generally i find if you aren’t focus dashing the boom right when it happens, i eat the following random normal they usually throw out to stop focus dashes. but if you are really far from him and there is a boom coming to you (probably what you meant), i focus dash through it sometimes too to gain ground quickly.
oh yeah, and yeah if the guile is foolish enough to leave too much of a gap between the sonic boom and follow up normal, you can walk back and get out of the range of their normals and whiff punish, like what you were saying. usually they are not that foolish but some noobie guiles still don’t realize the dangers of having a predictable follow up normal too far apart from after you block the boom
haha cool that you brought in the startup frame datas into the picture (st.lk being 1 frame faster than the st.hp, etc). i actually don’t like to use st.mk in corner pressure if i can help it because it pushes me far out and you have to walk forward (dangerous because you are vulnerable to jumps when you walk forward at that distance), dash forward (some risk involved but better than walking), or scissor kick (dangerous) to get back into optimum scissor kick corner pressure range (imo)
i actually do standard scissor kick corner pressure for the most part here - dunno if you guys agree. if he goes for st.hp to beat my pokes i wait for him to whiff it and scissor kick him. what i’m most afraid of is that because his st.hp beats my st.hk pre-emptive anti air after he blocks scissor kick, you will be more reluctant to go for the st.hk and he can jump out more easily. then again, if you guess he is gonna st.hp you, you can bait and scissor kick it, or even dash in and throw after he whiffs (not sure about if there is enough time to dash in but i think i’ve done it before). something i’ve used sometimes is that if you bait their normal and they jump, if you are crouch blocking you have charge for ex headstomp and you might be able to ex hs them on reaction, but i think vs guile he can just air throw you lol. so yeah jumping out seems like a strong option for guile in the corner because you run the risk of getting owned in several ways when you go for the pre-emptive st.hk (this rule applies to other characters too with pokes that beat out st.hk at long range, like chun li, i think)
i guess i gotta rethink the vs guile corner game
that’s true, i just feel much more comfortable on the offensive, but i think if you have the life lead and you lost the momentum, ie. they blocked your mixup properly after a knockdown, i think turtling a bit can be great
Crossup’s on rog I should mention are annoying if you want to combo afterwords because of that strange stunted lower hitbox of his. Find I have to use cr.lp, st.cl.lp, st.lk/cr.mp xx sk/pc.
I’ve noticed a couple things about Guile tendencies that might come in handy for someone.
One string I see here and there is: sonic boom, max-range f+s.rh, backfist. If you predict the backfist after blocking f+.s.rh, you can wait it out and whiff punish hard with c.strong xx whatever. And if for some reason you don’t have charge, you can just punish with s.RH.
Another string I see is: s.fierce, sonic boom. After blocking a s.fierce, I believe you always have the spacing to blow through an immediate sonic boom with EX SK.
My biggest problem in this match is flash kick, believe it or not. From what I’ve seen, even great Guile players don’t give a fuck about meter for FADC – flash kick is so lucrative that it’s worth it to take the risk, especially vs. Bison. I find it difficult to pressure Guile when I’m constantly worrying about flashkick. If I try and bait it and Guile doesn’t go for FK, I’ve given up the pressure. And if I go all in with the pressure and I get flashkicked, I’ve gotta chase Guile down again.
I donno. I’m just really mindfucked on this match.
the whole situation regarding FK’s in the guile matchup is like…well it boils down to footsies doesnt it??
You want Guile to flashkick when you want him to, i.e. when you stop attacking (your previous attack just bait for this flashkick). This means you are winning at the footsie game. So I think when you say this is your worst problem, you gotta think about how this is a problem with any reversal specials at play, especially ones that are FADC-able. Against some people you can use the two bars as a guide, knowing full well they will use the two bars if they are at a health disadvantage. Against others though, they might not. Look at Mago vs. JSMaster at the Canada cup. So much of the commenting for that match was ‘OMG don’t do anything Mago has two bars’ but JSMaster pressured him anyways because Mago DIDNT use those two bars then…in your situation it would amount to losing momentum.
So yeah, i think you need to work on anti-guile footsies. Trying to get into the head of the guile player and get him to flashkick when you want him to…continue to attack/throw his downback ass if you don’t think he will but he predicts you to predict it. lol. so complicated, but I think you get what I’m trying to say. The way you put it at least, makes it sound like its not guile-specific but footsie specific.
That’s true, Laud. And yea, I totally get what you’re trying to say. I think I just get really discouraged with Guile/FK in particular, because once he hits it, I’ve gotta grind soooo hard to get in again. If Ryu mashes out of my pressure, okay that sucks, but I don’t feel like putting my controller down and kicking a hole in the wall.
Also, JS ended up losing for going all-in. It’s a really delicate balance in some matches.
if you see guile go for sonic boom, f+st.hk, backfist, you can punish the backfist with a c.hk slide if you time it right. this is probably the best no charge punish for the knockdown
they throw out the backfist because it’s godlike at counterhitting alot of normals after you block the f+st.hk. bet they won’t expect that sweep coming though.
Yea, they do it because it beats reversal scissors (so tempting when you’re frustrated!), walk forward, pokes, and even jumps I think. Really good string, but also quite punishable.
On a side note, most people don’t have the patience to play the matchup super lame, which is how it should be played. So you can always take advantage of Guile being unnecessarily offensive.
Guy is a major pita if you find a good one, that elbow is OP plain and simple good ones can beat out every single one of bison’s specials, normals, fa, attempts to dash under and of course his fail of a teleport. His normals seem to beat Bison’s ground and air, he also gets one that makes air specials whiff…add in a stunted lower hitbox ala Rog and ways he can combo into his ultras. Doesn’t help that both of Bison’s ultras suck ass.
Edit: Yes I am salty right now, the fact Bison’s already crappy AA options are getting nerfed in AE doesn’t help.
well bison AA is really good in people don’t know, and is almost same as Vega, there is a very thin layer of wall in bison aa, once you GO THROUGH that wall and you pretty much OWN him inside and out.
but funny thing is whiffed s.HK can also being bait for SRK, I bait one and dash back after BIG WHIFF then punish it with Ultra.
Teleport, whiff s.mk, frame trap + teleport back can also be bait, first frame trap worked, and you teleporting back while chrage, then you can see they coming at you maybe jumping…yeah j.MP x2 into UC1 or just UC1 while they at midair and helpless is very classic.
now I just begin to learn to know how nasty bison truly is.
I have to say, I feel like you should never be doing point blank EX psycho against sim. It’s not like you ever need to get out of his pressure. Honestly, if you’re close to him, that’s where you wanna stay. Even if he couldn’t punish it, the spacing he gets from doing it is still horrible for you. Save the bar for getting back in if he manages to get away from you again.
It’s one of those things that are hit and miss. Saw it on the Hadocon stream with AndyOCR and FilipinoChamp. Seeing a lot more patience in Andy’s play against sim and it’s almost paying off. he’s like 98% there and then some miraculous guessing and educated method, Fchamp’s sim edges him out for the victory.
Can someone kind of lay out what zangief’s options are in terms of OSing dictator on his wakeup?
the main thing that confuses me is that often times giefs will do a greenhand, and then another greenhand, catching any attempts to escape via backdash. EX PC just goes right through, etc.
so is the double greenhand thing a guess or an option select? if the first greenhand doesn’t connect, gief does a second one? or is it just a guess? because as far as i knew greenhand isn’t safe on block, but the lp version is tough to punish with anything other than a throw unless youre ready for it. just really unfamiiar with gief’s offense on the ground, i get the jist of his jump in mix ups, but the greenhand thing always puzzles me. I used to think it was an option select catching my backdashes, but now im not so sure.
PS: props to andy ocr! reppin bison in the top tournie spots!
The greenhand is a guess, but it will cover EX-PC, backdash and backwards teleport. It loses to blocking and you get out with EX-DR/Stomp.
After SPD, gief only has enough time to greenhand over and do a meaty. The OS-greenhand only happens if gief has enough time to safe-jump you or crossup splash, which only happens after sweep, a knockdown in the corner, or after an EX-GH.
So, I hear so much talk about how Bison rapes Cammy, but I’m so fucking lost in this matchup. As soon as I’m in cannon strike range it’s stupidly safe pressure all day. I’m sure XBL has something to do with it, but button presses get punished, and I get my backdashes OS’d. On the odd chance I do start some pressure I have to fear her DP. WTF can you do?
Sigh… from what I hear it’s all about zoning her out. I’m not a big fan of using st. rh and scissor kicks for this as she can change her jump trajectory so that your rh is blocked or she beats your roundhouse by jumping higher. You have to commit to a roundhouse, but if you miss… it’s whiff punished to shit for a free knockdown. Scissor kicks can be backdashed or focused if you try to hit with “just the tip.”
The free pressure isn’t that bad if you know all it is is Cannon Strike pressure. Focus + st. short helps with this a lot. The BIG problem is when they know you’re looking for that so they just do cr. mk with a buffered cannon drill in it. A Cammy with really good footsies will wreck your soul with this strategy.
