The more I play vs dictator, the more I think the devil’s reverse has really changed the matchup. In VST, one knockdown on a dictator could very easily be death. But now, he flies away half the time. It’s a big change because part of what was so scary for Dic was the dizzy potential that came from chun’s repeated attacks.
Maybe the problem is that I’m using low forward on a downed Dic, and not something like standing strong? I haven’t tried that.
Will Flipping neckbreaker hit DR as he leaves the ground? If it does I’m guessing only if done late since it hits low if done meaty. Standing strong or meaty standing fierce might be good, or just plain old jump straight up and stick out a meaty nuetral jumping attack as he gets up.
^^ the neckbreaker I really don’t like, because if you do it late, then chun li ends up facing the wrong way for her follow up attack, which is an easy punish for her opponent. And if you do it early then she can get thrown out of it.
I’m also not sure how much time she has for a jump up neutral attack – the problem is she needs a setup that is good after she throws dic but he tecs the throw. There’s no time for a jumping attack in that situation, which is why low forward was ideal in VST.
I’ll play around with standing strong. If that hits the DR on the way up that could be good.
That’s the one thing I wish they would have changed in HDR, how vulnerable she is after a tech’ed throw. Wish Sirlin would have made her throw them farther (or higher) or made the recovery shorter. Especially since she lost the big damage off her Super. I also wanted her SBK from Super back, instead of this mostly useless one we got instead :(.
Sure, I’ll try. I know you’re a really excellent player, so if you think there’s something you think I’m not considering as well, I’d like to know.
Basically, the biggest thing is that you can pretty much zone Hawk entirely with C.Mk. I’d say the sweet spot for this match is where your C.Mk is out of range to be hit by his Sweep (the first hit). This way, he can’t just trade and knock you down.
From this range, a lot of cool things happen, namely:
Hawk’s DP will completely whiff
Hawk doesn’t have much of an option other than to jump at you or Hawk Dive (which is a jump, I guess :P).
If Hawk whiffs a DP, just walk up and throw him, sweep him, or do your favorite combo. If Hawk jumps…even if he jumps the very second you start a C.Mk, you can always walk forward a smidge and anti-air him with Close S.Mk. This move beats all of Hawk’s jump-ins.
Getting in against Hawk is difficult, because at any time if he catches you sleeping, he can jump in and tick you, or hit you with a Hawk Dive…or if you’re really catatonic, he could just walk up and throw you. Getting in, I move forward and back a little while throwing out jabs and carefully throwing fireballs. The movements are of course meant to mess with his spacing and make your fireballs unpredictable. If you’re not good at this, Hawk can catch you with a far J.Lp and convert it into a throw, or he can Hawk Dive right over your fireballs.
Here are some match videos. The only things that don’t apply are the things I just mentioned: You don’t have to block a Hawk Dive and then punish it (and actually, you can’t), and you’re not completely deadified in the corner. The only peculiar thing about these match videos is why they don’t anti-air Hawk’s splash with Close S.Mk more - maybe they know something I don’t? Anyways:
Match 1: Mayakon (Hawk) vs Otochun (Chun): [media=youtube]HkpVYYmv9dk[/media]
Round 1: Chun
Round 2: Hawk
Round 3: Chun
Match 2: Mayakon (Hawk) vs Otochun (Chun): [media=youtube]lqV9xq0HiM8[/media]
Round 1: Chun
Round 2: Chun
Match 3: Toutanki (Hawk) vs Chamu (Chun): [media=youtube]loQMTn9qfh8[/media]
Round 1: Hawk
Round 2: Chun
Round 3: Hawk
Match 4: Toutanki (Hawk) vs Kita (Chun):[media=youtube]y7UZrMcDCNE&NR=1[/media]
Round 1: Chun
Round 2: Hawk
Round 3: Chun
Matches 5,6, 7: Toutanki (Hawk) vs Kita (Chun): [media=youtube]kY8Yp1G9kuM[/media]
(Match 5)
Round 1: Chun
Round 2: Chun
(Match 6)
Round 1: Hawk
Round 2: Chun
Round 3: Hawk
(Match 7)
Round 1: Hawk
Round 2: Hawk
I also imagine j.lk is good for stopping T. Hawk’s dives? Not a Chun player, just trying to contribute!
I can’t remember why, but I don’t use it. I’m pretty sure it’s cos J.Lp beats it, or something else important. The only jump attack worth using on defense is Neutral J.Hk, imo. It can beat his splash clean if you do it from far away, you can use it to beat Hawk Dives early, and you can take him out of the air if Hawk tries to zone you with a neutral jump attack.
I think this is what I was missing. I didn’t know about standing MK. I need to try that, thank you :). The problem is that now it’s hard to find anyone playing T Hawk… it’s even hard finding anyone playing the game at all, it seems 
By the way, when I used to play Hawk in VST, I would have a very hard time dealing with chuns that would stand there doing lightning legs. If I jumped as Hawk, they would immediately cancel into upkicks, setting up a nasty crossup combo. I’ve never managed to do that. Do you know how that’s done? Do you just keep mashing on kicks but just move the joystick to the up postition?
Lightning Legs into Upkicks? You just have to know when the Legs will end, hold db while mashing, stop mashing and do the Upkicks when you have enough charge. It becomes instinctive after you get the hang of it.
I’d like to know the secret to the canceled LL’s into up kicks. I’ve see people do it but haven’t figured it out yet. Anybody got any insight?
my sarcasm sense is tingling
It’s the same principle as Lightning Legs into Kikkoken. Or Honda’s Slaps, Sumo Splash or Blanka’s Electricity, V Roll.
Hmm that’s it lol I was hoping for some kind of kara or cancel trick.
blitz, we’re asking about an immediate cancel into upkicks. That’s not the same as waiting for them to end and then doing upkicks. A chun can do LL indefinitely and then when a jump in comes, BAM cancel into upkicks. We’re asking about that.
It’s something I’ve only seen the Japanese do maybe it’s an inside thing Hmmmmm?
If you go into training mode and try it, you can see that you don’t have to completely wait until the Lightning Legs are done. But, as usual, it’s much easier to do in Training Mode than in the heat of a real match.
But yeah, basically, charge down while doing lightning legs, and just a bit after you stop mashing kick, pres U+Kick. I’m not sure when the earliest possible moment you can do it is, but you definitely don’t have to wait until the recovery period of Lightning Legs has finished.
That’s exactly what I do. I can spam Lightning Legs, and when I see a jump in, I know just when to stop mashing, and when the Legs will stop, to go immediately into Upkicks. You’re talking about a 2 hit with almost the same speed as a link combo right? Yeah, I know what you guys meant.
Like skankin said, you don’t have to wait until you see the Legs stop, you can start the Upkicks motion while Legs are still going, and then hit Kick as soon as Legs are done. You have to start the motion towards the end of the Legs though, you can’t just do Upkicks anytime you want. The timing takes experience, but I’m sure with good players of Voltech’s level (and my Chun is nowhere near as good as his), it’ll come to you very quickly.
Bumpin’ this thread with info yet to appear on my FAQ…
Cross-ups:
Jumping jab: (Standing) Works on everyone; (Crouching) Misses Ryu, Ken, Akuma, E. Honda, Blanka; Works on everyone else.
Jumping short: (Standing) Misses Fei Long, and Sagat; Works on everyone else; (Crouching) Misses Cammy, Dee Jay, and Claw; Works on everyone else.
Jumping strong: (Standing) Works on everyone; (Crouching) Misses Blanka, Dhalsim, Cammy, and Sagat; Works on everyone else.
Jumping forward: (Standing/Crouching) Works on everyone.
Jumping fierce: (Standing) Misses Guile, Dhalsim, Fei Long, Sagat, and Dictator; Works on everyone else; (Crouching) Works on E. Honda, Chun Li, Blanka, Zangief, T. Hawk, Cammy, Fei Long, and Claw; Misses everyone else.
Jumping roundhouse: (Standing) Misses Guile, Dhalsim, and Boxer; Works on everyone else; (Crouching) Works on T. Hawk, and Boxer; Misses everyone else.
Most reliable cross-ups: Jumping forward, Jumping strong, Jumping fierce
streetfighterdojo.com: ST Chun Li Page
I finally got the ST Chun Li section up at streetfighterdojo.com.
The link is:
http://streetfighterdojo.com/superturbo/chunli/chunlimatches.html
Yes, it’s ST and not HDR, but a good amount of it is similar and I expect HDR players will get some use out of the matches and extras.
Dee Jay is next in line.
That’s some cool shit zaspacer i miss my old ST Chun now i have to come up with new tricks!!!
How do I deal with T.Hawk or Zangief ticking into a command throw with Chun?