naah, its not different, its the same concept, expend bar for locking down, then grounded hurricane > xfc > tk hurricane
no because yours they have an escape route, his uses a dhc to prevent escape yours they have more escape options. His also works anytime you are in the corner not just on an incoming character. Also Ive known about the OS to option select your grab with xfactor or DHC literally FOREVER, ever since I first saw abegen pull stupid might spark ticks into she hulk, I also knew you could literally do that OS anytime you went for a grab, simple GRAB xx Super, XX super… his setup into it is the interesting part, its a different setup then yours and uses the idea of dhcing from a delayed super like rocks to set it up.
@chief: I figured out the Gamma Quake into Mighty Punish setup on my own a while ago when I was playing my Hulk/Thor/Cap team but I didn’t even think to XFC and air Mighty Hurricane if I miss the MP, so good find on your part thumbs up.
So i have been playing and practicing Thor(mighty smash)/Raccoon(pendulum)/Vergil(rapid slash) all this week, i think i can do a brief review now, its indeed a contender for top5 Thor team:
Neutral game
Thor has absolute ground control. Mighty strike + log trap means log trap will probably have unstoppable durability, every hit of mighty strike will confirm into a wall bounce for easy s.S or s.L or jump > airdash df > cr.L confirm. mighty spark L + log trap is not that potent but if the spark is delayed slightly after of a raccoon call, then the character will be in hitstun enough time for log trap to hit. Mighty spark L + rapid slash > mighty spark M is the go to zoning/chip tool at fullscreen distance. rapid slash push characters to the corner so its both good as a gtfo assist, and as a corner pressure tool. When Thor has 2 bars he can easy confirm every mighty strike hit with strike > j.L > spark L > mighty tornado > mad hopper (RR Trap) > hard tag to Thor > charged strike, etc
the blockstun of log trap on block allow thor to sj > addf > j.L/j.H > cr.L/hurricane mixups
R.Raccoon with mighty smash/rapid slash is a camper. Wont go into details about it, but its very effective against the most of the characters once a Mad hopper is out. I havent explored much his THC with dimension slash
Vergil + mighty smash and log trap is pretty good too, but again, wont go into details
Combos
They touch, they kill. This part is tricky though, since Thor has to reserve hitstun so that mighty smash H > rapid slash > H charged strike, etc works. rapid slash has less fixed hitstun than coldstar in long combos, and yeah, coldstar fixed hitstun sucks so Thor/Rapid slash is a finicky combination in combos, one mistake and it drops
thor can use log trap for SSS enders as well. But what i love about this team is how Thor can end a combo with mighty tornado, then dhc to mad hooper (L+H) then hard tag and continue with another SSS, repeat, etc lol
raccoon has nice damage and meter charge in the corner, DHC to spiral swords means TOD damage, and Vergil is Vergil
Incoming mixups
Every time Thor kill with mighty tornado and has 1 extra bar to expend, he can DHC to rocket raccoon mad hopper, then dash forward + boulder trap, then hard tag to thor again. This is an unblockable setup and its really hard to avoid as long as the player dont mess up
Charged strike M + rapid slash is a great method to add pressure for a character getting in, strike M will crossup if its slightly delayed and it will go through any character normal/airdash. rapid slash also negate pushblock if its timed well allowing a mighty hurricane in the face of the character after he/she/it is out of blockstun
Log trap + superjump addf j.H is a great method to crossup/fake crossup as well, but the confirms must be finicky
Raccoon + Vergil, wont go into details, but they have inblockables, 50/50 mixups, etc
Matchups/surviving
I really dont think this team has a “bad matchup” overall, more like some weaknesses that Thor/Dorm/Doom and Thor/Strange/Ammy can cover better. While Thor/Raccoon/Vergil has mighty control of the ground (probably much better ground control than the other teams), the air-space is kind of weak. Raccoon and Vergil doesnt really beat people laming out at sj.height. I had some trouble with a Trish/Morrigan/Phoenix team, but then i picked Thor/Dorm/Doom and won almost every match.
When thor gets randomed out and the other player start a combo, the only way to kill Thor will probably be with TACs (nobody really have damage to kill Thor as long as he start with 1150k-1250k health). So when Thor recovers (and if survive reset attempts), Thor can get out with mighty tornado or mighty punish, then DHC to mad hopper to recover some health. Mighty smash M as a crossover assist is amazing for raccoon when he is in trouble, so this team works pretty well as a whole
Comebacks
Raccooon sucks at comebacks. If he has meter he can set unblockable setups, but the problem for him is getting a hit; random log traps can work, but people will eventually catch on the matchup and wont get hit by it every again. His low health also means he will die easy from chip. His camping skills can help him to gradually kill other characters, but he needs a lead to win
Vergil is the king of comebacks so in that regard this team is balanced.
Thor is so-so at comebacks. He is solid enough to make solo comebacks, but the lack of a speed boost with XF is stupid bad for him.
Overall thoughs
Amazing team. Weak airspace control, top tier ground control, neutral game and incoming mixups. This can be much better against some of the hard matchups for Thor than Thor/Strange/Ammy and Thor/Dorm/Doom (Nemesis, Wesker, Nova, maybe Spencer and Vergil, etc) but worst against some others (Dormammu + zoning friends, Amaterasu THCs, lame girls, Modok, etc)
lol@brief review
You should of recorded those and post them in the Video thread.
Anyone making use of Thors tac glitch? Also I’ve been working on what type of shenanigans I could make use of canceling the recovery frames of M.Spark :h: with Thors Mighty Speech since it makes him recover before the spark shoots out. I’ll see what it can do on incoming characters.
There’s not much because you’re not canceling the recovery frames of H Spark because H Spark has no recovery frames. You’re canceling the active frames which is 45. Mighty Speech itself is 40 frames of startup and recovery combined. So if done perfectly on both sides, you’re only speeding up Thor’s next action by 5 frames.
I actually found a legit use for mighty speech. for incoming mixups :3
- character is about to get in and Thor is in the corner
- Thor start charging mighty strike H/M + call rapid slash
- character get in
3.1 Thor cancel with mighty speech, in other words rapid slash insta crossup the incoming character, thor recovers and confirm
3.2 Thor doesnt cancel anything and just mighty strike M/H that *****
Not to be a nudge but you do realize that you only block in terms of the point character no matter the assist?
rapid slash has a ridiculous hitbox above that hit incoming characters
One, I know and two, that doesn’t change what I said.
well, u’re dumb then, thor staying right below the incoming character in the corner means he will be insta crossup with rapidslash the moment thor cancel mighty strike. Its a mindgame, very similar to what PR Rog do with Wolvie + Rapid Slash, and to the Zero Lightning then dash backward incoming mixup
Interesting Mighty Punish stuff. For my team, Haggar Thor Hulk (played in various orders depending on matchup), there are some pretty cool DHCs.
For Thor/Haggar/Hulk: MP, dhc just before the ding noise at the top to Haggar rapid fire fist, Haggar hits the opponent with the last hit of the super which ground bounces, then do normal Haggar post-ground bounce combo into the corner and while building an additional bar to do about 1.1 million iirc.
For Thor/Hulk/Haggar: MP, dhc just after Thor throws the opponent up to Hulk gamma tsunami which whiffs, opponent is still in the air, juggle Hulk st mp toward+mp into normal Hulk combo that builds a bar, moves the opponent to the corner, and does a million plus.
Nice stuff, I’ve been playing this team and the only problem I have is good mid screen damage with haggar, but I need to try some more combo variations. In general though its a fun team to play for sure.
Still working on Thor doom/strange Ammy.
Probably known but it looks like you can pick with strange off the THC without needing graces by punting them back up as the last lightning bolt hits. It’s semi hard to get a great follow up, but at least it’s there. Fun teams, now I just to get my mud screen dhs to stalking flare combos down more for even more damage.
I’ve been trying out Thor/Dante/Doom as opposed to my normal Thor/Strange/Doom team, and I’m really loving it so far.
Dante has excellent synergy with Thor. My Dante is very new, and as he’s a fairly complex combo character I’m sure I can optimize his combos further, but I’ve managed to get 1,050,000 off a Mighty Punish DHC to Devil Trigger, which I’m very happy with. Of course Strange can do the same while also building loads of meter, but my execution isn’t the best and I personally had trouble converting big damage mid screen, and even in the corner I found it a bit difficult to land consistently, especially online where I’m stuck playing now. The follow up with Dante is incredibly easy.
Dante also allows a combo off Thor’s air throw (from any height) by doing a Mighty Hurricane into Devil Trigger, which again Strange could do but to get anything significant he had to use XFactor, where with Dante I can get around 700k (again, likely unoptimized) without XFactor, or TAC back to Thor for the infinite.
Dante to Thor DHCs mid-screen are an issue, however in the corner it’s perfectly fine. I feel Strange had the reverse issue, DHCing mid-screen was fine, but in the corner didn’t give you much, so I think this is a fair trade-off.
Thor to Dante DHCs require a slight bit of combo modification to optimize, you need to use your Mighty Hurricane while on the ground as opposed to the air, as this results in the enemy falling all the way to the floor instead of popping out in the air, allowing for a full hit DHC into Dante’s gun super. This may pose an issue for certain teams, but it’s fine with a slight combo tweak with my Hidden Missiles combo extensions. I found the damage numbers DHCing into Dante’s gun super to be roughly equal if not slightly higher than a DHC into Strange’s Spell of Vishanti.
Another early concern with the team is Thor’s standard happy birthday combo ends in an air Mighty Hurricane, but I think with an optimized Devil Trigger follow up this still may be equal or better than DHCing to Spell of Vishanti.
Then there’s the issue of assists. A lot of people love Strange’s bolts with Thor. I agree it’s a fantastic assist for him, however since my other assist, Hidden Missiles, is incredibly slow, having bolts gave me a 2nd slow assist, making it very difficult to call anything up close. I’m currently using Weasel Shot assist with Dante and loving it, it’s fast, provides decent lockdown and doesn’t scale the combos too hard, and it also hits a downward angle, so it’s great against characters that could’ve ducked bolts, and especially those that can duck both bolts AND Mighty Spark. In the end I may swap assists around if I feel it’s better for the team as a whole, but currently I’m running Spark/Weasel Shot/Hidden Missiles, as I feel it’s the best for Thor himself, and decent enough overall.
TL;DR: Thor/Dante is a solid pair, really enjoying it – I’d like to hear your thoughts on the duo as I haven’t seen it really mentioned.
A bit confused about this part.
You say Dante can combo off a Thor’s air throw. You’re talking about the Mighty Hurricane command grab throw in the air, and not Thor’s regular air throw, right?
I know on the ground, any regular grab from Thor can lead to a hard tag for an unscaled combo.
I’m thinking he means to do regular airthrow, aerial Mighty Tornado (whiff) DHC into Devil Trigger to continue the combo.
Oh, that’s kinda cool.
he was talking about airgrab then land > Mighty Punish > DHC to DT > OTG or air Mighty Tornado > DHC to DT > OTG
Serp you’ve mentioned before that there is an unblockable grab setup with thor in xfactor. Do mind elaborating on that or showing me a video to it. I just can’t seem to find it.