I’m not really up to date on stick technology, and don’t really plan to start doing research, but how is a TO supposed to know whether a player with a hitbox has a modern stock hitbox or one with a PCB that allows SOCD? I guess you test it out pre tourney, just seems like an extra hassle for TO’s who already have a lot to deal with already.
MFW the creator of hitbox played Modok against me in a tourney and flew to the top of the screen whilst holding block in both directions. (to negate left-right mixups, as well as high-low mix ups). Grabbed that son of a gun with an air throw and killed him first priority… and that was the only way I could beat him.
Hitbox is a good product made for our FGC players by some of our FGC players. I support them!
If he is in the top corner all he needs to do is hold up back cause you can’t left/right mixup him. He wasn’t cheating in anyway.
Probably depends a bit on how it’s set up. BlackShinobi seems to think that having more than one button per normal is cheating…
In practical terms, it is unreasonable to expect a TO to be able to detect cheat sticks in any BYOC tournament. Sticks are too easy to modify and swap out, and the modifications themselves can be devilishly subtle.
At least with official HitBoxes, there’s nothing to test since it doesn’t allow SOCDs.
But pad has more buttons than (any) arcade controller.
Because all the copies of KoF in South America are ROMs emulated through MAME.:arazz:
Whoops
In my opinion, if you ban HitBox for something that you can still do on a stick, but just easier and more precisely, then why not ban button macros in tournaments (as in allowing you to press multiple buttons at the same time and not macroing a sequence of inputs)? Button macros allow you to get perfect simultaneous button presses everytime. So why are macros allowed? Because they only help pad players?
From pad to stick perspective, if we take SF4 Ken’s f.MK kara throw, this is possible but rather hard on a pad since you have to use your thumb for the MK and the throw input, while with a stick you have multiple fingers on each attacks button so it is entirely feasible to kara consistantly. It’s the same with HHS or lightning legs; pad players don’t have as much freedom in the quickness of inputs where on stick you can piano your inputs for really fast HHS motions. Im not making these comparisons to prove a particular point, but if you are making comparisons to HitBox vs Stick, then you have to look at each for of control input that is allowed in the FGC and compare them equally.
I understood it as Mr Wizard (who has final say over SRK and Evo) had already explain this issue too all of SRK and the Evo committee many months before Evo 2011. There is nothing on the Hitbox (or hitbox like controller) that physically can not be done on a game pad or arcade stick, that includes SOCD. That any gaming inaccuracies are caused by the game code it self and not the controller as its the game software that allows what can and can not happen.
Yeah sure, lets ban hit boxes, but we also have to ban Arcade sticks, fight pads and even PS2 dual shocks.
Lets force everyone to play with terrible Xbox 360 d-pads that you have to rent from the tournament at a hourly rate
I totally see Aris’s point but ya know what, its an opinion and he’s entitled to it. yes in his review he says he thinks its cheap and should be banned BUT he also says if you like the idea, to go for it and get one, and that it is a good product as far as quality and execution. I mean if he sat there and posted his video saying “this is a piece of crap garbage and you should never buy one ever” then yeah, it would be based on misinterpretations and flat out biased lies, but it isnt. God forbid someone throw their personal opinion of something on the internet.
I also understand his mentality when it comes to “all players should use stick.” It’s not because it’s what HE uses and what HE thinks is best…
It’s because that’s what the ARCADE STANDARD is. You don’t see arcade machines with pads hooked up to them nor do you see hitbox layouts on them. People (mainly US players) forget that there’s a whole other culture of competitive fighting game in other countries (specially japan) where console is not the mainstream. People play competitively on ARCADE machines where the joystick standard is used pretty much exclusively. So again, I understand his opinions completely.
We’re not in the arcade days buddy, if you want to go by the books and be smart, we should all be playing in Cabnits, but we’re not. We are playing on nice HD Monitors, because we want to reduce lag. We should ban lagless monitors to, as it assits us in execution.
I say, calling it a piece of joke, is a formal way of calling it garbage.
People shouldn’t be forced to play on any peripheral. There are players who are physically incapable of using a stick but can use a pad. There are players who can use a stick but are just more comfortable on other controllers. Also just because one peripheral suits some people best does that mean that everybody has to follow that?
The ease of use argument is a joke. Is a pad player’s execution worth more because he worked harder for it than a stick player or a hitbox player?
Also “difficult” is a term used too loosely with execution. What is difficult for one person may be very easy for another. I remember spending a year mastering a just frame when some banged it out in an afternoon. Somethings that people have considered hard I was able to do well with a few minutes of practice. There is no specified time it is “supposed” to take to master a technique. It all depends on the player.
Arcade standard in the US is Happ comp/super and 6 straight for Capcom games. Better make everyone play on AiaB sticks. Japanese parts are unfair to people with big hands. Also better ban convex buttons, they make sliding and double-tapping easier.
Now you could say that the great thing about arcade sticks is that you can pretty much have whatever button layout you want with whatever buttons you want with whatever kind of joystick you want all packed inside whatever you want it to be in. I don’t see why there’s even a problem to begin with on the Hitbox. If the Hitbox is banned might as well ban all customs and retail sticks that don’t use the exact parts and layout that was intended for the game.
If you’re using ‘execution’ as a reason to ban a Hitbox, then you might as well be saying everyone should play on pad, as the stick allows for easier 720 motions.
I really, REALLY don’t get how ‘easier motions’ is any reason at all to ban a Hitbox, when people spending $150 for sticks do so for the same exact reason.
PS. If I play any one of you out there, you are more than welcome to test my box yourself prior to our match so that you KNOW it doesn’t SOCD. I spent way too much money to make my Hitbox not SOCD on a 360, and may heaven help me that I’d be banned from using it because ‘it might SOCD’.
PS.2. If I can kick your ass with a Hitbox and you whine about it, I’d kick your ass again with a stick. My controller doesn’t define what I can dish out in a fighting game.
Are hitboxes dual modded yet? I want one.
But what about the official HitBoxes that have been secretly modified to allow SOCD?
If someone has the technical know how to rewrite the firmware on the PCB I commend them. It wouldn’t be a simple wiring job like it would be on a stick.
If you can block both ways that doesnt mean you cant be hit with overheads, or that you wont block too late.
The better player is still going to win. The fact that none of the top players are even using hitboxes shows that the people who will do lame cheat tactics like modding a hitbox to block left/right are STILL going to get owned. If you’re THAT busy worrying about blocking in two directions, you’re ass.
EDIT: lemme just say Justin Wong aint using a hitbox. I dont really care if the next post list a bunch of people who are “top players” that use hitboxes.
Easier to swap out PCBs. <shrug> Still, competitive players don’t really want to cheat.