i know the match ups now just need more practice thanks for helping guys
Honda has to be played lame. Get the life lead and sit back make him come to you. If he gets the lead and sits back it’s most likely ggpo. Only fierce head butt can be punished with jab CoD or Ultra. Step kick fierce link can only land at max range. Butt slam is safe(-2?) vs Abel on block so try to avoid blocking the downward portion of the butt slam whenever possible. AA with the usual. St. mk is actually pretty good in this m/u, and I get a lot of mileage out of strong FS. An os I use is off a sweep, I cancel into RH roll, immediately cross up(kill his back charge) with medium kick xx ex FS. This beats all his butt slams except for medium kick, if he blocks continue pressure.
Vs. Cammy majority of this match-up is either spent keeping her out and if that fails, blocking, her throw range is a joke(.79) and she doesn’t have a kara grab so block away. But her foot speed can make up for her lacking throw range so always be ready to tech. Once she gets meter that’s when the throw tech gets baited with EX tkcs(instant dive kick) which can lead to 300+damage, 400+ stun and mix-up. Jump back jab(will be dp’d if she ends up doing nothing) and if you’re really confident in your read FS(Jab, Strong or EX) are viable counters to this throw tech bait, but at end of the day blocking and possibly eating a throw is probably your best bet. She has a 5 frame DP so safe jump her anytime you can limit her to blocking on wake up, and pressure which will eventually make her want to wake up with a back dash to escape. Most of my OS’s stem from safe jumps. I usually OS sweep, step kick, dash or if I have stock and a good read, Ultra.
Go to these threads for your match-up needs and quandaries*:*
[SIZE=3]Breathless… SUPER Abel Match Theory Thread[/SIZE]
[SIZE=3]Ask 801 Strider[/SIZE]
ronin thx for ur post. interesting os against honda.
What do you Guys look out in the cammy matchup? What are the ideal counters in which situation?
I counter a blocked canon spike (dp) with dash, step kick, which worked quite nice, figured out that dash cr.hp is possible as well! I dont exactly know what to do when blockin a spiral arrow (qcf K). Sometimes cr.hp works, most times not (depends on the distance ofc, but hard to see for me). Cr.mp often is too slow as well, cause the blockstun is quite weird, and I never know when to plink for cr.mp, weirds thing, so most of the times I am just normal throwing her . Step kick sucks after blocked spiral arrow, cause she is crouching? I just dont know what to look for, to have the optimal counter.
Same for the basic canon strikes (dive kick), how is my frame advantage or disadvantage?? I know its better to block them standing, to have more advantage, but what should I do after blocking that. I have so much problems with the matchups because I cant really use step kick, my opponents are, when in step kick range, always jumping or crouching with her, so in the best case I get a step kick > TT or when counterhit, I can continue with close mp. Man that matchup sucks
ya, this match-up is a sharp pain in the neck for sure.
For starters take note that the frame data on Cammy’s spiral arrows are wrong.
her :hk: spiral arrow, while official frame data has it being somewhere between -14 and -17 its actually -10!
What does this mean?
Abel’s cr mp is 7 frame start up
cr hp is 8 frames start up
From a point blank spiral arrow, these punishes can already be a little tight
it just takes cammy to connect the spiral arrow a little meaty to make herself -7 -8 thus making those punishes risky/hard/impossible.
If she’s very close after blocking her spiral arrow, i’d suggest to either go straight for the TT,
or if you have the meter, start with close mp and combo from there
they’re obviously not ideal but they’re consistent
Her dive kicks are a pain to anti air.
Because of its hight, standing mk gives me some good results sometimes
far mp from a distance works well too.
crouching medium kick is a poor option
crouching hp seems to trade often but because of its slow start up, it’s a huge liability.
I think the best way to stop her dive kicks would be to react to them and jump back mk.
As for on block, I think her normal dive kicks can easily be within the neighborhood of -2-5 range
in which case standing throw should at least force her to tech
Ah thx, didnt know that the frame data is wrong oO, thx.