I like your list sh0ultz. I think it’s better to make a smaller list of top tier first and then expand when we think some may become too strong. I’d personally add Skrull to the list. Could also be worthwhile to add Joe to the low tiers for now.
I think in terms of the rest of the characters, the ones to take notice for would initially be Sentinel, Hawkeye, Haggar, X-23, Spiderman, possibly Strange.
I still think there are alot of good assists from the characters that are left.
We still have Unibeam, Tatsu, Mystic Ray, Drones, Bolts, Hyakurestu, Gold Armor Pendulum, Anti Air Gamma Charge, Lariat, Dragon Fang, Log Trap, bunch of beam/pseudo-beam assists.
Could have a chance for people to explore more unusual assists, like Double Spitfire, Arthur’s Bottle Toss, Eat Chain (can’t remember the name), Quick Work, Shield Slash, Thor assists, etc.
I’m happy to use the list we have now and start playing some low tier matches, possibly mini-tournaments.
The guys over at reddit.com/r/mvc3 have been messing with low tier tourneys for the past couple of weeks. I don’t play online, so I haven’t been able to join, but here’s the current thread about the next tournament with a banlist. What do you guys think?
I also came up with an idea for a ranking/points based system:
in mvc2 when we readjusted the low tier system, there were these character who were really too good for lows but not great enough to beat tops. Anarakis, cammy, ruby heart, psylock etc…
I feel like spidey MAYBE and x23 are the same bracket as those characters. Great enough to maul the rest of the cast but still not that good to beat up tops for free and that’s fine IMO. It was good enough last time to draw the line and we had year 10 players saying it was fair. IM\felicia suck in marvel. Felicia sucks because of her shit mobility and same for IM. Even in a low tier group, felicia is mid tier and IM is only possibly top in a low tier group because of his assist+tac infinite. It will not be because of his point play.
spidey is probably SLIGHTLY too good but till this day, there are no definitive spiderman teams so we don’t actually know how good this character is ATM. I know for a fact he has a massively hard time getting damage @ the top of SJ height from all angles and his assists are fucking garbage.
times change, new tech gets figured out and its only year 3 but I feel like I hit 95% of the ban list. The last 5% are these weird characters who just have potential that hasn’t been realized yet.
there is no “low tier” in mvc3 really because all characters have some good stuff to them but in comparison to other doods they are a lot worse but people say some doods like Arthur/Phonix wright/frank are low tier other say no tier and some say high tier. it really is arguable but really to make it a “fun” comp is to just ban the OP doods like Doom/Vergil/Wesker/Zero and if you wanna go further with it than that just make it no zero/mori/trench coats :L
and for them doods that say "use ho u like"it doesn’t work out when you like spidur man and Felicia and your playing a morri/doom set up
There is a low tier because there are characters that legitimately suck. Arthur and Phoenix Wright may have some good stuff but they aren’t low tier because other characters have better tools; they’re low tier because they actually are terrible.
And WTF, Frank is not even close to being low tier.
thing is there isn’t a reason NOT to play IM in that bracket other than execution issues. tac infinite (and spidey’s ultimate web throw resets) are the easiest damage in this bracket. tron, hulk, and shuma have other high damage.
i just feel like spiderman/ironman/x23 is too strong in that bracket.
spidey - best matchups in the bracket
ironman/spidey guard break. ironman tac infinite sets it up nicely, as well.
x23 - adds an easy combo extender and the best xf anchor in the tier. hard to get from IM/x23 to x23/IM order but once she’s in, she has unibeam backup.
the other somewhat strong char in the bracket is rocket raccoon for support but whatever
x23 is NOT a good anchor, even in low tiers. The only concern there should be is the combination of x23 + ironman with repulsor blast. Repulsor is a lockdown, a combo extender and one of the true incoming setups for her level 3. Beside this combination, there really wouldn’t be a problem allowing x23 in low tiers.
So is Skrull considered low or low-mid? I’ve been maining him since I first picked up this ridiculous game and I personally feel he’s mid. Gets rushed down easily but can also impose his will on floaty and aerial characters. I feel like Skrull even beats Spencer. P.S. I really want to learn P. Wright, any tips?
Most important things about Wright:
5. Learn Maya plinking
4. Learn to rely on anchor
3. Learn to rely on shell
2. Resist temptation to use him in money matches
Point system and point system variants will have to be used.
Every character would be given a strength level of 1-5
Every character would be given a noobility acknowledgement of “yes” or "no"
Every character would be given a assist variance
You start with 25 points. For each character you want in your team that has a noobility of “yes” you subtract 5 points from your total, and this is determined by their Xfactor dominance. Assist variance will lower your point pool by an additional 3 points, and determined simply by is the assist extremely strong. And of course the strength level is the point usage of each character.
I would give all 3 characters of this team a 5 point strength level
15/25
Magneto and vergil have the noobility acknowledgement. You have to account both due to snapback feature, and tags
15/15
Doom and vergil are sporting that assist variance. You have to account both of them again.
15/9
Team is not tournament legal
This of course is an example system and may need to be tweaked a bit, but i think this is the only ideal way to restrict character usage while still giving access to all characters and having no teams be completely unfair in terms of power.
Point systems are bad for a game like UMVC3. If we want low tiers we should ban higher tiered characters or else you’re just going to end up having shit/shit/vergil, shit/average/phoenix, zero+2 assists. It would defeat the whole purpose of this which is to explore and encourage people to play the characters that aren’t used as much.
shit/shit/vergil is horrible because someone can use C.Viper and simply unblockable vergil. shit/average/phoenix is going to have a terrible time building 5 bars, and in both of these teams snapback is a huge threat. zero+2 assists is decent except your starting at 5/14 presumably (zero noobility as anchor, and the assist variance for the other two) and so if zero dies, we can assume the other two characters are going to be able to do much against a well constructed team.
It doesn’t matter what the game is or the idea, using a point system that is well constructed will always work. I did say the system may need a bit of tweaking, and character point worth could go up to 7 or 10, or you could have the points start at 20 max before deductions, or have greater deductions etc. It’s basically a way to balance the game without actually balancing the game.
Actually THINK about the system i have explained and why it would work, tweak it a little the way you think it would need to be tweaked so that it would work (in the case that the way i set it up with 25 start points, 3 and 5 point deductions for character and assist powers, is their a BS team you can build with this system? why would that team be BS? Is it the only BS team, or is their many that would essentially balance each other out to keep the core team building strategies that marvel is known for?) Of course, i didn’t put all the character strength values down because it’s the idea that matters, and most people i have found don’t read and just quote on the first thing they disagree on in the slightest and ignore the rest.
I’m so for mid-low tiers. Playing Cap versus a Ryu or a Iron Fist is such a better game than Vergil vs zero. There’s way more depth and skill. Right now the tiers and shells are so fucking OP it’s like we’re all shooting at the hip with bazookas and it feels more chaotic than deep. Dexterity and tech synergy has trumpted fundamentals like footsies and etc…
I think it’s easy to make a low-mid tier list…the issue is assists. Some shells can be considered S-tier even with low tier chars