It works really well when sim wants to mix you up an teleports behind you. cl hp stuffs teleports really nicely
s.hp being back to 120 at all ranges would be wonderful but might be asking a bit much.
I think ultra combo double is going to be really useful in a lot of matchups as long as the current changes stay.
A true 720 command grab ultra makes honda a punish machine vs. chars like Adon, Boxer, Ken, Rose, Fei Long (probably some of the new characters too) who use pressure/chip damage/reversal tools that’re -2 or -3 which we can’t normally punish.
New combo potential with U1 is great too and will give Honda access to massive damage + corner carry combos + corner mixup vs. certain characters (probably crouching characters + wide bodies like Abel, Dudley, Chun, Dhalsim etc.)
you can already punish those characters with u2. its still a 2 frame start up either way you look at it, if they are still in recovery and end up close enough they can be punished. the range is getting a buff so it will be a bit easier to get them, it has nothing to do withthe frame data as it is not necessarily changing. it currently starts up 0+2 (0 is the flash 2 is the startup) to 2+0… all that does is allows you to hit people with it in a mixup in neutral game. so the defender has no chance to jump away if he sees the animation where currently if he has not pressed any button and he sees the animation then he has a chance to jump away/backdash etc. basically what it comes down to is it is impossible to catch someone by surprise with it in its current state.
yeah but the range is so pitiful it isn’t even worth picking U2 in any matchup imo.
E.Honda needs a better range and get the ultra 2 with 1+0
Also j.Mp back to super version, the other characters are getting good anti-airs(chun,guy,guile) and without it will be bad for us
they changed the range of U2 to 1.45 from 1.1 or .9 or something. that puts the new range somewhere between MP and LP oichio, or about the same as Zangief’s U1.
oh it actually is going to be 1 frame, nice. so it will beat any command grab ez
■Orochi Breaker (UC2) start-up reduced from 2F to 1F; throw range increased from 1.16 to 1.4; input command changed to 720+PPP
So it will be 0+1? They will jump it anyways, It has to be 1+0 so he can catch them
It is 1+0. Hoodaman confirmed you can’t jump away
Alright, Combofiend just posted the new official changes, based on Taiwan build:
http://www.capcom-unity.com/combofiend/blog/2014/01/30/ultra-street-fighter-4-change-list
Here they are for Honda:
•Close standing hard punch: Hitbox increased vertically
•Far standing hard punch: Damage increased from max range (80->90)
•Far standing hard kick: Disadvantage when opponent guards reduced (7F->6F)
•Far standing hard kick: Hitbox increased in front
•Forward/Backward jump middle punch: Hurtbox reduced
•Forward/Backward jump middle kick: Attack is active longer (increased by 1F)
•EX Sumo Headbutt: Pushback on block reduced
•EX Hundred Hands: Advantage after hit increased (4F->5F)
•EX Command Grab: **Throw invincible **on start (1F~5F)
•Ultimate Killer Head Ram: Start up increased (8F->10F)
•Orochi Breaker: Starts up faster after the flash (2F->1F)
•Orochi Breaker: Grabs from further (1.16->1.4)
•Orochi Breaker: Command change (63241x2+PPP->720+PPP)
I underlined the new changes. So:
- Ultra 1 is now 10 fr start up. They took away the combo into ultra, but U1 won’t be as good against fireballs, either.
- Ex Oicho is now only throw invincible, instead of full invincibility - this one is a bummer, considering the Ex Hb nerf…
My thoughts:
-
I can live with U1 being 10fr start, but I would like to increase the traveling speed after the animation (in compensation for startup loss). I’m pretty sure we will still be ablt to combo into U1, but will be heavily character specific and a 1fr link
Also, considering U1 won’t be as good against fireballs, maybe: -
Lp Headbutt getting 1-15 fireball invincible frames
OR -
Ex Headbutt is on 9th frame fireball invincible
-
Regarding Ex Oicho: ok, they consider full invincibility too strong, but if they keep the Ex Hb nerf (at least increase pushback to 8.5 squares), I think Ex Oicho should get something more, throw invincible is too little, imo. So:
-
1 hit of armor: a lighter version of full invincibility. We could also do ex armor cancel…
-
range increased to 1.70: a mini Lp spd for the cost of 1 bar
-
range increased to 1.60, and start up reduced by 1~2 frames
-
range increased to 1.60. and throw invincible
-
range increased to 1.60. and not cross up on hit
-
start up reduced and not cross up on hit
-
not cross up on hit and throw invincible
I’m curious, which one of these you guys would like the most/ think would be the most usefull for Honda ?
honestly the buffs are a joke at this point. there is not one that is even remotely useful.
We got no damage which is what everyone asked for. We got a 10 damage on HP. whoop dee doo. a buff on CL HP (a move that i have seen come out maybe 10 times in 11,000 matches)
you gave us a useful u2, and now took it away with this post flash bullshit. completely garbage again.
you gave us a better u1, i understand if HHS into u1 was OP but fuck sakes man 1 f faster? you fucking serious?
you took away our “safe” ex headbutt, so you could give us a good oicho. now you made it poop again.
the buffs to the jump ins completely un necessary. cant see this changing the way i approach anything
the buffs to EX HHS i could care less. the combos are too unreliable.
im straight up pissed about these changes. honestly just leave him the same and give us delayed wakeup. we already lose to red focus. hondas gonna drop big time.
No, I’m not pleased with the latest changes.
Imo, there need to be some compensation buffs like EmanuelB suggested.
LOL!.. Capcom just nerfed the few buffs that were simply good as they were!
OK… Honda is NOT loved by Capcom at all (is the only World Warrior exluded from SFxT), but if those are the definitive changes, in Ultra SF4, it’ll be a low-tier for sure (considering the other pg’s buffs)…
ULtra 1 ( 10 frames ) and EX Ochio not full invincible ? People will drop honda… that’s it. Where is Akimo? can he go to the location test and talk to the guys about it?
was having a good morning til i saw this. then my day seriously turned into complete shit. thx combo
Stop your whining. The EX Command Grab lost hit inv because they reverted the EX Head Butt back to its initial state.
So, so far, we have almost no(if any) nerfs compared to AE 2012.
I think you misinterpreted it. Pretty sure it is still 1+0.
where does it say that it is back to its initial state? " EX Sumo Headbutt: Pushback on block reduced "
Sir, you know something we don’t ? Because in the official changelog Ex Headbutt is still with the pushback reduced, so the nerf is still there.
You have any additional info ? I am really curious about anything…
me as E.Honda player I am as worry as getting results from a lottery, Gosh ! we need the ULTRA1 back to 8frames and the full invincible ochio, otherwise the “new” throw invincible ochio will be useless IMO !