Thank you, that’s more clear to me.
very good/informative post dawg! :tup:
been contimplating on using a dc agetec pcb and a ps1 pad for my dual pcb setup. have you or anyone noticed any problems, glitches, weird stuff happening when both pcb’s are powered on by one console?
i ain’t no expert, but i was thinking for ex: from TMO first diagram on pg1,
– i have my dreamcast on with just the dc joystick plug plugged in
– i hit my jab button, thinking electronic “flow” the circuit is now closed (momentarily)
– signal flows through both pcbs, right?
– what happens with the ps2 data signal showing the circuit is closed (button pushed)? does this ever reach the dc pcb?
– how or what happens when this ps2 signal reaches the dc pcb?
–last question how does the dc and ps2 know what signals to accept since they are both powered on and essentially share the same circuit the buttons and stick inputs are on?
thanks toodles, i just wanna get better understanding of this setup dawg :bgrin:
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Lucky! That is all.
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Not a loop, an intercept. I always do it at the wires exposed going to the pcb. There’s about 1" there. I use 1/2" for the pcb and 1/2" to go to diodes.
Basically, the diodes replace the switch. The striped end of the diodes are connected together. That end goes to Vcc on the pads. The 2(or however pads you have) other ends go to the power wire on the cords. In the switch analogy, the diodes are connected the same way; the striped ends of the diodes make the common Vcc connection for the pads. The other wires are your power supplies.
Honestly, if you’re not sure, be careful. Not with the diodes thesemselves, which are pure safety devices. Use caution with multiples systems. Once you get the diodes working on two pads, it’s then safe to plug both pads in at once.
Okay, time for a refresher on how pads work.
There’s 2 parts, power and logic.
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The power is supplied from the Vcc wire(usually red). It flows into the pad, powering the chip. It flows back into the console via the ground wire.
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Logic. Once the pad has power, the input can look for 2 things; either an analog or a digital signal. For cheapo USB pads and DC, you’re dealing with mainly digital. The ‘input’ wire on the pad is ‘sensing’ a 0V(ground) or 5V(power) signal. Usually, it sits at 5V unless someone comes along and shorts it to ground.
That is why pads need power to work. If the pad is powered, it doesn’t interfere with the circuit. Instead, if works normally, sensing inputs and sending signals to the console.
If you need to ‘switch’ pads, you do it(your hacking) along the Vcc wire. I cannot stress this enough. If you start switching ground wires, it won’t work and you will waste your time. All grounds need to be common and connected together. All pads need to be powered. Done deal.
p.s. Just clicked on Toodles’s link from post #120, lmao.
4 years ago, too good. But yeah. One diode per system. The system with the highest voltage will supply all pads, so it’s 100% safe(minus a REALLY bad diode). So bypass the fuse. If all systems have the EXACT same voltage, they’ll share the current needed. So by using diodes, it’s like a switch. You can have all pads get 3.3 volts, or 5 volts.
The fuse was another famous mod. I was pissed cuz everyone was posting this fix suggesting a 10 ohm resistor instead of the blown DC fuse. Sure, it’ll work, but for all the wrong reasons. Fuse that shit. I would never bother installing a fuse inside a joystick.
If you want a pic, post #116, or http://www.geocities.com/alainprice/5v.bmp
The + end of the diodes is you cutting the red wire on the cord. The end going to console gois to + on the diodes(1n914 much prefered). If you have no clue what they’re worth, I’d say up to 5$ for all you need. The - end of the diodes is the striped end. Twist em together and solder them to a wire that feeds the other chopped end of cord for the pads.
Ok with the diodes is there a certan type? I have zenier diodes, 1N757A 9.1v 1/2 watt. Will these work with a XBox 360 and PSX pad?
Thanks,
Michael
man, i’m still confused how to install a diode on a dual pcb setup… … 
i looked at shin ace’s diagram and still don’t understand it, can someone make a very simple (A B C) diagram/sketch of this?
thank you 
Don’t use zener diodes.
I am an electronics noob so please be a bit more specific as to why I shouldn’t use the zener diodes. What type of diode should I be using?
Thank you,
Kaytrim
Do you know what a zener diode does? That’s why you shouldn’t use em.
Use a 1n914 if you can, otherwise, 1n4148, or 1n4001.
I’m about to undertake a dual purpose PS3/360 stick & I wanted to just have somebody here confirm my plan. I am a visual learner & I haven’t seen anything explicitly drafted regarding this single USB cable mod… so I took the liberty of modding TMO’s diagram posted earlier. Correct, no? Thanks.
http://homepage.mac.com/cramlet/.Pictures/extra/dualpcb1.jpg
Looks great. Check CodyK’s post on Virtuafighter; that’s exactly how he (and Akuma001 does a bunch from what I hear) does the dual PCB in VSHG’s.
My idea, althought I havent seen it done yet, is to have both wired to a small USB hub inside the stick. Both consoles will ignore the other’s controllers, you can have a single USB cable coming out, with no switches. 
I’m not entirely sure I understand this. If both PCB’s are powered, and both PCB’s are connected to the buttons, and both PCB’s are sending data packets to the USB hub… might that not cause problems on the console side?
Essentially the console would be receiving both 360 & PS3 data logic… which even though it could handle one perfectly, I would think it would handle the combination poorly. I’d be like me trying to interpret a conversation if inserted between every English word was a German word. I could probably decipher the sentence… but it wouldn’t be at native speed. Know what I’m saying?
Definitely sounds cool though (especially as it sounds non-destructive). I’d be interested in hearing your thoughts on the above though.
Right, right, right, and nope. If you have the consoles and a cheap USB hub, just give it a shot. Plug both a sixaxis and a wired 360 pad into the hub, and plug the hub into your console of choice. Electronically, the only thing difference between this little test and the wiring I’m proposing is that your wiring will make both press the equivalent buttons at the same time.
Good analogy, but keep in mind both systems will see it as two different people (USB devices), and since the console will see that one doesn’t speak its language, it will ignore the one it doesn’t understand. It won’t cause any slowdown because the ignored one will be ignored;there’s no processing of what its saying past the initial plug in when the device is identified. Bandwidth isnt an issue because AFAIK, both PS3 and Xbox360 controllers are low speed HID devices; USB 1 bandwidth is 12mbits, and low speed devices have a max bandwidth of 1.5mbits, and only use a few kilobytes per second.
I’m not sure what you mean by non-destructive; opening up the USB hub and wiring everything together will make the USB hub useless for anything else
Possible drawbacks though, just to be totally honest; If any games, or the consoles themselves, decide to puke and not budge until the unknown controller is removed, you’re screwed. So far, none of the consoles or games do this that I know of. When plugged into a PC, both controllers will be identified; you can use either or both as long as you have the proper drivers installed.
The wiring is only a little more complicated than what you’re describing. In your drawing, you have the shared +5v and GNDs going to the output USB cable, and the DPST switch controlling which D+ and D- pair go to the USB cable. With the hub method, you have the four USB wires from each controller going to the four wires in a USB jack on the hub. You remove the usually short pigtail USB cable from the hub, and solder in a longer USB cable in its spot.
Great idea, Toodles. I’ll probably try it with my next multi-system stick.
guess i was short-changing modern console intelligence. good to know.
yeah, probably not the best usage of the word (given the inherent nature of a pad-hack)… or the most thought out comment i’ve ever made. what i was envisioning was an uncut USB cable. for me personally, all my sticks are somewhat temporary & i’m always more than willing to frankenstein something from something else.
in the case of an unaltered USB hub driven stick, one could theoretically remove the PCB & OEM cable with minor effort… were there ever any need/want to… however the more i think about it the more i’m sure its a moot point as A) no one wants 6’ of cable coiled inside their stick & B) for the sake of elegance, no one would keep all the USB connection interfaces, they’d simply cut/splice the wires.
regardless, cool stuff. i look forward to seeing your next project 
I’ve never switched from one console to another. If I use a switch, it’s to choose which consoles powers the pads. Both pads always send signals to the console, it’s just that one pad is usually unplugged.
Does this actually work? I wanna do this with two WIRELESS controllers, and charge with a single USB port.
Looking at the PS3 controller… it looks like there are 5 USB pins, not 4 though/
Technically, yes. However, you’re feeding either a 360 signal or ps3 signal through a USB cable. That alone is a serious problem because not all consoles work with 4 wires.
The power section is correct, but has 0 protection. Diodes or a switch would be nice.
The signal section is completely wrong. In reality, you’ll have the 2 cords for the consoles coming out the back. One plugs into console A and the other console B. You can even have them plugged in at the same time, assuming you have protection on the +5 wire. There is no reason to merge them.
The exception to the rule is what you pointed out. Charging. You do exactly as the photo, no protection at all, for the red and black wires. Forget about the green and grey wires completely. Sounds like some good cable butchering to me. I hope you have spares.
i know a guy who tried this a couple months ago and it didn’t work for him because everytime he was in ps3 mode, whenever he pressed start/guide it would turn on his 360 or if he was in 360, whenever he pressed the guide button it would turn on his ps3.
i guess you can stop this by keeping the console you’re not using unplugged but that is just hassle.
i dunno if he ever figured a way around this because he had no idea how to disable the green and white data lines like in a wired mod because these pads were wireless and there were none.
Both the ps3 and 360 signals are USB, use a USB cable, and send data over the two wires. This is a rather common mod, and only used on USB based pads. Separate controllers for other systems can still be used with separate cables, but there is no need for multiple USB cables.
Umm, how is he going to plug that one USB cable into multiple consoles at once?
Reasons to merge them:
- Only one cable hanging out the stick.
- No need for the mentioned protection because there is only one cable.
- In this reality, this has been done a whole bunch and works awesome.
Reasons not to merge them: - So you can play two consoles simultaneously.
I avoided answering his question because of how difficult it would be an a lot of variables unaccounted for. For example, I have every faith that the picture described would charge the batteries just peachy. However, how are you going to keep both PCB’s powered? Remember, the purpose is for a wireless stick. The connections about are for the charging port (Xbox) and the USB connection (PS3). If they aren’t plugged in, what’s going to make sure they both remain powered? Doing that would require some additional connections between them tapping their true power(the batteries), not the charging line. Also, I’ve not seen any multimeter measurements of the voltage on the SIXAXIS common line; they could easily be a common high setup. And silly little problems like pressing start on starting up the 360 when you want to play on the PS3…This is totally one of those ‘if you have to ask…’ projects, and I think your description is incomplete.