hit. HK Dive kick is done at an angle that it would hit Cody in the face or whiff safely if Cody went for a crMK anti air.
Poongko doing dive kicks aimed at the chest usually, this means crMK could low profile and avoid but not anti air. Momochi (the best Cody to date) not one crMK attempted anti air.
crMK not used because jump back LP is a much better option vs dive kicks from Rufus.
The problem is, once you start facing players who know how to space and when to use their dive kicks crMK is AN option but not a GOOD option. It’s good against jump ins or crossups. It’s not good against most smart dive kicks.
@1:59 in the poongko momochi match, if he had used c.mk it would have traded and won him the round. @3:27 is another place he could have used to at least trade instead of eating a raw divekick. @7:32 instead of trading with c.mk, momochi eats a raw dive kick corner carry combo
you’re right in that momochi didn’t use c.mk as an anti air once, but he also got blown up for all his anti airs besides the occasional jb.lp against rufus.
1:59 watch the positioning again several times. Note the angle of the dive kick and Momochi’s position. Momochi would need to be farther back for a crMK to trade. It would have avoided the dive kick but it wouldn’t hit it. If Cody had a fast enough backwards walk speed it’d be a dif story.
3:27 again, would have avoided or gotten hit but not traded with the dive kick. Note the position of Seth’s dive kick is going at an angle where crMK would only work if it moved backwards, even if Cody stayed in place it might not work. It’s a really easy to re-create scenario. Have Cody walk almost (just under) half a large training block forward on round start, Seth does jump - dive kick at after max height. Had momochi not moved at the start of the round he might have been able to do it. Also when doing it, make sure that Seth does the dive kick once he has reached the position of the timer bar on screen, poongko did the dive after the jump reached its apex so it was already falling at that point. Seth has a decent window to choose when to dive.
7:32 it might have traded but it also might have just hit momochi in the face. Not sure on that one.
Again, wouldn’t work as an anti air but good to avoid the dive kick pressure itself by getting under it.
Momochi is generally known for having the best footsies other than perhaps Daigo. I’ve seen him utilize crMK as an anti air plenty of times and he almost never does it in dive kick mus. I’ve gone through a ton of videos of multiple top players online and offline (Momochi, Sasaki, BJ, Ladnopokaa, ect) and it’s almost impossible to find matches where they use crMK to anti air a dive kick. Even in situations they COULD do it they don’t go for it (a couple of times in the Momochi vs Kazunoko (Seth) long sets Momochi could have actually done a crMK to possibly AA a dive but doesn’t attempt it.)
Man, both of you guys are wrong.
Everyone knows that the best way to stop a dive kick is to slide under it with c.MK and then when we recovers do the cl.HK. It beats all dive kicks and jump ins pretty much. I’m sorta the best at this game, don’t worry, I know.
(I’m kidding btw)
But on a for real note; Did anyone watch Guys or Kens demo reel on YouTube? They showed the “slight” walk speed improvement. If you ask me that is absolutely not slight. Both are significantly fast now! So I’m seriously hoping that since Cody’s change log says “slight” as well, we are gonna go to a noticeable speed as well.
I think we went down a rabbit hole on the Cr. MK vs. dive kicks thing, but I think it’s going to depend on the character. HK Ruffian is (almost) always the best option from 1/4-1/3 screen distance jumps, but if you don’t have the reactions, Cr. MK usually works. Eternal mentions how dive kicks aimed at the chest or head will win or whiff against Cr. MK… In these situations why not use Jaw Crusher, given you have the frames to do it? And obviously characters will have setups where anti-airing is unsafe or impossible for Cody, so let’s not blow that out of proportion. Just block or Focus dash cancel and get out of there.
HK ruffian with upper body invincibility would solve all our complaints and debates. Fuck that just Invincible upper body vs air attacks like in xtekken.
Not happening though unfortunately. We aren’t Moe enough
[Photoshop of kawaii cody but i dont have it or know how to use it]
One of the first things i dd when trying to beat the divekicks of the twins, rufus, seth akuma etc was the cr.mk. I it overall a terrible idea to use against those characters their divekicks even if it has a certain sweet spot. HK ruffian is too difficult to use against divekicks if they initiate them fast imo. Usually do st.lp, and jump back lp and focus. Not really using st.hp too often but it seems a far better option than hk ruffian and b.mp.Going to try that one out.
