Breathless... SUPER Abel Match Theory Thread

[MixupMaster]

abels ultra two make rolling a better option forsure.once i rolled under someone as the jumped back which in vanilla meant you were eating a jump in or blocking but i just ultra’d him on his way down lol

[Renegade]

I just wanted to pop in to say that Abel’s Ultra 2 might just be the best ultra in the game. Also funny how it does a better job of replicating the functionality (specifically, mind fuckery) of Ryu’s 3S Denjin Hadouken than Gouken’s Ultra 2, as wierd as that might sound.

Rose’s Ultra two says hi.

[HAV]

Breathless is nowhere near being the best ultra in the game. I don’t think it’s Abel’s best ultra.

[electric]

Breathless is nowhere near being the best ultra in the game. I don’t think it’s Abel’s best ultra.

+1. Give it a few months and I honestly doubt it’ll be used that often, outside of a few match ups. It’s just the current hot gimmick it seems. It has it’s uses, but from what I’ve seen and experienced, it’s just not as versatile as U1.

[sakeido]

I disagree. Breathless is really, really good and is useful in every matchup.

Just having that option available is valuable as HAV mentioned before, being able to control the timing is very nice and canceling it altogether is just a bonus. That it has a hit of super armor makes it better… that it covers almost the full screen makes it even better… but its the speed that makes it really great. Any time somebody does anything while Abel has Breathless, they take a serious risk.

It loses to armor breakers, sure, but generally the only move a character has that both breaks armor and is invincible on startup is their own ultra. A lot of other armor breakers are too slow to punish Breathless on reaction and you will get to throw their startup. It stops jump outs better than Soulless… they can’t even change their jump arc to get away from it.

I dunno guys. I think it is a legitimately great ultra… best one in the game is probably still Seth’s U1, though.

[Arkayne17]

Rose’s Ultra two says hi.

This : D

[Bakuhakubasugasu]

Breathless manual. If the opponent jumps, just Breathless and hold. Wait till foe almost hits ground and let go. Watch opponent ride the Abel train. Put a smile on your face.

Meh, I think this Ultra is amazing since a lot of people I play tend to jump away from getting hit from my meaty c.hp’s on wake-up and other pressure strings I do. It really keep’s the opponent grounded and Abel likes grounded foes. I still love U1 also though but I have been using U2 a lot more then U1.

[resres]

I’m starting to like U2’s uses though. I don’t think there is a favorable ultra in some matches. You can use either and still be relatively successful.

You know how when you first start out with Abel and you’re trying to learn how to combo into U1 but EX FS comes out? Right now with U2, EX roll keeps coming out whenever I want to punish someone’s jump in. lol

[Samurai_Drew]

I’m starting to like U2’s uses though. I don’t think there is a favorable ultra in some matches. You can use either and still be relatively successful.

You know how when you first start out with Abel and you’re trying to learn how to combo into U1 but EX FS comes out? Right now with U2, EX roll keeps coming out whenever I want to punish someone’s jump in. lol

Haha you know I’m having the exact same problem! Too many ex rolls instead of ultra 2…sigh

[Bakuhakubasugasu]

Haha you know I’m having the exact same problem! Too many ex rolls instead of ultra 2…sigh

Hit qcf(x2) thoroughly. Works for me every time. If you’re using joystick, you might be doing it too fast and not inputting everything. My buddy when he does it sometimes he gets one qcf and then a dp motion causing his ultra to not come out but instead he gets to roll. Just work on pressing it in better.

What is happening for me is when I reset with a c.hp>roll>c.lp>dash to other side>TT… Sometimes the buffer on my TT doesn’t get through and just a punch comes out. It gets pretty annoying even when I’m pressing it thoroughly. I think its because of some of the fixing they gave to Abel or the game in general.

[Pacifist]

U2 is sharp due to the opponent’s ignorance and mistakes. If they’re smart and play it safe, that ultra won’t do shit for you. If you get in there and get an elbow off, you’ll be wishing you had U1 instead.

Use what fits your playstyle though.

[pjj5001]

anyone have any strats against rose?

i think ive lost to every single rose ive played

i really have no idea on what to do against her

[pjj5001]

oh yea vega owns me for free and then some

[Pacifist]

I’ve been having trouble against Vega players as well, but it’s more of online dulling reactions for me. Abusing his wall dives with lag makes it tricky, especially since I know a sharp st. FP would knock it out.

[hlcws]

I
I dunno guys. I think it is a legitimately great ultra… best one in the game is probably still Seth’s U1, though.

“Best” or “Easiest to land”?
Seth U1 does zero dmg.

[Natty]

i’ve been having trouble against vega players as well, but it’s more of online dulling reactions for me. Abusing his wall dives with lag makes it tricky, especially since i know a sharp st. Fp would knock it out.

please note that this is not from me at all, props all go to sakeido

abel runs over vega so bad its ridiculous. Vega has to play the matchup in an extremely lame manner… It basically boils down to him running all the way to one side of the screen, waiting to get over your head, then running all the way back to the other wall. If i lose, its because i got impatient.

Use st.lk because vega’s pokes are shit. Be careful because his dh+rh punishes whiffed anything big time and that is an advantage-on-block move that sets up a 240 damage combo into scarlet terror, so some vegas like to just throw it out there and then mix up throw, low short, neutral jump type stuff. You can punish it with reversal standing close fierce sometimes. If he whiffs the df+rh, it has a lot of recovery, so hit him with f+mk combos. I use a lot of c.mk buffered cod in his matchup too because vega can’t punish a blocked strong cod unless he’s gdlk and can reversal throw you perfectly. His pokes don’t crouch the c.mk so i throw it out every once and awhile and hope he runs into it.
Ex cod is good until vega starts using a lot of his standing roundhouse, which is a pretty sick move. Destroys armor. You can’t focus against vega because of his roundhouse and also because he can just sit there and use ex wall dive to punish your dash out of focus. Most of his pokes are too fast to catch with abel’s focus anyway.
If he does rolling crystal flash, you can’t ultra the ball portion because he hits you out of it. But, it doesn’t always make a block string… Mash ex cod or ultra through it and you can interrupt it before the last hit sometimes. Vega can fadc out of rcf to make it safer vs. Mashing
vs. Most vegas i don’t even commit to big damage moves unless i’ve made him terrified of flipping. I do tons of the c.lk, c.lp, c.lp, c.lp, s.mp combo on him, jab into close strong, constantly ticking with normals. I punish back flips with cod or a jump in cod (for the long flip). His back dash is good so i use a lot of c.lk os sweep on his wakeup.
A nice gimmick is you can dash under vega on his wakeup. You can also put him in the corner almost any time after landing a c.fp by doing roundhouse roll into jab falling sky… Do a hcb as you cross under vega and tap jab as you stand up. Most vegas in the corner will try to jump out or wall dive out… Punish.
You can punish every single wall dive by rolling out then doing change of direction or ultra back towards vega.

Vega does have some nasty shenanigans. If he knocks you down with sweep or izuna drop close to a wall, he can just do izuna drop on you over and over again. Abel is easy to hit with it because he’s big and tall. The only way out is a very carefully timed back dash. Very few vegas are good enough to do this consistently enoguh to win though.

[HFX]

so besides rolling and blocking, abel cant do anything after blocking a seismo sjc burning kick?

[sakeido]

Natty, as an update to the Vega matchup - the recovery time on his wall dives has been buffed big time. You can still ultra them but the window to do so has shrunk. Vega’s U2 is also a great anti-air… its such a sick ultra! Love getting hit by it because of its extraordinary coolness :lol: If you jump deep enough, OR if you don’t press a button, the ultra most likely won’t catch you… the hitbox is not great.
Also, it hits low, goes almost full screen and charges very quickly. Be careful about rolling in the matchup if Vega is using U2.

“Best” or “Easiest to land”?
Seth U1 does zero dmg.

No, I meant best. Seth’s U1 was the best ultra in the game… even doing so little damage, it was borderline broken in SF4. I do believe it has been toned down in Super but I’m not positive. I probably should have checked that before I posted :lol:

[raeli]

so besides rolling and blocking, abel cant do anything after blocking a seismo sjc burning kick?

If they’re going to land infront of you, it’s a free FA level 2. I just roll out of the pressure.

[Natty]

Natty, as an update to the Vega matchup - the recovery time on his wall dives has been buffed big time. You can still ultra them but the window to do so has shrunk. Vega’s U2 is also a great anti-air… its such a sick ultra! Love getting hit by it because of its extraordinary coolness :lol: If you jump deep enough, OR if you don’t press a button, the ultra most likely won’t catch you… the hitbox is not great.
Also, it hits low, goes almost full screen and charges very quickly. Be careful about rolling in the matchup if Vega is using U2.

The vega glitch don’t work any more does it? I went to training mode for a short while and I couldn’t get it to work then again I never used it much so my timing might just be completely off. For those who have no clue what I’m talking about, check the vid.

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