Character choice

Classic Fighting Games SSF2T: HD Remix
1

So, this is mostly just me thinking aloud, but I figured I’d post it up here to see what some of the experts have to say. I’m bouncing between a few characters right now: Ryu (my longtime standby – who I’m admittedly not too great with even after 16 years playing SF2), Dee Jay, Dhalsim, Chun Li, Honda, and Bison (dictator). I’m considering the following factors as I mull over who to stick with in HD Remix:

STRENGTHS:

  1. My execution is MUCH more accurate when I’m playing a charge character, as opposed to a motion character.

  2. I am very comfortable utilizing a character’s useful normals. This probably sounds like a pretty stupid point, but I’m not one of those dorks that likes to spam tons of special moves and ignore the rest of a given character’s repertoire.

  3. I love slide moves, as I’m good at making people land on them. I sometimes get a little overzealous and wind up getting punished on block (I’ve always been REALLY bad about this with Bison). I am improving in this regard, though.

  4. I’m pretty good at predicting jump-ins and proactively punishing them with my own jumping attacks. This tends to go hand-in-hand with point #3.

  5. I’m OK at crossing people up when I have a good opportunity to do so.

  6. I like to think I use my supers intelligently; I’m an opportunist when it comes to these, though it helps to have a super that’s virtually guaranteed to connect without too much pinpoint accuracy (I find that Chun Li’s is pretty easy to whiff, for example).

  7. I’m really good at playing mix-up games with projectiles – throwing out fast ones and baiting my opponent into jumping into a slow one, etc.

  8. When I’m using someone with a really good poke (like Chun Li’s st.MP), I’m not shy about walking up and smacking someone with it a few times. This is often more effective than I expect it to be.

WEAKNESSES:

  1. I tend to play in an overcautious way, as I feel that I’m at my best when punishing ill-timed jump-ins and other mistakes, rather than going for a total rushdown approach. I dunno if this counts as either a strength or a weakness; it sort of just… is.

  2. As a byproduct of point #1, I feel much more confident when I’m playing someone with a useful projectile attack. I sometimes panic and throw them out at close range when I clearly shouldn’t, but I am getting better about not doing this.

  3. Also as a byproduct of #1, I have a tendency to get backed into a corner, so good escape options and easy anti-air are a must.

  4. I’m currently not that great when it comes to timing tick throws, but I am improving.

  5. I don’t feel that I’m ever going to master the art of executing crazy combos.

  6. I have a tendency to block down-back a lot more than I should (this is heavily linked to my “I get cornered a lot” problem). This is something I need to teach myself to not do so much, but then again, thanks to this tendency I feel safer when using a character with good crouching normals (Ryu’s cr.HP can sometimes be a lifesaver for me). This is probably not a crucial factor since it’s endemic to a very bad shortcoming that I don’t want to encourage…but I am just throwing it out there.

Thoughts? Advice?

(edited a bit in response to skankin garbage’s reply)

2

First of all, I’m no expert, but I do like to think I know a fare ammount for ST.

With that said, Guile seems more up your alley… Dee Jay aims for a cross up most times on a knockdown, but seeing as you like to be more cautious with your approach, you can just throw a meaty slow sonic boom, and follow that in, for a free mix up opputunity (new overhead, throw or low). And he may not have a slide attack, but he doesn’t really need one. And his new roundhouse flashkick is a killer move. Can stuff fireballs at midrange if timed correctly.

3

Instead of considering your weaknesses when picking a character, why not think about your strengths, pick a character which augments them, and then fix your weaknesses? “I get backed into corners often” isn’t a really good thing to consider when picking a character.

4

I’m by no means an expert, but every requirement you listed except the projectile is filled nicely by Claw. He’s a charge character that focuses more on pokes and punishing mistakes, he has wall dives and rolls to escape the corner, he has a slide, and there’s no crazy combos necessary for you to worry about.

Honorary mention to Guile, as Hisham previously mentioned.

5

Yes, good points for sure. I edited my list a bit to better clarify what I feel are my strengths and weaknesses.

Interesting that Guile’s gotten a couple mentions so far. Vega (claw) too, although his playstyle’s always come off a bit too manic for my tastes. Maybe I’m just overthinking it. :slight_smile:

6

Although I am no expert, here is my take:

Admittedly, I am a Guile fanboy, but you truly do sound like you would like him. Here are some comments in response to your strengths and weaknesses. I could elaborate much more, but I tried to keep it simple.

Granted, you would need to spam sonic booms all the time. In fact, being able to throw them out like a machine gun is necessary. However, Guile only has two special moves, yet many additional normal attacks to compensate. The knee bazooka, sobat and overhead come to mind.

Guile’s flash kick is the ultimate anti-air, plus he has other good defensive attacks.

You can basically use Guile’s super as an anti-air on reaction whenever you would do a regular flash kick. It is really good and does great damage, plus it’s now much easier to execute than in ST.

Guile is an uber turtle. You would actually be rewarded for this style of play… which you can’t say about many characters in the game.

It doesn’t get much more useful than the sonic boom, as far as projectiles are concerned.

Tick throws are a good tool to use with Guile, walking behind your sonic boom… you can bait reversals and punish them if they expect you to throw.

Now to worry, Guile doesn’t use many combos. He does have useful ones such as j. lk, c. mp, flash kick, for instance.

Blocking down-back enables you to charge both of Guile’s special moves, plus use useful normals.

Now to point out why you should not use the characters you mentioned:

Bison and Honda are best played aggressively and they do not have projectiles.

Dee Jay uses cross-ups a lot, and is the ultimate combo master. Plus, his super does require much precision, especially if used as part of a combo.

You might have a hard time with the execution of Ryu’s moves. Although his fireball game is great, much aggression must also be used.

You mentioned how you thought Vega’s style was too manic, which I think indicates that Chun Li might not fit the bill either.

Dhalsim: Actually, I think you might like Dhalsim a lot. Aside from the execution of his teleport, his special moves are easy to use (at least easier than DP motions, if that was your concern). You would enjoy his unequalled amount of normal moves (drills, extended/retracted limbs). He has a slide and can punish jumps in many ways. Dhalsim is the ultimate poker. You would not have to worry about cross-ups, combos and tick throws (for the most part). You would have a lifetime of mastering ahead of you, as Dhalsim is very hard to master, yet is a very rewarding character… not that I play him, mind you. :stuck_out_tongue:

In conclusion, I would recommend either Guile or Dhalsim.

7

Cool, thanks Djister. Yeah, I know Bison’s the dictionary definition of a pressure character, and I’ve definitely noticed the precision required for Dee Jay’s super. I’ve essentially been playing Dee Jay as though he’s Guile, except his maximum jackknife isn’t always that great in terms of anti-air.

And yeah, I think Dhalsim’s a pretty interesting character; I’ve always loved his arsenal of really good normal moves, and the awesome keep-away games he can play. One thing that drives me nuts about him is how goddamn easy it is to get thrown if I don’t time my drills absolutely perfectly. Oh, and input motions aren’t a problem for me, per se; I’m perfectly capable of executing moves like DPs, but my execution isn’t 100%, despite years of practice.

Oddly, Guile and Dhalsim were the first characters I tried to learn way back in the original SF2, before I finally settled on Ryu for reasons that escape me. Essentially, I like the power of Ryu’s spacing abilities, but I feel that charge characters are more compatible with my brain.

8

…so let’s narrow down your preferences, using your strengths as a base.

STRENGTHS:

1. My execution is MUCH more accurate when I’m playing a charge character, as opposed to a motion character.

GUILE, DEE JAY, CHUN LI, HONDA, BLANKA, DICTATOR, CLAW, BOXER

2. I am very comfortable utilizing a character’s useful normals. This probably sounds like a pretty stupid point, but I’m not one of those dorks that likes to spam tons of special moves and ignore the rest of a given character’s repertoire.

ALL CHARGE CHARACTERS HAVE USEFUL NORMALS

3. I love slide moves, as I’m good at making people land on them. I sometimes get a little overzealous and wind up getting punished on block (I’ve always been REALLY bad about this with Bison). I am improving in this regard, though.

DEE JAY, BLANKA, VEGA

4. I’m pretty good at predicting jump-ins and proactively punishing them with my own jumping attacks. This tends to go hand-in-hand with point #3.

GUILE, CHUN LI, BLANKA, DICTATOR

5. I’m OK at crossing people up when I have a good opportunity to do so.

GUILE, BLANKA, DEE JAY, HONDA, DICTATOR

6. I like to think I use my supers intelligently; I’m an opportunist when it comes to these, though it helps to have a super that’s virtually guaranteed to connect without too much pinpoint accuracy (I find that Chun Li’s is pretty easy to whiff, for example).

BOXER (end of discussion, lol)

7. I’m really good at playing mix-up games with projectiles – throwing out fast ones and baiting my opponent into jumping into a slow one, etc.

GUILE, DEE JAY, CHUN LI

8. When I’m using someone with a really good poke (like Chun Li’s st.MP), I’m not shy about walking up and smacking someone with it a few times. This is often more effective than I expect it to be.

CHUN LI, VEGA, DICTATOR

so…in summary, here’s what you have, based on chargers:

Chargers…

Vega: excellent normals + great slide + excellent normals + super-frustrating to play against + top tier (or top-mid)
Dee Jay: excellent normals + Fireball + godly crossup into crazy damaging combos + ok slide + mid tier
Boxer: his super + insane rushdown + crazy mix-ups + top tier

take your pick.

9

actually, Dee Jay’s short Jack Knife upkicks are GREAT. and he’s definitely NOT GUILE!

Dictator is mostly 75% offense. If you can maintain pressure, he’s fun with tons of tricks.

Dhalsim has a great offense and defense; all his normals are useful.

Guile is a complete and balanced character.

10

I’ve been playing Guile like mad on XBLA, and I almost feel like I’ve been lying to myself with Ryu for 16 years when I shoulda just stuck with Guile in the first place. I dunno how to explain it, but I feel like all those years of Street Fighter knowledge have finally clicked.

11

Beautifully put! I am very glad to hear that! Only one question remains, then…

Are you man enough to fight with me? :wink:

12

Reading your strengths and preferences, Playing Vega (Claw) immediately sprang to my mind, with the exception of the projectile issue.

You said yourself however that you sometimes throw them at the wrong time.

Vega is great in that he has AWESOME normals, a great slide (not as good as blanka or Dhalsim), a great reversal/anti air move (flipkicks), and easy ways to get around fireballs (wall dives, fast jump).

Vega was certainly great at “easy mode” in ST. New players can win with him very easy. That said, veterans still get a whole lot of use out of him, notice Graham Wolfe using him on occasion.

I vote vega.