Chun still being a good character, she has pretty good normals on floor like st.HK good for CC shoto’s fireballs, fwd.MP good range, cr.MP low profile, anti-zoning, st.MK anti-low and counter for Birdie’s banana jail, cr.MK low profile and good range, b.HP a monster of priority and active frames, fwd.HK, cr.HK for whiff punish fierce normals, even st.HP will do a good job if you know how to push that button and what position you shall to. Further she has b.HK, an excellent anti air, st.HK for long range jumps and j.MP, j.HP, neutral j.HK and air throw for air to air, also if you are in VT can do j.MK and make extra damage from juggle properties.
Air legs isn’t the only tool and if you go to training to compare the damage potential you can notice Chun li has more potential than Season 1, of course her BnB are weaker but a new oportunity rises from legs and FB into VTX + Super. Do 400 damage from airlegs is a extra chance to kill your enemy from throw bait. And about VT: yes, her VT has only 11 seg of duration BUT! you are forgetting something important, she has about 2 VT per round from CCs and Damage you take, 1 in the middle of the match and second for the last part.
Yes, Chun has been nerfed pretty hard but she still being good, just you know how to use her tools.
All you did was list her tool set. We can play that game with every charc and say well this charc doesn’t have this but they have this to compensate.
When you start listing all the tool sets for every charc, as you did with Chun, you realize without V-Trigger season 2 Chun is bottom tier.
Chun took a huge step back. I know the rest of the cast got damage nerfs, etc. However, Chun’s damage was already lower than normal so even if the rest of the cast gets a damage nerf it will effect Chun even more.
Before all these nerf hammers were raised, Capcom said hey wouldn’t nerf but buff weaker characters. Now, they have went back on their word and not only nerf characters but over nerf characters like Chun and Mika.
And Lmao at getting two V-Triggers in a match at high level play. Good luck with that. If you’re a Chun player and relying on two V-Triggers to even have a chance at winning in high level, you’ve already lost and might as well switch mains.
So you said Chun li is bottom tier now, see some nerf:
cr.LP 4F startup || cr.LK can replace it, can’t do huge damage from counter like cr.LP (counter) > cr.MK xx SBK, but it’s something and can still cut situations, frametrap for 4F jab characters and has a good wakeup jab (think that are characters that have only 4F short and have to cancel it into a special that is minus on block)
Airlegs -2 oB || all of Chun li players know that this move was going to be nerf, because you can just spam it for life and got advantage in neutral game, just like Ken’s air tatsu
st.HP -5 oB || this is a hard nerf to Chun but no means this move is useless, this button in right position still gonna be good and an excellent way to fight in long range, no more spam strong in neutral game like Ricky Ortiz on Capcom Cup
st.LK 5 startup and tiny hitbox || can replace it with b.HK, now we gonna get some problems against certain -4 oB moves like Laura or Ken st.HK but a minus FA move also means that you can lead the next move, so you have advantage and can go for FB, st.HP, dash in, whatever. Not a problem with VTX because cr.MP xx VTX is +5 oH, same to counter fwd.HK that can replace it with cr.LK xx Legs xx whatever, not a problem too against OH because mostly of them were nerfed and are -6 oB that means you can punish them with other move (maybe cr.MK xx Legs or anything else)
SBK EX -16 oB || no words, just say is correct
Crouch hurtbox fix’d || same here, correct
Damage nerf || just do labwork and try to optimize combos and execution
875 HP is a lie
VT to 11 Seg || i said before, if you know how to connect crush counters during neutral game, vskill and have a good defense, you can count until 2 VT per round. Further in somes MUs is more rewarding don’t use VT and keep it to do V-reversal and keep your opponent far away and control the match, like Ibuki, Laura, Mika, Necalli, Bison, Rashid, Karin. Put all your comeback hopes and dreams on VT is a huge mistake, sure, against big bodies MU is a invaluable tool for comeback but not the decisive key to get it, especially if your opponent knows how to keep distance and nullify it.
I main Chun li since day 1and play competitive, i knew that she deserved that nerfs, she was so far the best character in game, but this same thing made me calm down, because the reason she has a lot of tools that she can response every situation and can replace her future faults. I’m not surprised with those nerf, but with buff i do, that is a window to new things and made her a more interesting and technical character.
They make changes that just aren’t necessary.
I’m used to an age where you played the game you got and dealt with it - anymore it’s major system and character changes every 6 months or year.
So much for:
“We’re never gonna nerf any character we’ll just buff them to be able to compete. It’s what we learned with USF4” - Peter Combofiend Rosas
I’m sticking to Overwatch I guess, it’s been more fun anyway.
Edit - Oh plus in Peter’s initial video for Chun: "We designed her to have a kick for every situation"
I.E. St. Lk is for far jump ins, B+Hk for Up close/neutrals…
So what do they do? Nerf St. Lk
Here is my problem with the St. Lp and LK nerfs to the cast…Why are you jumping in and getting hit by it?
Is it really the game? the character? or your dumb ass for jumping in unsafe situations? Stay free scrubs.
Technically their Evo panel said they weren’t going to nerf top tiers too much, but yeah they generally put on the idea that we were going to get a game where top tiers would mostly remain the same data wise.
Well Overwatch and most any other competitive genre is not good to play if you’re used to things being the way they were. That’s exactly why I don’t play anything other than fighters. Everything else competitive is even worse in that respect and they do changes mid season. At least SFV stays the same for a year once the season starts. You get to stick to a meta once things start.
If you’ve been a Chun since day 1, you should know better than anyone what these changes mean for her. Chun is dead man. We can sit here and argue till our fingers fall off, but it’s not going to change anything.
Capcom ruined Chun and Mika. They promised not to nerf charcs but then they over nerf charcs.
All these so called buffs to Chun to make up for the nerfs are useless. The damage is laughable. The risk/reward is stupid. Capcom raped Chun.
It’s a smack in the face to everyone who took time to learn season 1 Chun and loved the charc. Now, Chun is pretty much useless without V-Trigger and they made her more boring to play.
Even with V-Trigger and full resources it’s an uphill battle for season 2 Chun.
These changes are a joke and we can sit here and debate Chun vs the rest of the cast but it’s not going to change the fact that they over nerfed Chun and made her even more boring to play.
I don’t want to see cr.lk into legs into V-Trigger back into legs all day. That crap is boring to watch and the damage is nothing.
The instant air legs combos are a complete joke and they should have just taken air legs out of the game because now it’s useless and too risky to even use and pretty much zero reward if it hits.
Might as well play Gief instead of Chun in season 2 or any other charc besides Chun. Mika got nerfed to hell but she still has good damage compared to Chun without V-Trigger.
Point being…
They made Chun even more boring to play and pretty much irrelevant to SFV. Maybe that’s what Capcom wanted. I know a lot of people didn’t like Chun’s play style and said she was boring. Maybe Capcom just wanted to get rid of Chun from the competitive field to make things, in their eyes, more entertaining. Who knows, but these nerfs make absolutely no sense.
Did she need some nerfs? Sure, but these nerfs are a complete joke compared to the rest of the cast besides Mika(who still does more damage without V-Trigger.)
I don’t know how relevant she will be in S2 but the jury’s still out on the rest of the cast.
In any case I’m probably almost definitely sticking chun on casuals and urien on ranked.
It makes no sense to try and main a character this nerfed when you already know where you were at in season 1 with a much better version of the character.
She’s only really going to be relevant to masochists and people that like a challenge. Anyone else will go to an obvious top tier because this game is to weak to also main weak characters within it. The only really good thing is that at least there is shaping up to be a decent and fun top tier with Laura and urien getting significant buffs.
Chun is dead to me. Capcom ruined her and made her even more boring to play.
So much for not nerfing charcs to the ground and buffing weaker ones. Capcom learn how to balance games! This isn’t how you do it.
To all the Chun mains… good luck in season 2 with the most boring charc in the game and without V-Trigger and meter one of the weakest. You can thank Capcom for that.
I know she got hits with nerfs… and a bunch of them. Some i think is grossly unfair. SOme i see borderline understandable. My concern is that I’m gonna have less fun playing as her this season than I did with season one.
Regardless, Chun-Li has been my bae forever, and she can be nerfed to the lowest garbage tier, and I’ll still use her. Besides, I only play casual matches and single player modes. I’m stil gonna enjoy playing as her and still use her online, but it’s not gonna be as fun.
She honestly looks more fun to play. Only thing that would make her less fun is IALL, but I can live without dive kicking all day with the queen of footsies.
Well I’m hopeful that she may have at least gotten a ground throw range increase if I’m interpreting toolassisted’s difference log correctly (sorry, I’m not very good at reading this):
But it also indicates air throw’s range being decreased. That and various moves getting more startup and B. HP range possibly being reduced (not 100% sure on these… it’s all over the place and like I said: I’m not very good at reading these).
-I wasn’t happy about how watered down SFV got since the early betas (and compared to older SF games), so I’m still not happy that they seem to be going further in that direction with the nerfs (I’m sure the white health change is a factor in their decisions for this somehow). I also don’t like that they seem to be making characters’ moves slower despite supposedly reducing the input delay. It’s like we can’t just have good things… it’s gotta be accompanied by a bunch of shitty things for some reason. Even though I expected some light nerfs in key areas (not just for Chun but a couple of other characters)… they went overboard if most of this sticks. And it seems like they do this while going ham on the buffs for some other characters… so they basically just switch tiers with the current top. I don’t think that’s a good way to go about balancing. People will get sick of seeing those characters at the end of next year, cry for buffs/nerfs and then the cycle just repeats. SMH