So I’m kind of a noob. Ultra was/is my first fighting game I’ve taken seriously and Yun is my main. A few questions:
Why is EX lunge supposedly so good? I understand that it’s supposed to leave you at advantage frame data wise but I always and I mean ALWAYS get punished with a grab. Never see this or rarely see this happen to Kazunoko (saw a match with Julio though where his opponent exploited that all match though and beat him as a result). I typically read that EX lunge is a great other way to get in but I get punished for using it so often I just try to avoid it entirely unless it’s part of a punish or if I’m ending Ultra 1 with it.
EX Lunge is -1, not +1 anymore. You are at a disadvantage and a throw will beat all your normal attacks. EX Lunge has 2 hits, if only the scond hit is blocked you are either neutral or at an advantage. So to egt it to be neitral or plus on block you ned to do it from max range, or done meaty.
Another way is to do an upkick afterwards based on what they like to do:
-lk upkicks is thrown invincible but doesn’t hit crouching characters
-hk upkicks is strike invincible, but you can throw Yun out of it
-EX upkicks covers both but gets beaten by people who block and it costs and extra bar
By itself the EX lunge is decent, however the treat the upkicks will make people hesitate and from then on you can pressure with a your normal attacks or even do a ccommand grab if they are really scared
Also I know that dive kicks are only safe if they land at about the knee or lower. That being said another thing I’m always getting punished for against better players (or even just those who know the matchup) when I use Light Dive Kick to cross up and opponent. A lot of the time I like to try to cross up light dive kick an opponent off of knocking them down but no matter what I always get grabbed or punished. What am I doing wrong?
You have two type of divekicks:
[list]
[] Meaty divekicks
[] Delayed divekicks
[/list]
No blocked crossup divekick is ever advantageous. If you hit the divekick on block low enough you can attempt to pressure afterwards with a cr.lp though. Try to do a delayed crouchtech if you see the divekick is being blocked, this way you tech the throw and block the dp’s. If they always do a throw you can try a neutral jump immediately after a divekick so that you might pressure them afterwards or get lucky and the nj attack hits.
If they uppercut just block or with some very horizontal dp’s you can do a well timed backdash to make some uppercuts whiff(Fei Long, Akuma)
If you always go for the crossup divekick then they’ll start blocking it, you have to change it up then.
Meaty divekicks are done immediately on the opponent their wakeup, it allows Yun to combo after a crossup divekick on hit, and sometimes even allows him to pressure afterwards on block even you hit them low enough.
Delayed divekicks are done on the assumption the opponent will be crouching and you are looking for them to either do a dp type of reversal, which delayed divekicks will stuff or make them whiff completely, or you want them to crouchtech.
Meaty divekick:
Against smaller character which also don’t have a wide hurtbox you want to do a very slight step forward, it’s rall really small and use a quick lk divekcick. On medium and bigger size characters you simply hold up forward and do a lk dive sligthly before the apex of your jump. Against some wider characters you can experiment with Yun his medium kick divekick. Against atller characters the blocked divekicks are obviousely more negative, i often don’t do a meaty crossup divekick attempt against Zangief, Hawk, Sagat and Seth.
Delayed divekick:
You walk until you are standing next to their body, and if you see the technical message for the quickrise you do jump forward and a late lk divekick. If they are crouching it’ll hit crossup, if they are crouchteching you’ll hit them guarenteed. If they do a dp , it’ll whiff or you’ll stuff it completely(cammy), or you’ll reset them in the air. Dp’s with a very vertical hitbox, ones that go staright up you really have to do a very late lk divekick and jumpp forward slightly earlier to make them whiff or beat it out/reset them.
The downside of a delayed divekick is thaat the opponent can react to it, especially the taller and wider characters, and when they stand block it, you are punishable without a doubt.
Against taller characters you might just want to stay in front with a very quick jumpforward lk divekick or even a neutral jump lk divekick to catch crouchtechs. It;s often not worth it to do a crossup divekick against the taller characters.
*With all divekicks you want to HITCONFIRM them. Practice setting the dummy on random block and see if you can recognize when to press buttons and when you shouldn’t. On hit you’ll do the combo, on block you do’t press anything(or do a delayed crouchtech, this is just and example, get creative)
Also in general what should I be doing when I knock an opponent down/how do I play the oki game properly with Yun? I get away with using what seems to be like the unsafe crossup divekick on an opponents’ wakeup and sometimes I can get a meaty cr. mp, cr mp, st. mp, upkicks but what else can I do? Especially against players who love to mash DP (against such players I try to use crossup divekick when they wake up but if they block I’m screwed because they grab me or dp)
You are basically free in how you want to apply pressure with Yun, however you do need to follow a proper sequence to condition the opponent.
ABSUSE the cr.lk, st.lp chain:
[list]
[] It’s a low hitconfirm starter
[] It leads into you basic BnB
[] It leaves you close enough to do a (command)throw, or a quick divekick to catch crouchtechs
[] You can extend the chain further to make an airtight blockstring(can’t jump, backdash or mash dp etc etc)
[] You can frametrap after it.
[] It has a build in option select against backdashes
[/list]
After you do this chain and they block it, wait or walkback, see what they are doing. Are they mashing a dp, are they crouchteching, are they jumping, are they not pressing anything?
This string will give you valuable information.
[list]
[]If they’re mashing you’ll extend your chain, or you block, if they happen to have meter available to FADC be ready to punish.
[]If they crouchtech you will frametrap them, some examples:
- cr.lk, st.lp, cr.mp
- cr.lk, st.lp, walk forward, st.lp, cr.mp
- cr.lk, slight walk forward, cr.lk, st.lp
- cr.lk, st.lp, lk divekick
- cr.lk, st.mp(counterhit comboes into different things, test it out)
- cr.lk, st.hp xx lp shoulder
- cr.lk, st.lp, walk back cr.mk xx lp shoulder(this is actually a whiffpunish)
- Get creative
You don’t have to start with cr.lk, st.lp but it is one of the better options. You can also do cr.mp and get creative from there, just practice it in training(you record the dummy doing a specific sequence, and you yourself do the thing your setup needs to beat. Example, you record the dummy performing a frametrap, and you mash cr.lk to see if you get counterhit.)
[] If they are jumping then wait and uppercut/U1 or walk slight forward and do cl.mk or go air to air or incorporate Yun his cr.mk xx lp shoulder. etc etc
[*] If they are not pressing anything, then that’s perfect, just do a throw or (ex)command grab.
[/list]
You don’t always have to go with crossupdivekick, actually more often than not people will block it nowadays, delayed divekick is stronger and just basic throw game plus meaties.
During neutral when you land a divekick you can also do cr.lp, st.lp to OS people from backdashing after blocking a divekick.
You want to use safejumps against people to to keep up the pressure and to condition them. During safejumps after showing them once or twice you can go for an empty jump cr.lk to catch them standing for example.
A few safejumps, courtesy of DafeetLee, and almost every other Yun that has been using these safejumps since forever:
*1. forward.throw, dash x 2, whiff s.lp, neutral jump attack – use against 4f+ reversals
This safe jump is frame tight. Just mash out the two dashes after the f. throw and immediately hit s.lp and then neutral jump right after.
-
(Corner only) f. throw, dash, whiff cl.hp, neutral jump attack – use against 4f+ reversals
Easier to perform than safe jump #1 but it’s corner only.
-
(Cammy/Sagat specific) f.throw, dash, whiff cr.hp, forward jump attack (neutral jump attack if in corner)
A Cammy/Sagat specific safejump that works midscreen/corner.
Against Sagat, you can fuzzy him with jump back mp if you jump in with hp and he blocks the j.hp standing and crouches afterwards.
-
f. throw, forward empty jump, forward jump divekick
-
Neutral jump attack after MK upkicks – use against 4f+ reversals
This is if they quick stand after the upkicks. If they don’t quick stand, whiff cr.lk immediately after landing and do another neutral jump attack.*
*Against hard knockdowns(throws, sweeps, some specials, ultras people can delay wakeup, just whiff another st.lp then to get that timing.)
And this is a more general question because outside of knowing it for the timing of my combos and bnbs (through practice I know what 1,2,3, frames “feel” like in terms of the timing of a button press): how exactly do meaty’s work? Do they stuff wakeup attacks? What’s the real benefit and how do I know if I’m timing them correctly?
True meaty attacks connect as soon as the opponent wakeup, the active frames of the meaty attack will meet the hurtbox of the opponent on the very first frame. This means the opponent cannot even be counterhit then as they cannot get out any normal attack except attacks with invincibility. It can also give player that is doing the meaty attack extra frame advantage. This way the opponent learns they cannot do shit except take risks if they want to avoid pressure. And if you bait their uppercut after having done a meaty attack a few times already they’ll either clamp up or do another reversal. If you bait out a reversal again or do a neaty command grab if they’ll block then they are completely mindfucked.
You can also intentionally don’t do a meaty attack and delay it somewhat if the opponent is crouchteching to get a counterhit, you delay it even more if the opponent is doing a delayed crouchtech. You recognize delayed crouchtechs if they don’t get hit by regalar frametraps suchs as cr.lk, st.lp, cr.mp, or even just looking after the cr.lk, st.lp chain. If you see a crouchtech coming out almost immediately then a regular frametrap is enough.
Additionally how to you do Yun’s OS where st. mp comes out? I know how to do the lk or lp to lunge punch on an opponent’s backdash (and OS to Ultra) but the timing to for lk or lp to st mp seems different.
You do cr.lk, st.lp+st.mp, no motion needed. The timing can be done exactly the same as the lp lunge os, though it works better if you do it slower becaise of 1 reason. The st.mp can hit characters out of their airborne frames and you’ll reset them. You wil almost never use this OS however in the case you do:
cr.lk, st.lp+st.mp, if you see the st.mp come out, cancel into lp shoulder or mk upkicks. You want to hold forward between cr.lk, st.lp+st.mp if the backdash you are trying to catch has a lot of airborne frames or it goes very far.
*Don’t bother with this OS unless after you are advanced with Yun, it is a waste of your time at the moment
Against backdashes like Vega you might want to use cr.lk, st.lp+st.mk, the normal OS with lp lunge doesn’t work great against him, so take what you can get.
**
Also any general Yun tips would be appreciated. I would say I’m semi-knowledgable about the character but only know as much as watching Kazunoko and Julio have taken me.**
When you do do 2 lights and 2 medium attacks, or 3 lights and 1 medium then it becomes important to look at if the opponent is standing or crouching.
-If standing: cr.lk, st.lp, cr.mp, cr.mp xx mk upkicks
-If crouching: cr.lk, st.lp, cr.mp, cr.mk xx mp lunge
This is a rule of thumb to insure your combos will always connect if you don’t want to remember on which characters the st.mp xx hk upkicks will whiff after (3 lights and 1 medum) or (2lights and 2 medium) attacks.
Learn to hitconfirm from a single divekick and maximize damage from it. An example aside from raw confirming if the divekick was hitting or getting blocked is if you see a whiffed normal when you did the divekick,
For instance if you saw ryu perform a cr.mk the you KNOW the divekick will connect 100%, then don’t do cr.lp after a divekick but start with a cr.mp for big damage.
Don’t go too often for crossup meaty divekicks, most people will block it on the first try and then you waisted a nice opportunity. Pressuring from the ground is very solid with Yun.
Use red focus instead of Genei Jin, it is better in almost every situation. It deals stun, builds meter back and ony costs 3 bars. Learning Genei Jin is not something you should focus on when learning Yun in the beginning.
st.mp is a surprisingly solid anti-air, however try to use lk upkicks or ex upkicks.
Make it a mixup for the opponent when they try to apply grounded pressure to you. Upkick, Backdash, wakeup throw, wakeup cr.lp are great ways to stay unpredicatable and you can take the offense away from the opponent. After you do an upkick the first time and they do the grounded approach and you think they’ll do a delayed pressure string(they’ll wait until the reversal window has passed.), then you cna simply throw or press cr.lp to start your offense. or even backdash to create space. Some may say it’s a scrubby technique, i say it’s foolish to abide by unwritten rules. “Just block” is overrated when playing Yun, Yun only has to touch you with a st.lp to create an instant mixup.
When using the divekick during neutral, atry to use it in footsie ranges a lot, mainly the hk divekick from either a neutral jump or a forward jump. Do these divekicks as low to the ground as possible to not give the opponent time to perform an anti air, it also catches any pokes, especially low attacks. A way to set it up perfect is this:
Play footsies for a bit to make the opponent comfortable, and then walk ninto their max range from their most used pokes and just divekick, against ryu walk into their cr.mk range and do forward jump hk divekick.
Always use U1 except in a few specific matchups matcups where you want to use U2:
U2 against Sagat, Fuerte, Akuma, maybe against Ryu and Gen where you can also use U1.
Footsies:
-st.mk to stop people from walking forward, also good whiff punisher, excellent against grapplers which cannot crouch under it
-st.lk great whiffpunisher against low attacks, buffer into lp lunge
-st.mp amazing button all around during footsies as a poke and counterpoke, cancel into lp shoulder, however don’t get too predictable
-st.hk goes over lows and has insane hitbox, in corner it can juggle into lp lunge and U, don’t ubuse, it’s focus bait
-f.mk goes over lows and great range, don’t abuse it’s focus bait
-cr.mk doesn’t have great range but it’s still a low attack, it can be used to whiffpunish low attacks though it isn’t that great. Use it when doing a surprise dash intoc r.mk xx lp shoulder into red focus during footsies.
-divekick is a footsie tool, people are extremely scared of getting caught by it during neutral, mix it up between your pokes to not be predictable
People LOVE to neutral jump and focus in reaction or anticipation of a divekick. Practice trying to react to both.
Neutral jump: after performing a divekick to a lk/ex upkicks.
Focus: after divekcik do upkicks or backdash.
st.mp and cr.mk into lp shoulder is NOT a true blockstring. People can use invincible, armoured attacks and a lot of characters can even focus dash through it for a maximum punish.
So look if they know the answer. If they focus, then cancel into his palm, or do st.mp/cr.mk, wait and check their forward dash and punish.
If they use armoured moves(balrog), then cancel into palm also.
If they do a dp, don’t canccel into shoulder.
When trying to cancel into a fake palm keep note of two things:
-cancelling from st.mp xx fake palm moves you forward, thus dp’s can still reach, however you are also closer against to pressure
-cancelling from cr.mk xx fake palm doesn’t move you forward and the dp’s won’t reach
In general, just have fun playing Yun and try to be creative in your offense an general play, and above all have absolute confidence in everything you do because you will need to commit with this character a lot.
Also work on hitconfirming when trying to play Yun, try to avoid doing too many light attacks. With Yun the best defense is being on the offense, then you control the pace and flow of the game.
