Yeah it’s traditionally a bad matchup for Chun since vega is like a better version of Chun but without a fireball or a reversal. At neutral her fireball isn’t good enough, and her pokes are outclassed.
Fireball is supposed to be the equaliser but since he has options to beat it that don’t even require meter, or hit from like full screen away with no risk… it seems like a counter matchup again unless Chun can knock him down. Seems like a matchup where Chun doesn’t want to save to super but instead wants to try to run oki on him as that’s his biggest weakness as a character… no reversal.
Vega is an interesting matchup for S2, I think the match is pretty even.
Vega have a harder time around fireballs in S2 than he did in S1. That is because his EX roll seems slower and his V-skill is worse at dealing with them. You gotta use them sparingly but fireballs must be used but gotta be smart about using them. His options will usually come to either hang way in the back and walking back and forth, slide or jump. It is mostly a footsies battle but it is very doable.
You must know the Vega oki, what is safe and what isn’t. LP ASE is punishable by EX legs, MP ASE can also be punished if spaced wrong with EX legs. All of his rolls except EX can be punished by cr.MK/st.MP xx MK SBK / HK legs all of em are (-6 or worse). Vega doesn’t get Oki after his forward throw mid screen, He can only do F.HP after it to meaty but the move is so punishable (-14) so again EX legs will still reach him and punish.
Vega doesn’t get Oki after command grabs so you can always challenge on wakeup after getting command thrown by him.
EX SBK is a very good answer to his EX wall dives shenanigans in the corner.
Vega players are typically super buttonsy on wakeup, so your meaties gotta be on point.
EX fireball is important to approach if he likes to hang a lot and annoy you in footsies, it is a decent way to force yourself onto him.
Yeah and you can never jump in this match because his speed and our shitty jump will get us no where.
It is also not a horrible idea to fish for a sweep CC against him in claw stance, the hurtboxes on his claw normals are kinda week.
LOL… every matchup with chun feels wack as fuck. Akuma… have no answer to airfireballs at all. Except to play the matchup with chun the way vega plays against chun… just trying to stay out of airfireball range… or play it like marvel and just try not to be there.
Vega just runs around and jumps your fireballs and stays at a range where you can’t jump or dash at him. And his footsies beat yours for free, plus he’s faster. Necalli has ridiculous damage and a command grab and a divekick so you can’t get loose with the AA.
Ryu just throws fireballs and runs and does crossup jumps.
Bison is nothing but scissors and ex DR aerial bullshit that can’t be dealt with.
Basically the way the game seems to go is:
You are chun. Your oki is the only real positive you have. So try to get a knockdown and ride that shit to victory.
You think your pokes are a positive? LOL. The stage is huge and your pokes take up no space and everyone and their mom either plays 3/4 screen away, or up in your face. Where your pokes are irrelevant.
Nothing else really works. Her AA doesn’t work against half the cast, or they can easily do stuff to make Chun not want to AA… like divekick or someshit, her pokes done work because people can just backdash to safety. In oldschool streetfighter this wasn’t a problem. Her pokes were stubby but people couldn’t just backdash out. They had to jump backwards to get space, which chun can just follow… or they had to walk backwards but chuns forward walkspeed was way better than most characters back walk speed.
In this game it’s to easy to make space for all the characters that can’t handle her pokes.
Imo she needs a better fireball or way better upclose game than what she currently has, people are just running and trying their best to never engage in footsies and are just doing dash and jump and special move games all day. Chun guesses wrong once and it could be death.
Her only real saving grace at this point is that her oki is decent.
I got few guys who i have been playing with in lounge for last two weeks and i need quick tips that will help me step up my game in few matchups. I need tips for Kolin, Ed, Alex and FANG. I understand its a lot to ask for so just a few thoughts on each matchup will do.
@Dime What oki? After looking at other characters like Laura and Ibuki, I feel like Chun has such weak oki. Maybe there’s just alot of stuff that I don’t know but the only oki I can get are off SBK or EX legs. Forward throw is 0 if you dash up and back throw is full screen lol. Other characters get oki off their throws and other knockdowns have multiple meaty setups. Chun not so much
It’s… ok. Fact of the matter is that it’s the best chance she ever gets for more damage outside stupid v trigger overheads and v trigger pops.
The thing to realise with chuns oki so that you DONT have to dash x2. You can dash x 1 and then walk which creates an ambiguous opportunity if the opponent quickrised.
If you anticipate backrise then you can do dash x 1, wait a sec, then fhk. This will hit both quick and backrise wakeup jabs/mediums/throws.
If your opponent stays on the graph do then chun has a decent meaty with BHP into CC. If they just block then you can throw them.
Right now in the current meta one of the most powerful options is the dash x2 delay cr.lk oki. Blocks reversals and can hit opponents that try to stand or walk away.
It isn’t great but it’s what she got to work with. Currently I’m working on my stagger strings. I found an awesome bit of tech from punk that I have reverse engineered, current,y using it for urien but I will be transferring it to my Chun as well.
A solid Kolin can be tough but imo Chun’s defense > Kolin’s offense.
You want to fight her at s.hp to cr.mk range. At that distance you out range her pokes, you can stuff her slower start up specials and you can punish her unsafe stuff. She’s going to want to get in on you so watch out for jumps, dashes and steps.
Once you’ve established that she can’t get in free she’ll be looking to counter you with vskill. When this starts vary your pokes and timings, mix in fireballs, walk up buttons, air legs, empty jump lows, grabs anything to keep her on edge and make it hard for her to counter you. Also around s.hp range Kolin’s vskill is unsafe on block. Supposedly it’s -7 but cr.mk never connects for me, I mostly punish with cr.lk~legs/ex legs~vtc if it’s available. If you get the knock down feel free to harass her on wakeup. Just look out for wakeup counters and ex steps.
If you find yourself forced out to 3/4 screen or more she’ll probably look to throw iceballs. Be patient and inch your way in. She may try to advance behind the iceball but most of her options are slow enough to see them coming. The ex iceball is fast enough to disrupt your defense with a follow up, watch for cross ups and steps into low or overhead and you should be ok. If she tries to keep you out with regular iceballs and you have meter you can dash up ex legs while she’s in startup.
When she gets trigger be careful. It’s fast enough to catch fireballs and very plus on block. Try to stuff it preemptively with s.hp and chun’s other good pokes, but don’t be predictable or you’ll eat a counter.
If she manages to get in on you her buttons and frame traps aren’t too deceptive. Be patient, block low and watch for grabs and overhead.
Tldr, Her offense isn’t too powerful and it’s mostly dependent on mix ups and traps. It will hurt when she lands something, but if you play patient and block well you can minimize the damage she gets. Her defense is mainly her counters. If you find yourself getting countered you’re poking too predictably and need to switch up.
Well, what do you already know and what are you struggling with?
Posting details on that will make it easier to narrow down and give key information and any improvements/corrections based on that if necessary.
Kolin: ground game is very easy imo as long as you don’t press too many buttons. She struggles against fireballs. Pretty easy to punish hands on block at most ranges with cr.lk. You can walk back out of most of her pressure unless she has vt, as her cr.mk doesn’t otherwise lead into anything. Her jumps are difficult to anti air with normals but she doesnt force you to approach her at all so I sit on down charge a lot and EX SBK. Don’t try to dash under her jump unless you are very very early.
Alex: neutral jump occasionally in footsies, counterpoke w/ fireballs/b+hp (b+mp on block into b+hp catches his cr.mp and probably st.mk), if he does cr.hp on block while in vt do not punish it immediately – they will basically always go into parry, which is punishable on reaction with ex legs. Don’t EX SBK parry. Punish stomp
Fang: fireball at the start of the round beats his poison balls (don’t get too predictable with it obviously), so does st.hk iirc which also beats fwd jump. In my experience Fang plays extremely aggressively in this matchup and while you can’t exactly zone him, he also struggles w/ close range fireballs because he usually won’t actually have charge to contest with his own fireballs. Air legs in neutral can punish cr.hk xx vt fishing. You will be forced to block a lot in this matchup but having a strong offense goes a long way as well because you don’t have to respect him at all on wakeup.
I also recently played a very long set against Dee_Ancer (master rank Fang). I think I lost slightly overall but you should still find something useful from it. You can find the replays online by searching Battle Lounge matches of Chun vs. Fang (with 25k - 30k LP Fang only)
Awesome thanks guys. I just needed some usual stuff to help me build some gameplan against those guys, cause i dont play too often and dont have too much experience against some chars in roster.
How do you guys deal with Menat? Now that I’ve played a few that are actually good with her it seems utterly hopeless. Her pokes beat Chun’s clean (can’t even trade), you can’t AA her when she jumps with the orb and her pressure is safe at all times if she spaces her drill correctly. Sure you can pester her quite a bit when you have her cornered but getting her there is a challenge in itself and then she can just V-Reversal out.
The first Menat I ran into in this game (at 1:14:10 if timestamp doesn’t work):
She still loses to fireball if she wants to play the poking game (just don’t be too predictable, so you don’t get jumped over). A lot of her normals are very negative and some can even get punished by EX Legs when you’re in range. F+MP is your friend in this match. Keep the pressure on when you get in and punish v-reversal attempts. Also her reflect isn’t that scary because Chun’s fireball dissipates early so it can’t really be used against you and she doesn’t build any v-gauge for reflecting (I said otherwise in the video, but that was before I tested). You can even whiff punish it if you’re looking for it.
I would appreciate your help with the matchup vs Bison. I’m totally clueless what to do. I can’t contest him in the air, it feels like I’m getting outranged on everything and I have a hard time telling when is my turn. Especially when he has me in the corner.
I’m just a beginner so there’s a lot of dropped combos, missed pressures on wake up etc. and while that’s definitely something I need to work on it’s not my biggest problem. The real challenge is to find effective answers to his strings especially when I’m in the corner. At this point it seems that I have to just block all the time because my normals can’t reach him or I get counter hit in the process. Even my EX legs can get counter hit, so I’m a bit lost.
Any advise will be appreciated.
Another Chun beginner here (actually in the Beginner rank).
I don’t have a lot of experience, but it seems to me that part of the problem is leaving damage on the table with c.LKs and lightning legs. Spinning Bird Kick combos knock the opponent down, halting opponent’s advance, and allowing you to reverse the situation and put the pressure on them on wake up. Chun’s BnB is very important in this respect as she does poor damage in Season 2, and every little bit of damage and stun helps, including the wake up options. Occasional crush counter buttons might relieve the pressure slightly too.
I don’t know which anti-air works with Bison’s aerial stuff, b+HK? Dash under and that? Crouching medium punch would likely allow you to slide under that. At least in the first match, he did aerial stuff repeatedly in the corner, which made it predictable. And that in turn allows countering it, somehow. I’m battling with the constant jump ins too, that comes with the Chun territory, at least this season.
Bison seems to be intended to be really oppressive in the corner. So V-reversal comes to mind when dealing with his stuff, that option was also available, but it’s easy to forget. My understanding is that Bison’s V-reversal isn’t that good, so if you V-reversal and start pressuring him you maybe able to turn the tide and push him to the corner, from which he likely has more problems getting out than you.
Vs his Devil’s Reverse and EX Devil’s Reverse you need to anti-air with a well timed B+HK or EX SBK (every Chun should be drilling this out extensively in the training mode imo with multiple different timings set so you can react to when he flips over to come down at you). If you block EX DR, you either need to quickly v-reversal to end his pressure or you have to hold the mixup (be patient and make the choice between throw tech or block until he pushes himself out). Alternatively, you can dash like mad (3 to 4 quick dashes) under him as soon as he takes off with the head press animation, so as soon as you hear the “Hup!” you keep dashing and make the DR/EX DR whiff (it is very hard for them to track you in this situation) and be ready to hit him on the other side. Be aware that most Bison’s will be mashing on st. HK if their DR whiffs, so use your fast buttons to make sure you’re always hitting them first.
-After blocking a Headpress, you should just use B+HK to anti air the skull diver followup. You CANNOT slide under or dash under it in this game. B+HK is your best option after both the normal and EX headpress as the EX Headpress has too much blockstun to challenge with an air to air normal.
-DR/EX DR is one of the stupidest moves in the game that can completely change the momentum for him, so everyone should definitely simulate it in training and figure out as many ways as possible to deal with it and stop that from happening.
-Vs the V-trigger version of DR, I think it’s best to just dash away from it (remember 3 to 4 quick dashes) and make him waste it as opposed to challenging it because it is very hard to hit. If you want to get ballsy (please don’t though) you can try to tag him with neutral jump HK as he reappears to do the attack portion. He’ll always be coming from the opposite side of you at an awkward speed and his hurtbox will be out of the way most of the time which is why I think it’s wiser just to avoid it by dashing away.
-Vs his d/f+HP it is +1 on block. In the corner this is obviously a pain in the ass, so your main options are to V-reversal the d/f+HP and get out of there, EX SBK after you block it to beat whatever button he does after or to immediately challenge with your cr. LK (only his st. LK can counter hit this while every other button will either get hit or trade and that will get you out of pressure). You do have to challenge it occasionally or he’ll think he can harass you forever, so you need to plant the idea that he needs to hesitate so you can get out of pressure easier.
Also in general, you should work on anti-airing him more in general. He got away with WAY too many normal jumps. St. LK, B+HK, air to air him… whatever you can to discourage this behavior (and pressure him on the way down with either a meaty button/throw or dash under for the left/right mixup). Plus you should be trying to confirm more into knockdowns. If you don’t have the SBK combos down yet (very important to learn for Chun), then go for EX legs while you can instead of regular legs. The post knockdown pressure is too important to be letting this slide. A couple of basic options after SBK or EX Legs knockdown:
vs Quickrise:
Dash -> F+HK
Dash x2 -> meaty cr.LP/cr.LK/st.MP/throw
Dash -> Walk up near them -> meaty cr.LP/cr.LK/st.MP/throw/B+HP
-In the mid range I use F+MP, st. HP, st. MK, fireball, EX fireball and cr. MK a lot to check him and get him to the point where he wants to jump so I can AA him and get my followup pressure started. You have to play around his v-skill with your fireball if he wants to do that (I bait with the HP fireballs out of range and punish his whiff recovery with either st. HK or st. HP). If you’re not used to how these buttons operate in the ground game, set it up in training to practice whiff punishing and counterpoking his pokes. It’s your turn when he’s not making you block d/f+HP for the most part or you steal the turn with v-reversal or EX SBK. The only other moves that give him frame advantage from the mid range are EX moves or DR (which you should be working on anti-airing or avoiding when you see it).
Under pressure, a lot of Bison players will mash st. LK and tech throws like crazy due to lack of defensive options, so frame trapping that and throw baiting will be a huge part of opening him up once you spot their tendency to do that. His V-reversal is pretty slow, so you can also attempt to bait that and throw it if you sniff it out.
This is just general stuff. He’s annoying, so once you get in don’t let up on him and if he gets in on you, sacrifice that meter to get him to respect it.
