10/01/2017 Las Vegas Strip Shooting

[itzpookiie]

In a hypothetical USA where guns are banned or much more heavily regulated are the police still armed with them?

Yes

[Vhozite]

In a hypothetical USA where guns are banned or much more heavily regulated are the police still armed with them?

Yes

Yeah…that can fuck all the way off.

[TKR]

In a hypothetical USA where guns are banned or much more heavily regulated are the police still armed with them?

Yes

Yeah…that can fuck all the way off.

What difference would it make, they are armed now. It would obviously have to be heavily regulated with them as well. Did you read the Japan link I put up. Their cops have their guns while on duty, then lock them up when they are done. They don’t even take them home with them.

[itzpookiie]

In a hypothetical USA where guns are banned or much more heavily regulated are the police still armed with them?

Yes

Yeah…that can fuck all the way off.

well firearm related massacres can fuck off
Over 50 lives were lost and hundreds injured in a matter of hours
Because of current gun laws, this can happen EVERY SINGLE DAY

[Reticently]

It wasn’t a mental issue until the dude with the vast stockpile of weapons murdered a crowd of defenseless people.

Like what is easier to institute and less intrusive?

A constant monitering of peoples mental health, making sure they don’t show the signs of commiting mass murder or keeping track of existing weapons and weapons that will manufactered in the future?

It’s about removing the stigma of going to a shrink so folks don’t get to the point of wanting to shoot people.

I was right across the street at work in a connected hospital back in 2012 when a psychiatric patient shot up the Western Psychiatric Institute and Clinic of Pittsburgh. Guy wouldn’t even have had to step outside to get to me. Eight people shot, two killed. Guy had seen 17 different doctors in the months before he shot the place up, can’t say he didn’t have access.

Obviously a lot of people really don’t have access to the help they need, but that’s actually kind of a red herring in the gun debate. The fact is that America has enshrined the right of its citizens to not have to improvise weapons in the event that they snap and want to maximize the number of other people they harm or kill, and nothing is going to change. We’re exactly one cynical dose of reality away from replacing the “gun control” conversation with the “what’s it going to take to break this guy’s record” conversation.

How was a guy that fucked up in the head able to get a gun? Someone dropped the ball there and should be held accountable. Still, the fact remains, when people feel disconnected from society, life, institutions, and have nowhere and no one to turn to (in their own minds anyway) that pushes them towards stuff like this. Can we at least agree on that? Sure, there will be crazy people that get guns here and there, but the more sound of mind people are, the less you’ll have folks considering these types of actions.

The fact that we’re just kind of like kanyeshrug “Another mass shooting…” is a serious problem. Like, we’re desensitized to the point of it almost being a normal everyday thing.

Nobody dropped the ball- he bought the guns from a private individual who sold them completely legally. There is no law requiring even a background check for sale of firearms by a private individual.

People should have universal access to mental healthcare the same as any other healthcare, but in the gun debate it’s a spurious point. The fact is that statistically it has been shown that you are far more likely to be killed by someone who is mentally healthy than by someone who isn’t. Further, while it seems natural that people who feel connected to society are less likely to commit violent acts, that isn’t actually an issue that psychiatry is capable of addressing, and there isn’t even any clear evidence that it happens to be true anyway. Case in point, the Vegas shooter was an affluent white male with a romantic partner and family that he cared about.

Being desensitized isn’t even an issue to most Americans. Americans value having the capacity to kill each other more highly than they value each others’ safety.

[HNIC_Mike]

So the counter argument to gun control is you cant stop everything, so may as well not try?

Welp. Cant stop people from making bombs either, so when is walmart going to sell me some c4 or maybe some hand grenades?

[angelpalm]

Lets just get rid of all traffic laws and speed limits guys

National Maximum Speed Law

[DevilJin_01]

Heard this guy equipped something to the gun that allowed it to fire like a true automatic rifle. This dude was on one.

Seeing that I went to Evo 2k16 and was right in the stadium, this is rough to see. I think there was a security checkpoint into the stadium, but can’t remember. Either way these people were in a really bad spot since they could be aimed at from a generic window at a hotel. This is stuff that standard mental patients I don’t think would be able to come up with. Definitely some cold, calculated shit.

Prayers to all involved and I imagine it’s going to be a bit more of a bitch to get into hotels now after this. Public gatherings just get tougher and tougher to attend now. Once you’re in any establishment with a crowd of people your life is on the line now. For the FGC this is very serious as we are always at sizeable gatherings where this stuff usually occurs.

[DoctaMario]

It wasn’t a mental issue until the dude with the vast stockpile of weapons murdered a crowd of defenseless people.

Like what is easier to institute and less intrusive?

A constant monitering of peoples mental health, making sure they don’t show the signs of commiting mass murder or keeping track of existing weapons and weapons that will manufactered in the future?

It’s about removing the stigma of going to a shrink so folks don’t get to the point of wanting to shoot people.

I was right across the street at work in a connected hospital back in 2012 when a psychiatric patient shot up the Western Psychiatric Institute and Clinic of Pittsburgh. Guy wouldn’t even have had to step outside to get to me. Eight people shot, two killed. Guy had seen 17 different doctors in the months before he shot the place up, can’t say he didn’t have access.

Obviously a lot of people really don’t have access to the help they need, but that’s actually kind of a red herring in the gun debate. The fact is that America has enshrined the right of its citizens to not have to improvise weapons in the event that they snap and want to maximize the number of other people they harm or kill, and nothing is going to change. We’re exactly one cynical dose of reality away from replacing the “gun control” conversation with the “what’s it going to take to break this guy’s record” conversation.

How was a guy that fucked up in the head able to get a gun? Someone dropped the ball there and should be held accountable. Still, the fact remains, when people feel disconnected from society, life, institutions, and have nowhere and no one to turn to (in their own minds anyway) that pushes them towards stuff like this. Can we at least agree on that? Sure, there will be crazy people that get guns here and there, but the more sound of mind people are, the less you’ll have folks considering these types of actions.

The fact that we’re just kind of like kanyeshrug “Another mass shooting…” is a serious problem. Like, we’re desensitized to the point of it almost being a normal everyday thing.

Nobody dropped the ball- he bought the guns from a private individual who sold them completely legally. There is no law requiring even a background check for sale of firearms by a private individual.

People should have universal access to mental healthcare the same as any other healthcare, but in the gun debate it’s a spurious point. The fact is that statistically it has been shown that you are far more likely to be killed by someone who is mentally healthy than by someone who isn’t. Further, while it seems natural that people who feel connected to society are less likely to commit violent acts, that isn’t actually an issue that psychiatry is capable of addressing, and there isn’t even any clear evidence that it happens to be true anyway. Case in point, the Vegas shooter was an affluent white male with a romantic partner and family that he cared about.

Being desensitized isn’t even an issue to most Americans. Americans value having the capacity to kill each other more highly than they value each others’ safety.

I wouldn’t define someone who is able to make the premeditated choice to kill “mentally healthy” but ymmv. I agree with your last sentence, but don’t you find that troubling?

[DoctaMario]

In a hypothetical USA where guns are banned or much more heavily regulated are the police still armed with them?

Yes

Yeah…that can fuck all the way off.

Think about how many less people would get shot by cops if the cops didn’t constantly have to worry about whether or not someone has a gun on them and might potentially use it on them.

[white_shadow]

Bypassing the whole gun debate a bit, the thing that I’ve always been equally fascinated and disturbed by are the most toxic portion of human race- psychopaths and sociopaths.

They shells of humans with superficial charm, manipulative, with virtually zero empathy, only seeking wealth, power, and self-glorification by any means. Seeing as this guy’s father was a noted psychopath and career criminal, and psychopathy is inheritable, do you think that people with antisocial tendencies should be tagged or refused certain privileges (like firearm possession) and human welfare/financial/government-oriented jobs where they can wreak havoc?

Bear in mind this is different from being a mental health issue since psychopaths and sociopaths are not mentally ill, just devoid of the standard moral compass most humans naturally possess.

[Reticently]

It wasn’t a mental issue until the dude with the vast stockpile of weapons murdered a crowd of defenseless people.

Like what is easier to institute and less intrusive?

A constant monitering of peoples mental health, making sure they don’t show the signs of commiting mass murder or keeping track of existing weapons and weapons that will manufactered in the future?

It’s about removing the stigma of going to a shrink so folks don’t get to the point of wanting to shoot people.

I was right across the street at work in a connected hospital back in 2012 when a psychiatric patient shot up the Western Psychiatric Institute and Clinic of Pittsburgh. Guy wouldn’t even have had to step outside to get to me. Eight people shot, two killed. Guy had seen 17 different doctors in the months before he shot the place up, can’t say he didn’t have access.

Obviously a lot of people really don’t have access to the help they need, but that’s actually kind of a red herring in the gun debate. The fact is that America has enshrined the right of its citizens to not have to improvise weapons in the event that they snap and want to maximize the number of other people they harm or kill, and nothing is going to change. We’re exactly one cynical dose of reality away from replacing the “gun control” conversation with the “what’s it going to take to break this guy’s record” conversation.

How was a guy that fucked up in the head able to get a gun? Someone dropped the ball there and should be held accountable. Still, the fact remains, when people feel disconnected from society, life, institutions, and have nowhere and no one to turn to (in their own minds anyway) that pushes them towards stuff like this. Can we at least agree on that? Sure, there will be crazy people that get guns here and there, but the more sound of mind people are, the less you’ll have folks considering these types of actions.

The fact that we’re just kind of like kanyeshrug “Another mass shooting…” is a serious problem. Like, we’re desensitized to the point of it almost being a normal everyday thing.

Nobody dropped the ball- he bought the guns from a private individual who sold them completely legally. There is no law requiring even a background check for sale of firearms by a private individual.

People should have universal access to mental healthcare the same as any other healthcare, but in the gun debate it’s a spurious point. The fact is that statistically it has been shown that you are far more likely to be killed by someone who is mentally healthy than by someone who isn’t. Further, while it seems natural that people who feel connected to society are less likely to commit violent acts, that isn’t actually an issue that psychiatry is capable of addressing, and there isn’t even any clear evidence that it happens to be true anyway. Case in point, the Vegas shooter was an affluent white male with a romantic partner and family that he cared about.

Being desensitized isn’t even an issue to most Americans. Americans value having the capacity to kill each other more highly than they value each others’ safety.

I wouldn’t define someone who is able to make the premeditated choice to kill “mentally healthy” but ymmv. I agree with your last sentence, but don’t you find that troubling?

Deeply disturbing, like an incurable disease diagnosis.

[dab00g]

Knives do require some competency. If your

But does it have an effect on overall crime?

You can’t put gun crime on a pedestal, IMO. If you reduce gun crime, but the overall crime rate isn’t really affected, then it was all for naught.

All of these arguments you’re making have been pulled to pieces hundreds of times.

But you haven’t done it once.

A death by a gun isn’t any more special than a death by stabbing or burning. At the end of the day, those people are still dead.

Yes, crime will still exist and criminals will get guns.

Yes, there have been terror attacks not involving guns.

Yes.

Do you know what has happened in countries with stricter gun laws though? Less mass shootings. The U.S is the only place it happens.

Absolutely false re: bolded. Nobody cried when 37 people got gunned down in the Phillipines. Nobody cried when a gunman opened fire on a town council in Nanterre, France. The rest of the world probably didn’t even hear about it.

https://crimeresearch.org/2015/06/comparing-death-rates-from-mass-public-shootings-in-the-us-and-europe/
https://crimeresearch.org/2017/01/with-39-killed-in-tunisia-attack-the-top-three-mass-public-shootings-are-outside-the-united-states/

Arguing for guns is like arguing not to have a speed limit.

There’s no argument, nor comparison between the two. They exist in the US to the extent it is physically impossible to take them away. That’s not something that can be argued for or against, it’s a physical reality. Even if you suddenly banned all guns; until you remove them, there will still be hundreds of millions of them in circulation.

Yes some cars brake from high speeds, some situations are not dangerous to others by going fast, there are plenty of responsible drivers that wouldn’t abuse it. At the end of the day there are speed limits though because the shit people out there ruin it for everyone else. That’s just the way it is.

You’ll notice from this whole discussion that I’m fine with regulation, and keeping guns out of the hands of psychopaths, so you’re not making any sort of cohesive argument here.

It’s the way a lot of things are, some people are fine on drugs… Again, they’re too dangerous to just legalise because of irresponsible people.

If you have a means of removing guns from the US, let’s hear it. We all know how the wars on alcohol and drugs turned out.

A lot of families of those 37 dead cry

Also bootlegging weapons and high power assault rifles are big in the philippines

After karaoke, guns are a hobby and there are so many enthusiasts from
Congressmen to mayors to the president to rich people that no way will they get rid of them even with a registry

Not to mention terrorist organizations, gangs, cartel, triad, yakuza, american ex-pats

There are so many armed and dangerous there. I mean look at militias

Trying a buyback or confiscation of all assault weapons won’t work in the us or in the Philippines because of rampant crime and gun lobbyist lining the pockets of corrupt (morally and ideologically) politicians who don’t give one shit

Anything about broader registration processes to keep track of gun buyers via online databass? Nope

California does though

[angelpalm]

I see gun nuts already defending bump fire stocks lol.

[angelpalm]

Kids can make this shit in their spare time

[angelpalm]

Best part of bump firing is you can do it for free with zero mods giving the right technique lol

plus you gotta be a fat shit

[Femto_1]

So the counter argument to gun control is you cant stop everything, so may as well not try?

Welp. Cant stop people from making bombs either, so when is walmart going to sell me some c4 or maybe some hand grenades?

I got you fam. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rawstory.com/2017/10/nra-spokesperson-dismisses-las-vegas-massacre-by-claiming-feet-are-just-as-deadly-as-guns/amp/

NRA and false equivalents can fuck off. These people donate heavily to the Republican party.

[itzpookiie]

A gun ban would definitely work
There are a lot of guns in circulation but over time the number will drop enough to be manageable
It’s not impossible
It will take years or even decades but it will work
It’s the journey there that’s gonna be rough

Also can’t compare guns with drugs and alcohol
Those things can be hidden very well even when used
What kind of comparison is that lol

[dab00g]

I hate that argument of “they will kill anyways”

You take away tools and shit gets harder

Especially since most mass shooters had guns that were legally claimed

Like that fucking loser in santa barbara who killed because he wasn’t getting laid

Those two in san bernardino

Orlando

Sandy hook

And now las vegas

These firearms were purchased legally

In the case of roof and sandy hook the parents had those guns legally and the grown children knew how to get a hold of them

Same with columbine those were legally purchased by the parents

At some point you got to think about why were people able to get these and use them

[Necrotrophic]

can’t stop people from shooting places up, so there’s no need for gun laws.

might as well fire all the police officers since you can’t stop anything by having laws.

what’s the point of having a government according to gun nuts?

I’m straight up sick and tired of this stupid debate where gun nuts don’t listen to rational arguments or empirical evidence.