and so if you walk back and it whiffs, can’t you do super to punish the spiral anyway?
i still think u1 is best against T. Hawk. It removes a lot of his move set from being useful, especially that jump in dive thing. Big damage is best against T Hawk.
Thanks. I understand that it and for the record, I always select U1 in this matchup.
My comment was to be applied in situations if/when Ultra isn’t an available option.
There’s no info on how to beat Gen?
Gen’s jump arc is small compared to the rest of the cast, so it’s a little trickier to antiair him. Since his jump is short, it makes it easy for him to get around Kikokens. So that’s when normals come in to play. Keep him grounded. In Mantis, his sweep on block is punishable by your sweep, super, or Ultra 1 (reversal timing) but a lot of his other normals in Crane are punishable easily by super. All in all, you have better normals than he does so keep him out with them. If I had to pick an ultra though, I’d pick Ultra 2 for the reason of keeping him grounded and consistency.
df + lk is free against Gen’s jump-ins (non crossups). Feel free to abuse it all day long.
I don’t know if this has been posted because i haven’t been around the chun forums lately.
chun’s cr.fp goes right through cody’s zonk knuckle EX version included, making him even more free on wakeup for cr.fp xx legs loops.
I am beginning to feel this way as well. Before the frame data came out, I figured Hawk was going to be safe enough that U1 wasn’t going to punish a lot of things on block aside from the obvious things like his Tomahawk Buster (uppercut) and Condor Dive. However, after taking a close look at his frame data, here are all the things that you can Reversal U1:
- f.st.HK (one of his better pokes, so if you start playing footsies with him and he sticks this out and you block it or it whiffs, free U1)
- cr.HK (after blocking both hits, not in between like Guile’s) - MUST REVERSAL
- His df+LP overhead - MUST REVERSAL
- Any Tomahawk Buster (uppercut) - sometimes it crosses you up though, making U1 impossible to do
- Any Non-EX Condor Spire (anyone know if he can space this to make it safe?)
Of course you can also Ultra any of his whiffed command grabs on recovery.
I am not sure though because I don’t play enough T.Hawks offline to test things out. For example, I’d have to test and see if Condor Spire always has the same frames on block. If he can make it safe, that makes it much harder.
But anyway, it is something I have been thinking about. Not sure yet, since baiting a jump out of Hawk and then double-fiercing him into full U2 is so easy.
How the hell do you play against who spans sonic boom and that aerial kick where he jumps back and towards you???
Couple of matchup notes from a bison player who is picking up chun:
-Stay out of the corner. If he’s got you in the corner, you’re losing.
-U1 is by far the preferred ultra in this matchup, even though it rarely lands full off the corner juggle, because it limits teleport and devils reverse as movement options. You can also punish rh and ex scissors with it on block, and whiffed headstomps (hint: watch his meter to see if he’s headstomping or devils reversing).
-If he tries to hit you with the skulldiver followup to headstomp, or the followup to devils reverse, you can cr.mp or cr.mk to duck them.
-Safe jump target combo OS hazanshu is great for catching wakeup teleports when he has no meter.
-Far mp and sweep are the go to pokes in this matchup. cr.mp is also good, since it ducks and counter pokes his RH unless he is at point blank range, so use that against RH happy bisons.
-If you’re up against scissor kick pressure, be patient. Usually after the first lk scissors, he will be close enough to do a low short into another lk scissor. If his timing is right, his cr.lk will stuff reversal ex legs, so don’t rely on that. Reversal spinning bird is also risky, since if he decides to be patient, he can punish slide you for an untechable, or combo into rh scissors and push you way closer to the corner.
-Again, stay out of the corner. I like to use a back and forth strategy, adopt a defensive posture, zone with pokes and mp kikoken’s (2/3 screen or further, and not when he’s got U2), and eat away at his life. Once I get the knockdown, I switch sides on him (doesn’t really have a way to hit you out of well timed df+rh on his wakeup), so his back is closer to the corner, and he has to push me the opposite direction.
-After a blocked close ex psycho crusher, I like to reversal hk hazanshu. It won’t punish the move, but it allows me to start pressuring them, as they’re forced to block it. Also catches a lot of bison player’s slipping, as their impulse is to go to db after ex psycho crusher so they can charge/block.
-Did I mention stay out of the corner.
this also was the case for me against ibuki! always trying to do ex kazegiri on me so i walked or dashed back and then did a hazanshu again. i never went for the hazanshu lk to ex legs combo because of that
I did not know this. That’s useful to know.
I’m guessing he doesn’t gain meter for executing Devil’s Reverse, while he does gain meter for executing Headstomp?
Also, does cr.MK duck under headstomp? I thought it did (I figured I could keep it as a habit since Juri’s cr.MK ducks under headstomp easy), but I’ve been noticing that I still get hit when I use it. Is my timing off or does it not work?
The Dhalsim matchup is worse now than in vanilla 
Yes, yes it is.
Players who are good at doing an instant U2 with Dhalsim are a serious threat.
Well, it’s not as much that as it is Chun’s damage having been lowered and Dhalsim’s being the same or higher.
When it comes to normals Chun has trouble dealing with Dhalsim both at close range and at mid range.
Close range he’s got b+lk and the only way for Chun to beat it is cl.hk pretty much, and if you fail you’ll either get thrown or pushed back out of the corner.
Midrange he’s got st.mp, c.mp and st.hp, he can also do hk slide on reaction to any fireball Chun throws, or u2 if he’s got that.
At full screen it’s pretty even, but none of the characters can land any damage from this range either, against a good dhalsim it’ll be difficult to make him whiff st.hp so you can sweep it.
In vanilla when Chun got in she just needed 1 or 2 good guesses to close the match, now she’s got to make atleast 2 but often 3 or 4 good guesses to close it out.
Getting to that situation where you can land those guesses against a good Dhalsim is -very- difficult for Chun to do, so to have to do it that many times just makes it very difficult for her to win.
I am very convinced that Dhalsim in SSFIV is a whole lot stronger than he is given credit for, if this version was to be played for a long time I wouldn’t be surprised to see most of his matchups jump a step in Dhalsims favour.
In which case I mean 5-5’s turns to 6-4’s, 3-7’s turns to 4-6’s etc.
His upclose defense is much, much stronger than anybody gives him credit for, b+lk kills almost all characters blockstring game, then afterwards you have to deal with b+mk which is just as good only it’s a mid range poke instead.
Now with his improved slides he’s also got a much easier time to do things like, b+lk, b+lk, b+mk, df+mk, df+lk x fire to get a good bit out of the corner.
I’m either going to take a page out of Daigo’s book and play this matchup fullscreen, or start picking Cammy instead in this matchup.
i dont know how useful this is, but ive found that if you try to out turtle a dhalsim player but merely throwing fireballs and backing up they tend to get impatient and try to get in on you, which opens up a lot of opportunities.
the rate at which chun can do a fireball war with dhalsim is off by a bit, since shes charging, ive found that if you stick with it youll get a small life lead which makes them try to get in even more. always be ready to hit him on teleport too. once hes in i feel that chun really owns the matchup.
ive found abusing ex hazanshu on dhalsim to be pretty decent. lots of dhalsims like to throw out the arms if you absorb a fireball so abuse that
Yes, he gains meter for doing the headstomp, but only gets meter for the followup to devils reverse. EX you can’t tell the difference.
Cr.MK doesn’t duck the headstomp itself, but does duck the followup.
i dunno how useful this actually is since you can sweep the followup for free. what’s the recovery like on whiff?
Against a good Dhalsim you will never win the fireball war, you’ll get slowly pushed into the corner at which point you’re unable to fireball anymore.
Random hazanshu will only work occasionally, it’s possible to react to it with either tower, super, u1 or u2.
I’m way past the gimmicks in this matchup, I play against Yagami (Best Dhalsim in EU) twice a week offline.
It’s highly possible that I’ve played this matchup on high level more than anybody else here.
Gimmicks will work on “good” Dhalsim players, but against truly good players it will get you nowhere.
I only care about what the matchups look like on the highest level, and in this case it doesn’t look good for Chun IMO.