I think to parry the power bomb unblockable you have to down parry while getting up. This way you will parry the aegis but get hit by the power bomb. This is good since the power bomb will knock you down again, but again I’m not sure what will happen after this part … I gotta rewatch some of recent vids with Ohnuki vs Uriens.
I believe so, but again nothing compared to Chuns.
Whered you get Ohnuki vs Urien vids? I only found a couple vids of him but none were vs Urien, this I wanna see.
I believe the recent KSK vision vids feature Ohnuki. On the player select screen where they display their names, his name should be written as Nuki if I’m not mistaken.
Oh btw, does anyone have any tips on how to do the super really fast? What I mean is say Chun is out of range of Ken’s c.mk and then you see Ken do a c.mk (this will of course whiff), then Chun can super Ken if done fast enough. Anyone have any tips on how to do it faster or is it just execution?
For me, at some points in the game while out of range of their moves, I will do a s.lp as well as one fireball motion to hide part of the super motion. If I see them whiff anything at round this time, I will do another fireball motion and confirm into super so I can punish their whiffed move. Anyone else have any other ways to “hide” the fireball motions?
I hide them while Im walking back and forth, I just pump the first fireball motion every now and then (not too far apart). Mostly just execution , always have the super in mind, if you know what I mean. Always be thinking about Houyokou-Sen lol.
Man I got destroyed by a Makoto today, that damn Karakusa is just too much. Anyone got advice for VS Makoto?
s.rh, c.jab and c.mk spam are your best friends vs makoto.
I have probs with this matchup as well but here are some of the things I do:
c.lp will beat out most karasuka attempts except for sometimes after a tick like s.mp -> karasuka. I’m not sure about the other ticks like c.lk…
Makotos like to jump a lot after you tick them with like c.lp or c.lk so a counter to their jump would be a tick like c.lp or c.lk into c.mk -> super. This way if they try to jump they will get hit by the c.mk.
When Makotos jump/jump cross up on me, I usually just block and when they land I’ll do an option select (crouch back down + c.lp + c.lk). This way if they go for a karasuka after the jump the c.lp will hit them. If they went for an attack I believe that you won’t get hit if the option select was timed right. I still have to lookup on this though so this isn’t 100% yet.
Against the c.lk tick, I will also try the option select.
Against the s.mp tick, I thinks its a guess whether they will karasuka or not. If i guess its a karasuka then i jump. If not I block high because a lot of Makotos will do the EX overhead attack. Anyone else have any better strategies against these ticks?
I do fine against a Makoto that stays on the ground, but I have lots of trouble against Makotos that keep on jumping at me and crossing up. The only way i can get away is by dashing or parrying but when they mix up the timing by doing the special dive kick or the mk then I can’t parry that well.
I’m afraid to spam like s.hp, back+hp, c.mk too much because I’m afraid if it whiffs that Makotos can easily just dash in during the recovery and karasuka or combo me.
Those are the things I do vs Makoto but like I said this is also a problem matchup for me so I don’t think all of the above r totally correct.
Thats good advice. A problem I have is when I go for the cr.Jab to beat out Karakusa I get hit with an Oroshi that was started before I even threw the jab cause he sees it coming and mixes up very well. I get a Karakusa for every Hayate, SA2 with the full follow up every time a Karakusa hits when he has meter, and to top it off this guy parries like a beast.
Makoto is probably my worst matchup, I have trouble with Urien but Im learning him , so things should get easier. Yun gives me problems sometimes too but his stamina is so weak that once I catch him with somthing I pound on him mercilessly. Makoto is a different story, I SUCK at using her, so I dont really have a feel for how she works, even though I know her as far as Theory Fighter goes lol.
The only person in this game that gives me as much trouble as Makoto is Ken, but thats a topic for a different day. Chun vs Ken probably needs its own topic really.
I wanted to let everyone know (or anyone who doesnt know already) about an interesting property of the last hit of SA2. Its not useful, as you have to whiff the super , but its pretty cool and can catch an opponant if you happen to miss the super. If say, you do the super dry and they jump over it (dont do that) , and they dash in behind you to go for a throw or a super they will get launched by the last hit of the super if theyre close enough. Im guessing that the hit box of the last hit was designed for just this reason, kinda like Yuns f + Fierce.
if you look at the SBO3 (in a thread in fighting game discussion) vids where ohnuki plays deshiken, you can count the number of times that ohnuki uses far fierce on one hand. and it makes sense if you think about it.
most ken’s get their knockdowns from sweeps after they bait a far standing fierce, then they mix shit up to get damage post-knockdown.
it’s easy to say that you should only use far standing fierce as a whiff punisher, BUT that’s a whole lot easier said than done.
ohnuki would do a nice little mixup after a low short also. VERY simple and old, but still effective and most people don’t do it enough. get a close blocked low short, then either…
A- kara throw
B- far standing fierce
C- low forward into super
if they just block, A gets them. if they parry forward expecting B, they eat C. B wins if they parry low.
peace
Great post, cr.LK is one of my favorite moves, second only to cr.MK. Thats good advice (not throwing the st.Fierce against Ken unless punishing), Im gonna try and remember that in the future, cause youre right Kens game revolves around his mixups, and waking up with Chun isnt always fun (hey we cant EX all the time lol!).
Ohnuki is an awesome player, Ive got about 5 vids with him, probably the smartest Chun Ive seen.
I am having trouble against Ken lately too.
When chun has no meter and they spam the c.hk from max distance and make chun block it, chun can’t counter it. I try to keep my distance so that I am out of the c.hk range but by doing this I always end up in the corner pretty fast and thats where I don’t know how to fight Ken because I can no longer walk back out of his range.
Anyone got any strats to fight Kens in general? Thx
Some basic stuff vs Ken:
-Punish cr.MK with cr.MK, he likes to throw this out all the time, but ours is better.
-Try to learn to parry his crossup on reaction. Blocking it is ok but puts you right back where you started from and most likely youll bet a tick throw or a short short super or somthing.
-Watch out for the back+MK overhead on wakeup, this is one of his favorite mix ups. Also watch for the regular overhead, short short super, a crossup that hits right as you wake up, or pretty much anything else in his bag of tricks.
-Careful with your EX SBK. If he ducks it youll eat a super every time. Use it once in a blue moon.
-This wont happen much in high level play but obviously, if your opponant gets excited and whiffs a SRK, punish it with a super or a throw if you dont have meter.
-Stay out of the air. Only jump to meet him, and even then only if you know you can hit him, like if hes committed to a move. Hit him with fierce fierce , an air throw (kara if you can), or falling roundhouse. If you jump in be prepared to parry either SRK or air EX hurricane, itll be one or the other almost every time, unless he expects your parrying and waits for you to land and throws or whatever.
Pretty basic stuff, sorry probably not much help, but I thought Id post the basics for the benefit of new players. Most Kens that I play like to rush, and Kens damn good at it as Im sure you all know. Keep in mind that hes always going to be trying to move towards you, and that more often than not he has a Shippu stocked.
Sorry if thats not much help, this matchup gives me as many if not more problems than Makoto even. I have an easier time dealing with Yun Urien and Dudley, theyre hard but theyve got their weaknesses. Ken is , in my opinion, the most balanced character in the game, he can do absolutly anything.
One final thought, if you cant parry the crossup, dash under it, or walk if you see it coming, and counter with a cr.MK xx you-know-what:)
If anyones got Ken strats, no matter how basic they may seem, please throw em out there.
edit: heres somthing I forgot, as Ken is waking up, walk towards him so that youre walking right into his fallen body. as he wakes up, block. If you predicted correctly, he’ll whiff an srk, which you can punish. However, if he suspects this, youll get thrown, and then crossed up or mixed up, so dont use this all the time.
this is tricky but you can hit Ken with SA2 as hes putting his hands back to throw out a fireball (they shouldnt be doing this but I see it all the time). Also (for the benefit of those new to Chun), pass through the fireball with SA2 to hit him as hes recovering. You have to know the range of the Houyokou-Sen to use this correctly, if youre too far away he will have recovered, and will block or parry your super.
Watch out for him trying to cross you up with air EX hurricane kick. This isnt the best way to use this move, but it is effective cause its kinda hard to see if it will cross up cause it goes so fast. Dash forward if he does this move and youre on the ground.
If Ken makes the mistake of taunting within SA2 range (Ive seen people get excited after a big combo or an air EX hurricane xx srk, and theyll taunt a liiiiiittle too far into Chuns waking up). This is a funny punishment situation, and one that I dont see very often as most of the Kens I play against are very good, but if you ever do see it take the opportunity by the balls since the taunt is so fast and you dont want to miss your chance.
Like I was saying before Ken rushes all the time, so hes constantly dashing forward. If you see him make one too many dashes Kara throw him (or regular throw if youre in range, as it is a bit faster). SA2 might hit but his dash is so quick that if you mistime it it will be blocked or even parried. Again you wont see this too much but in the heat of a match its easy to make a small error, even for the best players.
Remember Ken is constantly moving forward so hes not in the best position to block. Thats just one of those things about SF: If you turtle, youll be safer but not deal as much damage, if you rush youll deal hella damage but be wide open. While Ken isnt as open as some people he still leaves himself open sometimes.
Oh and about that standing RH. I hate that move too man that thing is annoying. The way I think of this move: There are 3 stages to the move:Startup, where hes positioning himself to throw the kick out, hitbox where the hitbox is there, and recovery where his foot comes down to the ground. Go into training and practice punishing him with SA2 when hes in stage 3 of the move. Thats really all I can think of to deal with that move outside of parrying, or getting lucky with a kioken but I rarely use that move outside of combos.
A lot of this is easier said than done, Ken is fast and once hes gotten a knockdown he is annoying as all hell and its hard to strategize when hes right in your face all the time. Just keep all this in mind and practice VS him in training. I play Ken at home sometimes just to help me understand what he’s capable of. It helps to know every one of his moves as if they were your own. Just somthing to think about.
Ill post more as I learn more :karate:
My problems with Makoto are increasing exponentially, this guy I play every week just keeps getting better and better. The guessing games, the endless Karakusas, and the DIZZIENESS are just killing me, Im repeatedly getting destroyed by Makoto. If anyone wants to help me with some strats Id be much obliged, I hate being dominated by a character, I fare better against Ken now than I do Makoto lol.
whiff pokes beats makoto for free
you can charge partition kicks for lightning kicks. if you are building meter with back fierce or st.strong or whatever… double tap or triple tap a kick during each animation. then when you go for a back fierce or st.strong or whatever just double tap that same kick button or buttons you were tapping (if you want ex) and lightning kicks will come out… its useful for anti airing people who like to jump in and parry whatever you try to anti air them with… i believe if they parry the back fierce and every hit of the lightning kicks they will be pushed out of your range somehow and you will be safe anyways… im not sure if this is true for st.strong into lightning kicks…
if somebody already posted something like this than disregard it.
Ive never heard that, thats sick Im gonna have to try that out.
edit:I was thinking about your post last night as I went to sleep, I think you meant kara cancel, not partition, as the lightning kick isnt a charge move.
makoto fears back+hp.
but she can sweep you at max range if you whiff.
but it would surely stop her dash in’s.
now she’ll try jumping. get your anti-air ready. i sometimes use st.forward as an AA.
do back+hp then do a fierce hadouken and buffer another QCF, then drum all the kicks on reaction if she gets hit.
this strategy alone will leave makoto helpless
whatever you call it… all it is is just getting a few kicks stored up so when you mash the kicks off of back fierce or standing strong it will come out easier… honestly i dont know the term for it… but its not a kara… ghengiskhang told me one time that it will push them out of your range if they parry the whole thing… so its a pretty safe bet assuming they wanna jump in and go for a parry…
also… im sure you might all know this but just for reference ill post it anyways…
on people who like to dash in on you a lot or whatever… coughmakotocough when you have meter… staying out of range so that your c.forward or back fierce or standing strong or whatever doesnt connect… usually i go with back fierce and c.forward (however you can just late cancel the c.forward but if youre lazy try this…). and everytime you do a back fierce/c.forward/etc… input the super motion and drum your fingers across the kicks… what happens is… since youre doing the super while youre still in the back fierce/c.forward/standing strong/etc. animation nothing happens… but if they so much as dash in, walk in, try to attack or whatever… the chances are they are going to get hit or beat out if they try an attack… and since you put the super in they will eat a super… its kind of a way to “hit confirm” your attacks… try it with back fierce… it works really well… like if you tech a throw… do standing strong and buffer the super off of it… the range off of a teched throw is just out of standing strong’s range so if they so much as flinch they will eat a super… NOTE* if they tech your throw or vice versa when one of you is with their back to the corner this range is not the same so itd be dangerous to attempt it then… you might just whiff a super and get owned for it…
actually nanitaberu just posted this last segment of mine… i just clarified…
Oh I see what youre saying , heh that is like a partition, I was just thrown off cause when I think of partitions I think charging, never thought of it that way, thats a good idea.
As for Makoto, good tips people, I gotta say though, back Fierce alone wont stop this Makoto. It does its job, thats for sure, but the guy I play has got her mixup game down and I often times dont see the dash coming.
As for anti air, I rarely use the standing forward (I do use it , just not much cause it gets parried if I use it more than like 2 times per match). He likes to jump in a lot without attacking trying to bait out an attack to parry > karakusa > that massive combo.
I find myself eating crouching short a lot, into Hayate > Karakusa > etc, and when I throw out my own cr.short or jab I usually get an overhead or Orochi(not sure if I spelt it right) if they can.
I dunno, I just need practice against Makoto, and its hard to practice cause hes the only Makoto player I play regularly, and I cant catch a break from him lol. I guess its good, itll bring my skill up in the long run, but any more strats vs Makoto would be great, particularly how to throw a monkey wrench into her mixup (back fierce works great for rushdown stopping but often shes right on top of me and I dont have time for a back fierce). Thanks though for the advice.