yeah forgot to mention that when talking about st.mp and far fierce lol
I know his Ultra II is bad, defeated by a simple kikokken, or just jumping back out of range of it, but I’m more scared of an Abel player that picks that rather than Ultra I. Ultra I has all the weaknesses of Hosen-ka with less range (well: not all of the weakness. Least it ain’t a charge motion). It shifts the game into meta, where you make your opponent aware you know what he’s fishing for, but… I don’t feel Chun relies on her fireball game in any case. Most of the time arrant fireballs get you killed. The one thing he would need to truly compensate against Chun’s battery of normals is a good focus attack. And yet, it’s slow and has poor range and you can punish him with ultra trying to back-dash out of it, can you not? His back-dashes are so slow. On the other hand, it’s like Malvadisco says, Ultra I gives him fierce comeback potential if he manages to combo into cr.fp. The damage is sill-l-l-l-l-y. Ultra II makes sure you can’t just jump at him willy-nilly, which I like to do every now and again just to keep him honest. Kinda like Zangief. You can catch them crouch blocking so often with a sudden impulsive jump-forward after zoning them out for long enough.
I find Makoto more threatening, even if the god poke (st.mp) shuts her down pretty bad.
Take Chun vs Sagat, for instance, which is what I mean by she doesn’t rely on fireballs. Chun beats Sagat handily by hanging around him at spacing just outside of st.mp range. From here she can just keep tagging him with pressure pokes every-time he tries to do anything. And her cr.mp as an anti-air with it’s extremely low hurt-box protects her against some of his trickier jumping normals, such as that downward facing elbow. (disclaimer: you will hurt yourself trying to learn to use cr.mp as an anti-air. The timing for it is unusual compared to other normals. You need to delay it until the last few moments. On the flip-side, you will shut down Ryu players ~and other shotos~ that think they can just keep jumping at you ad nauseum. They have to switch up to jumping fierce punch to make an impact, and most Ryu players don’t seem to know this. Also good in Chun-Li mirrors. Both st.mp and cr.mp can work as anti-airs there, whereas fierce punch has very indeterminate spacing because of Chun’s high jump arc and downward-stretching normals. St.mk is probably best in that MU, but returning to neutral is a pain in the arse. How many times does down/forward.lk have to come out when I’m trying to punish somebody? This is why better Chun-Li’s than I use cr.lp, isn’t it?)
Any thoughts on Ultra Combo Double? I’ve only seen newbie Chun-Li’s take this option so far. Personally, I find which Ultra you pick is generally a clear cut choice. It’s only against characters like Guile, now that Ultra I has been fixed for a full corner juggle, where you really benefit from switching over to Kikousho. Chun’s damage is too poor to justify the trade-off of taking the sting out of your punishment capability, I feel.
Skatan, are you still doing counter-hit mp’s->ultra? I saw you working on that tech before and it blew me away. Trying to train myself to buffer the motion like that, but I’m a retard. If I start buffering a motion I generally complete it 75% of the time, despite what happens on the screen. ><
Edit: Here’s something I learned yesterday playing against the nr.16 Elena on the PS3, in Europe. Don’t take risks against her wake-up when she has ex-metre if you don’t want to see her heal back to half-health. Taking chances with meaty’s or throws isn’t worth it. Also, I try not to give her too many free focus absorbs, because healing twice is a pain in the arse. Finally, her super punishes ex.legs on block (and probably normal legs too?). /who_cares_what_this_low_tier_character_does_nothing_she_has_is_safe
I think healing is probably a poor choice of ultra for her, considering Ultra I punishes it full-screen, as long as you can rise in time.
Abel Ultra 2 has armor. If you don’t EX or badly space the kikoken you will still get grabbed. It’s not as abusive in Ultra as it was in old Super, but it’s still something to be aware of. Normally, up close, Chuns just do stomp (j. d+mk) on top of Abel to avoid it entirely.
Elena: don’t give her space. Push her into a corner and beat her awkward ass. Grrrr!
That backdash of hers, though, right? Goddamn, I got toasted by this guy I know who plays Elena. Everytime he woke up he would backdash and I was just like, okay: so, I’m gonna punish this with ex-legs, but damn if that is not inefficient. I’ve tried walk-up sweep, that didn’t work. Walk-up hasan-shu, he didn’t backdash when I tried that, so I dunno if that works. I don’t think forward+mk comes out fast enough, but what would be the point anyway? You would just tap her.
Oh! But, if you manage to quick-rise, even if you use the down command, which is an annoying habit I have stored in my muscle memory, and she activates healing, you still get enough charge time to punish it. So that’s cool.
Also, her neutral jump normal is fucking boss. I tried a few different spacings, a few different normals, it’s worse than a shoto’s neutral jump.mk. Fierce punch got me hurt. Standing mp, same thing. I guess maybe crouching roundhouse as her feet touch the ground? I really don’t like this button, it’s always a last resort for me.
Somebody is gonna grab me one day and be like: Maximum_Spider, dude, you know that Chun-Li has setups from untechable knockdowns, right? And I’d be like, uh… yeah, I know that. Sure, I know that but… uh, you see. I’m allergic to the training stage. You know, I play Ranked, right? I gotta host my own game just so I don’t have to listen to that goddamn training stage music anymore.
Spider, dude… why don’t you mute the goddamn sound? Well… uh, you see… it’s like, I have this controller for my t.v., right? I put batteries in it, you need real small ones. I put them in and it’s all fine for a while, but then I look at my remote and it’s flashing even when I’m not using it and it drains the goddamn batteries.
Spider, dude… why you so strange, man? Oh… I don’t know. The internet did things to me. itchy, shakey feelings
I’ve been playing against some more Poison recently. Isn’t this character a pain in the neck? I always want to focus attack her so bad, but I just get armour broken and feel sad. This is like, war of the footsies. Getting round her fireballs? Yeah, forget about it. You need a good read and you have to jump over them, hasan-shu just gets you hurt because they have so much vertical hit-box. Unless somebody knows better? Feels like you have to play this match-up like old Vanilla Sagat vs Chun-Li. Inching space and building revenge meter until she can’t just zone the fuck out of you anymore.
I had the most facepalm moment where a Poison activated her Fireball Ultra (whatever you call that), it got absorbed by a kikokken I had thrown and then my jumping.rh went right through her face during recovery. Like, she was trapped in the corner, chip damage would have killed her and the stupid bugged hurtbox saved her. Goddamn, I was so steamed.
I gave the guy a bit of a Sanford roasting in the message I sent to him, after that, though he didn’t really deserve it.
I usually use u2 for Ken. Now I’m thinking u1 is better because it’s really easy to land a counter hit against his step kick into ultra 1.
I’m not really afraid of his fb and Ken wants to be up close so I always used u2. But this is just way too easy to pass up.
All 22 Colors
I can’t help but feel like sagat is a struggle for chun… Or maybe it’s just mental for me
It’s not bad as it was in the early versions. imo she was close to even in Vanilla (only losing out on Raw damage) and it has probably gotten better in every version since.
Imo you just gotta defend and stay in your favorable range… dash U1 really helps too.
yeah but you want to be close right? one wrong move and you’re pushed out again. its way too easy for sagat to be random and its not like its that risky for sagat.
You kind of want to be in a vs Ryu-ish mid range too imo. Not too far that you’ll have a hard time vs tiger shots (and eat U2 if you do anything dumb), and not too close that you’re at the mercy of tiger uppercut/tiger knee/frame traps. Fortunately he’s a little easier to eyeball and safejump than the other 3f shoryuken gang.
The reversal thing sound like any other shoto matchup she has imo. She has to play perfect and be at the right range… but if a dp/reversal knocks her out of it, then it’s back to square one.
If I could find a way to stop tiger knee it would solve all my problems.
cr.mk goes under it at some ranges and timing. You know that useless and shitty normal nobody uses /tierlistsmartasses
idk i dont have that much of a problem with gat unless im dealing with his oki, those delayed TU/ yolo kara TU are a pain
Could anybody break-down the Guy match-up for me? I really struggle in this match-up and, in the rare instances that I come across a Guy player, it’s always some beast of a character specialist with 3000pp. I can’t seem to open him up for any damage. I get myself cornered. I neutral jump far too often and he just air-throws me over and again. Air-throw hits me on wake-up and his run-stop plus shoulder-barge shuts down my poke game. Besides that, he seems pretty difficult to anti-air with his vertical falling jump and pretty boss hit-box on his elbow. Maybe I should just pick Sakura.
I recently played a guy player that is seriously on marq teddy’s level. I got pretty destroyed but thankfully he was cool enough to give me some pointers. Basically you don’t want to be too offensive. Your mid range pokes are tough for him to handle and the further you are away the easier the match becomes. When he does that flip just use a crouching medium button (mp usually)
If you’re playing a good guy player they often use cr.lk st.mk (I think its that or standing lk) as a frame trap. Don’t crouch tech, stand tech and you’ll always throw him out.
Its really hard for him to do anything about sweep as well.
Don’t neutral jump. There’s no reason to.
Damn, the Guy I fought has to deal with nj’s better then lol… I knew it was gonna be slam dunk city somehow.
Also with Guy, usually it’s preferable to eat the throw, than mash the cr. tech. Throw does less damage than counterhit damage combos
I’ll try and get my sets against said Guy up on the video thread soon.
Relying solely on stand tech against Guy is really not a good idea…cr.lk will eat that up for free, especially if its staggered
nobody said to rely soley on anything. but if you see that you get hit with it a lot, it can make the guy player stop.