Would it really? I don’t think so. I think it’s an interesting opportunity that should be explored.
Healing mechanics are the anti-fun.
It’s not only that being a potential aspect of it, but specifically the fact that him eating items already boosts his V-Gauge to get into V-Trigger quicker. They also provide unique properties when the opponent interacts with them, so for them to also give health to Birdie? That would be a lot of mileage for him. Granted, I guess it all depends on how much health he would get from them, but since he already eats items at a decent speed, the opponent would have to be MORE than ready to prepare to punish them. This also creates opportunities for Birdie to bait people into rushing him because they’re afraid that he’ll just keep eating.
PAX build Birdie can cancel normals into his V-skills. He can also cancel any headbutt into V-trigger for a juggle. Looks like his db+mp+mk V-skill is slower. I also saw his mp+mk V-skill building V-gauge while V-trigger is active in the “Karin” build.
Damn Birdie is looking beast in that build, might have to keep him as a sub when the game comes out if he stays that good.
Interesting. So they changed Birdie’s first round victory win animation where he does the rocker hands. He grabs his stomach now. Also, I’m loving that you can combo into V-Trigger activation off of headbutt. It’s pretty cool.
In the previous build you could do ex headbutt, vtrigger, mp~headbutt. I think the new fiery pepper thing ruins that =*(
Aaaw. That would suck if it does. But maybe the knockup of the flame allows him to go straight into super? I’m glad to see Birdie is getting some love though.
Hey guys!
To give some context there is an spanish SFV invitational going on right now, the prizes are quite good and we had the chance to get 2 full sessions of training (around 20 hours in total) between each round of the tournament. I´ve had the chance to play a lot of Birdie against good players so here is some of my opinion on the character right now. Keep in mind this is Necalli/Vega build, not Mika/Karin one.
First of all, c.lp and st.lp don´t combo into themselves anymore. This is a huge nerf to both his offense/defense as he doesn´t have any hit confirmable tool at close range.
I want to highlight how much Birdie struggles against zoning, specially Ryu. All his anti-fb tools are unreliable or gimmicky:
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Bull Revenger is just terrible. This move is only useful for the first matches when people don´t know anything about Birdie, but as you already know it cannot be done on reaction and only as a guess for when you think they might throw a fireball. Good players will punish you very hard for doing this, and any normal the opponent uses will stuff it. The EX version however is really fast and very hard to react to (specially if canceled from normals like st mp), the spacing is situational and if you miss it the recovery is inmense. I was catching people all the time with this, if you use it sparingly it´s something to have in mind.
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Hanging Chain: Pretty safe at max distance, much like bull revenger you can´t react to fast fireballs in most situations. Opponents can react to it and punish you really hard. EX version is faster and will beat fireballs at max distance so it has more uses than the regular version.
-V trigger: The idea is really good but I feel right now it´s just too slow. The donut is just useful at absolutely max range or after a kd if you trade it for pressure. Other than that, if you use your V skill at any other range it´s a free jump in for every character, you will be able to block but you can´t AA because Birdie doesn´t have a dp and c.mp is too slow in that situation. Even if you put the banana down, it´s too far for the enemy to step on it, i feel it would be cool if Birdie did throw the banana closer to his feet, as this will also be better in the corner to actually create pressure. Cancelling normals into this is something I need to explore but I´m sure it´s something everyone can react to.
-Bull Horn:I´m not even sure if this move is designed to evade fbs but the recovery it´s atrocius and it covers almost no ground.
Talking about Birdie pokes, his mid range ones are quite good. St mk, sweep and st Hp are very strong normals for example. However I don´t understand how Birdie is supposed to open people up when close. Let´s say you corner Ryu and Birdie is as c.mk range, there is not much Birdie can do to threaten Ryu so he stops just blocking, you don´t have any safe way to chip camage, you don´t have any normal to approach and your whiff punishes are weak because you can´t cancel from them, st.mp doesn´t reach. His poking game is also limited due to the fact that you don´t have any rapid AA. In neutral range you can´t just poke with st.mk because they can jump at you any moment and make you block even if you did recover because you don´t have time for c.mp to come out. Jump-ins ins this game mean 40% damage and half stun bar specially against chars liek Necalli or Ryu, people will jump at you a lot and you won´t damage them enought to scare them.
When you get a kd his tick throw game is really weak, because c.jab doesn´t really combo into anything and people can just press buttons or jump away. I was using meaty st.mp into st.lp bullhead a lot . The problem is the enemy will back roll from any command grab/ or sweep and you dont´t really get much time to approach. His V reversal is bad, no range and long recovery. I´ve been thrown out of it many times as well. You will be using this a lot, as Birdie doesn´t have anything to really get out of pressure. His only invincible move on wakeup is EX cmd grab but even then it´s not something really good for then you are being pressured by ryu or bison´s c.mp or long range moves that lead into big damage.
We all have seen the damage Birdie can do with full V trigger and super, but this situation it´s not common. I´ll get a bullhorn into super every fight, but rarely with V trigger because you need EX moves and V-reversals to survive until then.
I hope I´m mistaken but right now there isn´t much going for him and I feel he is the weakest character in this build, Mika looks to outshine him on every single way, including damage, pokes and AA.
Birdie also has s.lk > s.lk > s.lp > headbutt when someone is at close range. Everyone keeps saying they removed his ability to do c.lp > c.lp > s.lp > heabutt but they never try the other combo. It would be strange for them to remove the c.lp combo but keep the s.lk combo.
Birdie going to have just as many combos as he did in Alpha. 2.
To me I can’t see what he’s supposed to be good at. What’s his game plan if you can’t react in time to use any of his tools without meter? And you only get three bars. He’s looking like a big combo dummy you practice on.
Goddamn. Lp not being able to combo into itself is a terrible hindrance for birdie. He had good potential during the beta but also some very glaring cons. I guess you can now only confirm into CA from a single lp or mp. His high damage output seems somewhat redundant if he has trouble landing damage in the first place. Bull revenger is a move that really gets me in how useless it is. I DID get plenty of mileage out of it during the beta but that’s because either A) People weren’t familiar with it or with punishing it and B) There were lots of beginners. It’s a long startup, long recovery move that can be poked out of or well…point blank C’Aed. I can foresee this move becoming borderline useless in the future and most definitely in high level play.
He’s a very interesting and unique character for sure but he’s running a lot of gimmicks with easy counters atm. With v trigger now being an AA it seems like birdie is supposed to simply be a 100% wall character. That’s fine but I wish there were a bit more to it…
He has incredibly good buttons. You can spot the 09ers here because everyone thinks you need to be able to combo from jabs to be viable.
birdie has the best normals in the game, and it’s not ever close. He should be able to control space and unless something changed drastically since the beta is jump grab merked ryus fireball all day. I had zero problems with projectile players.
And ex chain through projectiles, and a slide under, and the best anti air normal out of the beta characters (and really probably only second to maybe who vega right now?) birdie is an extremely strong character and those lows not chaining doesn’t change that a bit
That all makes him hella boring I think. I had a good time playing as him but with the direction they’re taking with him I’ll probably drop him. The footsie game is real but if he can’t reliably apply some kind of pressure and is supposed to just wall it out…then playing/waching him will be like molasses.
can someone confirm his standing lk lk punch combo works?
Yeah lol at the “good buttons” it’s as if people dominated newbs or “joystick to pad” players. in beta think it will work after after a few weeks of matchup experience and people back on their preferred controls, as if it’s all he needs.
I agree about someone’s post about birdie is suppose to “wall it out” his moves are great at beating out low.mk at max range but alot of other fighters moves are better in alot of ways since they are faster, can combo out of them, and in some cases dash in from crush counters as well. When they learn to stop doing footsies at Birdies sweet spot and max range and just rush in then he’s gonna be free.
He has no effective way at opening up people. no combos, gimicky slow grab moves. and slow walk and dash speed. Free jump ins on v-trigger use. No hard knock downs to build vmeter or get in. Birdie doesn’t have much than just turtle and hope the other player presses a button or jumps on his c.mp but what happens when they don’t push a button or stop jumping in?
I guess, Capcom gotta keep up tradition, of nerfing big characters (who naturally seem op day 1) because of high health and damage, but usually drop down when they get people get time in and then they get exposed. Can’t rely on Combofiend either, as he didn’t seem happy about people using Birdie jab combo at E3 and only wanted people to press “buttons” while Birdie was puttin in work using other tools…But as always bigger characters seem strong for obvious reasons day 1. Yet Bison still won the tournament.
Capcom probably just want Birdie to play keep away until he has v-skill ready to be honest. Hopefully Birdie is in the next wave of beta, so people can confirm their fears sooner rather than later and show Capcom he needs more than just BUT-TONS.
Maximillian just put up a video going over the Karin build. He says birdie can’t do the c.lp > c.lp > s.lp > headbutt. Looking at the video, it looks like the c.lp > s.lp doesn’t work in the combo(no one has ever explained why it doesn’t work). He also showed c.lp > c.lp still works, so you can probably mash it 4x. He says the s.lk > s.lp > headbutt combo still works.
I’m now confused why they changed this. c.lp is slower than s.lk. You really want to be doing the s.lk > s.lk > s.lp > headbutt combo for punishes anyways. The only thing c.lp has over s.lk is more range, and the range where c.lp is good, the c.lp > c.lp > s.lp > headbutt combo doesn’t work cause the s.lp wiffs. It really doesn’t matter to me they removed the combo, but it worries me that they’re just nerfing things that they see people using too much. I guess making s.lk > s.lk > s.lp > headbutt still work will open birdie up to low attacks, where the c.lp combo could be done in defensive crouch. Although, I bet c.lk > s.lk > s.lp > headbutt is still going to work, so that won’t matter.
I guess they just want him to have fewer combo options off his light attacks, even though they’re essentially exactly the same.
Probably just for how lazy and easy confirming off the 3 jabs was for the damage you get from the jabs headbutt super combo.
When it’s off two lights at least you have to be paying attention. Haven’t heard anything about how the c. lk and s. lk work now and whether any of those links have changed or not (besides s. lk, s. lp xx headbutt which we know definitely works)
The problem with that is it is just as easy to confirm off 2 lights than it is to confirm off 3 lights. Anything over 1 hit > special is easy to confirm off of. And now he’s going to be doing 2 light hits > headbutt > super which does more damage(432) than 3 light hits > headbutt > super (415). Maybe if I can find time next weekend, I’ll go to SCR2015 to figure this stuff out.