If they are making latency adjustment settings in training, that is a sign that they KNOW there’s a problem, but are too lazy or don’t care enough to fix it proper. It’s akin to patching the knees on a pair of jeans and missing the gaping hole in the seat of the pants.
Telling us there is lag, embrace it is NOT a solution. It’s them trying to get us to accept an inferior product with the mentality of “well, at least I can practice for inferior netcode.” If they would actually work to mold GGPO for the games in question, this wouldn’t be a problem, and this thread wouldn’t exist.
And to anyone saying MVC3 isn’t bad online: People in Japan and Korea are complaining of lag too. These are countries where in SSF4 they could play people online between the two countries, and even Taiwan, rather flawlessly. These countries also have model internet infrastructures, with 50-100mbps connections in high concentration areas not only being commonplace, but as cheap or cheaper than 3mbps from Verizon/Frontier in America.
Yet in Korea, people from Seoul are mentioning noticeable lag issues while playing people in Busan, something that was definitely not happening in SF4, because like I mentioned before, they were able to play players in Japan just fine, so obviously inside Korea would be the same.
^I agree 100%, but the key to enacting change is knowing what the actual solution is. Right now we have nothing to offer the discussion besides that the situation is bad. An influential opinion from this community will explain not only that a problem exists, but that a clear and detailed solution is within grasp. If we do that, than the benefits of complaining become more tangible, and thus the community is more likely to join in. We need a political platform up in this bitch.
Soooooo, these are the questions we should be asking:
GGPO isn’t the solution I hear, than what is? What netcode is proven to be outstanding?
Can that netcode be implemented with next-gen game engines? Apparently yes but a comprehensive explanation would be nice.
Would this netcode be significantly more costly to implement?
ponder the ggpo creator and Namco have both said that GGPO works with 3d games. Its only Capcom that saying its not possible. This is also coming from the same company that hasn’t improved their net code since cvs2 and also prevent people knowing about the net code before it comes out. Quite a few people on srk were pretty pissed during the beta versions of mvc3 when they would hold it @ tournaments. People would walk up to the developers and ask about online net code only to be ignored.
Until proven otherwise, GGPO IS the solution, no other form of net code for fighting games comes even CLOSE.
as far as cost concerns go, I think that’s the ultimate stand off right now. Even if it cost them a little bit more to implement, they would probably increase the fuck out of their sales since everyone wants to be able to play online properly. They would be reimbursed from the increase in sales. Especially with games like this that are based on competitive nature, there is no reason it can’t rival FPS\RTS games in terms of sales. Its not that our scene isn’t competitive, we have it offline. However the FPS\RTS scenes have online\offline scenes and that’s why they’re bigger.
I don’t have any ideas about this subject. Just want to say the word code is singular noun. Couldn’t believe how many people commenting on the skullgirls article were saying things like
i read through literally every single page of comments on that article and im really proud since i dont think many people could physically stand to do that
There is only 3 choices Input Lag, Rollback, and a combination of the two for your netcode. Input lag aka the real latency it uses nothing to hide. Rollback how it works there is separate copies of the game running at the same time on different machines when ever it desyncs it Rolls back to a point where the game is in sync. You can combine the two and hide the syncing via the input lag. But there is more you can do to help the online be a better experience besides a better lobby systems and more features. You can actually rebalance the game to help accommodate for the lag.
the short version: Capcom is very lazy for just using straight input lag.
who the hell is talking shit about ggpo? Some people are just really ignorant when it comes to topics. For instance some people will call GGPO trash since it can’t handle 3s that well and think that is a direct comparison to GGPO when its not. CPS3 games on GGPO just don’t work very well, not because GGPO sucks but because there are some technical issues with the cps3 games. All the other games work fine.
Also if someone is talking shit about it, I usually ask them what games they play online and how long they’ve been playing fighting games. Once they answer, its never an experienced player calling GGPO trash. More often than not, its a sf4 player calling it trash when they have VERY little experience to begin with to make any kind of proper call.
GGPO doesn’t really force the input delay down your throat like with sf4\mvc3 online. Some of us prefer to keep our offline timing and GGPO can offer that. Sometimes @ the price of skipping frames but like I’ve been saying, no net code is perfect. People interpret that as bad net code too because sf4 is “smooth” online. That smoothness from sf4 comes from the input delay which GGPO offers. If you don’t care about input delay, turn the smoothing all the way up and it’ll look pretty fucking smooth online just like sf4. That’s also part of the reason GGPO is better. It offers both sides of the coin that we’re facing, input delay versus frame skipping\rollback. People get to choose the sf4 style net code or the GGPO style one on GGPO.
and if GGPO were really that bad, capcom wouldn’t have used it, BB wouldn’t have used it and Namco wouldn’t have used it since they could just make another piece of crap to replace it. There was a reason those companies opted to it, because it was better than anything else they put out on their own but for whatever reason, capcom just left it alone after final fight.
GGPO isn’t perfect, obviously. But it’s ridiculously good for a non-commercially developed network application. The basis is there to make it work pretty much as well as anything you could hope for with an actual publisher funding the extra work on a retail game. Myself by far the biggest issue is that it’s a finicky bugger when it comes to actually connecting. Then again so are Capcom’s games.
For some reason BBCS online is actually vaguely shitty, by the way. No idea why, CT had its iffy moments but CS is underwater unless I get a high bar connection that isn’t actually unstable as hell, which has happened roughly once ever. A lot of other people experienced the same downgrade, I don’t know if they tweaked it tighter for the Japanese market or what (and it worries me for AH3 as well, since apparently the import versions of that aren’t exactly god like online either)
well, considerig that there is less people playing BBCS compared to BBCT is not so surprising to have more iffy conections, and considering that ah3 has a way more smaller scene its no wonder there
But they’re treating the symptoms of the problem in that case, not the problem itself. Just trying to work around the problem seems like a bad idea in the long run.
Reminds me of Inafune’s rant about how the system basically encouraged the employees to aim for nothing other than mediocrity.