I think cr.hp is not good at all to use against divekicks on reaction, but it works if you use it as a read. Bullhorn is better, but not by much. Maybe j.lk? I dunno… cr.mp was godlike. Bullhorn works as a counter on midscreen to Cammy’s frame traps, for instance between st.mp > st.mp.
I was thinking on another thing, since penguin slide and overhead are unsafe on block, is it possible to space it not so bad and bait a counter punish with ex bullhorn or ex bullhead in vt? I’m travelling, can’t test myself.
People were simply stating that the crMP nerf makes dive kick match ups worse. I appreciate the Birdie love but you’d have to be delusional to not see a number of his matchups have gotten worse
I think he’s better season 2
you can still space slide and fHP
i can bullhorn divekicks and ex bullhorn no problem
his new combo capabilities are amazing and 250dmg AA is nothing to laugh at
i actually like him better than s1
I haven’t felt a ton of differences from the change to 3HP/f.HP, though I’m boggled that they made followups to the CC harder.
Bullhorn feels like it has a bit more stock now. The adjustment to cr.MP and the subsequent followups make the unchanged oki from Bullhorn more compelling for me. I still don’t really get what they were going for by removing the i1 armour on EX, since his hard metered 50/50 reversals were hardly too strong. Especially when they make the VT EX Bullhead safe out of nowhere…
I agree that the new HK>MP and cr.HP are wonderful to have. It’s tricky to get a solid aa with cr.HP all the time, but cr.HPxxBullheadxxCA is nothing to sneeze at. I’ve yet to squeeze more juice out of LK’s extra active frame, but I won’t look a gift horse in the mouth.
I like this Birdie better as well, but I feel like f.HP and EX Bullhorn could use a tune-up.
Birdie is way better in this season, in s1 you get outclassed in a lot of ways, look at his s1 bad match ups (nash, chunli. necalli, ken, guile) you died by pure rushdown,zoning or a mix of both, you had to play flawlessly in footsie range or going nuts with dolphin dives, dash>command grab, raw ex bull horns etc.
Now they nerfed a lot the old top tiers and gives birdie new tools (ex bull head (-2), s.mp(+1), better okizeme, better v.trigger, can) make him viable now. the only match up i think is very very hard for birdie right now is guile, everyone else look winnable to me.
the matter of fact you get your anti air nerfed a bit, when everyone anti air and dps gets nerfed so hard is a small change, specially against divekicks because now are unsafe on block or -2 most of the time (fixed) and even you get hit by them, you can survive longer in the corner than s1.
If you’re talking about Cammy dive kick it’s still plus on block if spaced right and most Cammy players believe she is better now. I’m also confused how you can think Birdie does better when cornered compared to s1? His defensive options were nerfed and grey life block string pressure was buffed.
laura match up is the absolute worse thing for this character…i would also say its a personal problem also because i fall for everything with that character.
I’m not sure what Birdies defensive options have to do with cammy getting her dp nerfed lol. I just don’t like the misinformation some in this sub forum like to spread is all. I also might be reading too much into your comment Pookie but if your a high level player I would like to see how you handle the matchups, pls don’t link online matches though lol.
Its partially incorrect. Her dive kick’s advantage on block changes depending on where she lands it (and theres something to be said about the difference in advantage when Birdie is crouched). Yes, with a well spaced EX-dive kick (or a HK dive kick - MUCH harder to do for the Cammy player), she is plus but in order to space it properly, she has to be a considerable distance away from Birdie and be able to land the dive kick on his lower body for it to be at frame advantage (The higher the kick lands, the less frame advantage she has). What does this mean in the grand scheme of things?
Her EX-dive kick is easier to react to if the player intends on trying to make the dive kick plus on block. If the Cammy wants to try and pressure you with it from up close and you block it, you are at advantage.
I’ve had success against her well spaced dive kick in both training mode and matches using cr. MP and cr.HP (not as much as in s1 but can still be useful if done early), EX bullhorn, V-reversal (1 Birdie v trigger bar in exchange for 1 EX of Cammys. Advantage Birdie) and…here is my wild card: st. LP.
st. LP is the fastest normal you can use to knock her out of her ex- dive kick if she uses it from a distance that will make her plus on block, hell you can even use it if she tries to do it up close. You’re going to have to practice it to get the timing down but it works. Worst case scenario is you trade with her.
Brain dead mention - If the Cammy insists on using her ex dive kick on you while you’re in v-trigger and have meter, let the ex-bullhead (armor from frame 1 and -2 on block) rip and kindly carry her to the corner.
Great post! Understanding other characters tools and how they interact with your character is important information. Derp I mean get gud Birdie top tier!
i retest in training mode and divekicks are plus only if she hit birdie under the knee otherwise you can challenge with s.lk. (thanks for the correction, i edit the previous comment)
i think the match up is ok guys, really i don’t see how cammy became a nightmare for birdie in s2. for example in s1 correct me if i am wrong but cammy was able to get in with ex divekick and it was positive or cero (my procedural memory still tell me to not challenge) you can always beat ex dive kick in reaction with c.mp but in a real match it was really difficult, now they nerf the recovery of the ex dive kick make us posible challenge (if he don’t space it correctly).
is true now we have to block in defense (no more wake up ex bull horn if he perfect meaty you), but she has to earn it, also the pressure involved is way less than s1, you get thrown in the corner and you still alive, you block a couple of hits and the pressure is over.
The match up is in Birdies favor in my opinion. As long as you keep her out and capitalize on your oki (something Birdie can definitely do in s2), you’ll be fine.
I have less a problem with Cammy more a problem with Guile/Urien I’m sure it’s mostly me failing my strat versus Guile is just walk him to the corner but I’ve had limited success. dfHP was a crutch for me in a lot of matchups especially Guile
guile looks like a really bad match up (probably the worst birdie match up in season 2).
the issue against this guile is walking and blocking won’t work because birdie’s walk speed is too slow and guile’s v.skill boom recover a lot of space even in some situations he is able to jump over your head or poke you out when you are blocking the v.skill.
birdie has forced to guess a lot in this match up in order to win with chains, ex bull revenger, mid range bull horns or unsafe bull slide (cf.hp) over sonic booms. but there are some ranges where the sonic boom pressure is complete safe unless you have a CA.
there is a video (created by a guile player) on why this is a bad match up for birdie.
