70

Yea, that was the only ending that we had trouble with. According to WinterEX3 (Joe), most of that particular ending emphasised how big/broad her fathers back was. Not to mention, she was losing consciousness (sort of like the state before you goto sleep… we couldn’t really find a term to describe it).

To your following post, I agree with it.

But as I said, hopefully within a month I’ll be able to have uploaded the translated endings for one of the previous EX games so we oculd figure out the storyline a bit further.

71

I’ve been having an AOL Instant Message conversation with Jed-Chrizt, the person who translated the Japanese endings and he told me a lot of things I didn’t know about SFEX3’s story. Anyway, according to him, Kairi and Hokuto are alive and well. Here’s the conversation, I’ll be ‘S’ and he’ll be ‘J’.

J: Hey. You don’t know me yet, I’m jed
J: Hello?
S: Hello? Who this be?
J: I’ve been reading your posts.
S: Where do you post?
J: Snk-Capcom but I’ve been reading your posts on shoryuken
J: The Kairi discussions. Some of it is kinda false.
S: Like?
J: Hokuto/Kairi death
S: Hmm. Inform?
J: I thought so to. But honestly Kairi defeated Hokuto very easily.
S: Do you happen to have All About SF EX and can you read Japanese?
J: Yeah, I’ve been researching about Kairi and his clan matters for 4 years.
S: The source of SF EX’s Kairi vs. Hokuto is Saiki, as you know he is the main source of information for the SF Plot Guide.
J: Concerning the Kairi vs. Hokuto case, I believed that for a long time now. But it’s really not true.
S: What are your sources of information may I ask?
J: The SFEX Manga comic, the translations, JP version EX3, Internet Shingoten, Calling, Writing comments to Capcom, Internet Research, the SF Info Guide by slate, the SF EX series, a whole lot more but some are from the net and of course, some are false.
S: Mangas are not official and SF EX3 had it’s share of ‘Easter Eggyness’ in that it’s a game where nothing important happens. Alls I can do is inquire what it says in the All About Books and that’s pretty much it; we sort of take it over Capcom’s word, they sort of don’t care about the storyline anymore.
J: Well you have a point there.
S: But if you really want the info -
admin@capcom-central.com
http://www.capcom-central.com/index.php?page=contact
J: Also another thing. Do you know what happened to Kairi? Hokuto is one of Gouki’s minions.
S: What? I never heard of that!!!
J: …are you serious…
S: Nah, just that Hokuto, Nanase and Kairi are of the Mizukami Clan, and Kairi killed Gouki. Why would Hokuto be a Gouki minion? Strange.
J: She did not purposely become one no! You do know that the spirit of Akuma(Gouki) possessed Kairi? When Hokuto fought him she was beaten down and taken over just like Kairi, Nanase was the only one left to save them. Kairi and Hokuto didn’t double death.

(From sano: At this point he began showing me the endings that were posted here until I put 2 and 2 together and figured out they were the same endings posted here and that he was the translator).

S: Okay. Here’s my question though. Where SF EX2 left off, did it leave it as Saiki explained as the the two were about to off each other and then SF EX3 settled it as they didn’t off each other? that would in fact go along with what Saiki said.
J: In SFEX2 they did fight each other.
S: There is also no All About SF EX3 nor is SF EX3 covered in All About Capcom, so that would actually make sense. Also I believe when Saiki was talking about SF EX2 SF EX 3 wasn’t out yet.
J: Oh and did you know that Nanase is the leader of the Miz clan now?
S: Nah, but I didn’t really think about it.

(Jed Refers to his translations of Nanase’s endings).

J: Nanase saved him from the entire thing.
S: Some of those endings I dismissed because some of it makes no sense, like Hokuto looking at Kairi’s back and remembering… her father, what?
J: Yeah!
S: That’s what I’m saying, they are confusing. One talked about their dad, another about a newborn baby, what??? It’s just that I really couldn’t make sense of those endings to tell you the truth.
J: Yeah they basically are a bit… yeah…
S: Nothing against your translations though.
J: If you think about it, how could Hokuto kill a raging demon like Kairi?
S: As what Saiki said, in SF EX2 Kairi powered down a bit before the last punch and then that was the 'cliffhanger.'
J: Ahh! The so-called Kairi sparring his sister, I couldn’t take hearing this.
S: See as I said, our books referenced take place before SF EX3 came out.
J: Well yeah. But these things are for sure.
S: So each game tends to change what happened before or explain what happened, sometimes they alter things too or claim this happened or that ending didn’t happen. It happens with every fighting game.
J: Long story short.

  • Kairi got his ass whooped by Gouki

  • Kairi lost his memory and memorized Gouki’s moves and killed him

  • Kairi dissapeared from the clan

  • Hokuto went out in search of her brother, eventually finding him and challenging him to a duel. Lost miserably.

  • Hokuto became one of Kairi’s minions

  • Nanase is the savior of this whole situation. Her kind heart, her sweet words, hugs Nanase lol
    S: I thought Hokuto was Gouki’s minion? Or do you just mean she was under Satsui No Hadou?
    J: No Kairi was possessed by Gouki. It was Gouki’s only hope of another body.
    S: Hold on, Kairi killed Gouki and Gouki possessed him?
    J: That’s right, that’s how he became way too powerful. Nanase talks Kairi back into memory.
    S: So after Kairi defeated Hokuto, Hokuto became Kairi’s ‘minion,’ then Nanase talked Kairi out of it?
    J: Yes. Nanase wasn’t a match for either. Her only hope was to just…talk.
    S: So first Kairi kicked Nanase’s Ass? How did Hokuto snap back?
    J: If the main power source is broken (Kairi) the minion will be broken down.
    S: But didn’t Hokuto become “Evil” while she was fighting Kairi or after?
    J: While fighting Kairi. End of the fight anyways.
    S: Okay I think I get it. Let me recap. Kairi fought Gouki, Gouki jacked up Kairi and Kairi lost his memory. Later Kairi killed Gouki and Gouki possessed him. Hokuto fought Kairi and became evil during. When Hokuto lost she became Kairi’s minion. Nanase fought Kairi and Kairi won, but in the end Nanase was able to remind him of his past.
    J: That’s it. A long story made short.
    S: What happened afterwards? Nanase became the leader of the Mitzukami clan and what became of Hokuto and Kairi?
    J: OK Hokuto I am not 100% sure of, like maybe 90% sure of.
    S: Kairi ran away agian it looks like?
    J: How did you know?
    S: That’s what SF EX3 endings made it look like.
    J: But this time it wasnn’t a evil-ish thingy, he just went on with life, Kairi decided to go a seperate path. Due to all of this, Hokuto and Nanase’s bond strengthened. Hokuto and Nanase stayed back with clan matters. Kairi went on a seperate non-evil path.
    S: So why did Hokuto let Nanase lead the clan?
    J: Hokuto lead it when she returned, she was older, more experienced. When Kairi and Hokuto were away Nanase took lead of it.
    S: Oh so Nanase only ruled the clan when Hokuto wasn’t there. I see.
    J: The puppet master behind this is Garuda.
    S: I was just about to ask you how Garuda fit into all of this.
    J: Garuda is fueled by Shin Souls. Thus when Gouki died Garuda came into physical form hoping for Kairi to eventually die so he’ll get more power.
    S: That part I knew, that Garuda was born when Gouki was killed. So is he fueled by victims of the Shun Goku Satsu?
    J: And the Snin Jackal souls. Infact, he’s the main reason for Evil Ryu.
    S: What are the Shin Jackal souls, and Evil Ryu, ???
    J: Shin Jackal is the Animal God Techs which Kairi tried to control. They died. That’s his main source of power.
    S: ??? Start at the beginning. I’m getting confused. As far back as you can go.
    J: Gouki had the spirits ot the Jackal Animal God Techs, thus making him stronger. Kairi wanted this power (EX start of Kairi). He was in search of power and Gouki had taken what he had been looking for. When Kairi fought Gouki, he got his ass whooped. And at that time was Gouki’s minion who convinced Gouki to throw him off a cliff. Down Kairi goes to the bottom, losing his memory. All he could have remembered was Gouki’s moves (EX into EX2. But there was a problem, one of the Tech Gods entitled Shouki. Shouki was probably the most powerful, and this is how he killed Gouki. When Gouki died, Gouki the spirit, possessed Kairi WITH ALL OF THE TECH GODS. All this is how Kairi is soooo powerfual and always screams (too much power for him to control). (EX2) Kairi can control his powers, but they are starting to take him over completly. In EX2 he has some sort of control in EX2+ He can barely control it. And in EX3 he’s totally unded it, he can only gain self contol after Hatsudo.
    S: Who was Gouki’s minion?
    J: Adon.
    S: Adon from SF Zero?
    J: Yep.
    S: HOLY S    **!!!
    J: I have no idea why he was not included in the EX series. It was said that he was a victim to Kairi’s massacre.
    S: Ah, just like Rolento should of been in the EX games. Kairi killed Adon too?
    J: I’m not 100% sure. But one thing I know is that when Gouki died, Adon dissapeared.
    S: Ah, just like we are not 100% sure if Gouki killed Adon in the games (SFZ3). What’s Hatsudo?
    J: A Tech God
    S: Hatsudo helped Kairi gain control?
    J: The one that stuck with Kairi and manifested when Kairi killed Gouki.
    S: Okay. I’m going to type all of this stuff at SRK. Thanks a lot.
    J: Lol, well Kairi is my favorite character.

72

Wow, that’s some really interesting insights O.O

I loved the EX characters and stories (what could be gathered from them anyway) DAMN I wish they could become canon characters.

From what I remember, Darun is Pullums bodyguard (You can kinda see from his EX1 ending). Pullum and Blair are meant to be friends. I always throught Sharon was Blair’s sister but spose cousin works just as well lol.

Wasn’t Allen supposed to have been beaten in the opening rounds of the US tournament though? Don’t remember seeing anything about him winning it.

Btw, I’m suprised I’ve never seen anyone else mention this before, but C.Jack’s EX2 look seems to be heavily influenced by Michael Jackson’s Moonwalker look. In some of the official artworks he even has a kinda MJesque pose.

73

Kairi needs to make a cameo shot in one of the pages udoneko, =P. I mean, just for me. :tup:

Have Lee draw him in a panel, looking on, or something.

74

I love Akuma being put in the role of somesort of Sith lord with Adon as his apprentice. This is all so interesting. EX produced IMO some of the best characters and stories in the SF universe. KAIRI FOREVER!

75

Soubnds good to me. Now to find someone to translate the EX-EX2+ endings lol

76

Totally agree! EX had some great characters, some of the best in a SF game for a long time.

77

word, homie. co-sign

78

Me and Jed-Chrizt had a quicky conversation about Hayate. Not much new but I share anyway -

S: Hayate, can you tell me anything about him like what he has to do with Kairi and Hokuto if anything?
J: Hayate.
J: Ah yes, the dragon sword failed character
J: Hayate actually has no relation to any of them.
J: What was his purpose dealt with the legendary Dragon Sword
J: He “intertwined” with Nanase’s search for Kairi
J: Crossed paths
J: They didn’t get to finish it: He’d keep an eye out on Nanase from there on.
J: Know why he was dropped?
S: Okay. I thought there was no blood connection. People always say there is but I haven’t found any proof of that.
J: He was dropped when they realized that a character with a dragon blade was already taken.
S: I always thought he was dropped because of the Orochi deal. KOF already had the Orochi Legend locked down.
J: AHH That too. And besides he wasn’t properly licensed.
J: I think he was a great character
J: *sniff
J: Don’t you agree?
S: Yeah.

Next time I’ll ask more about Nanase and Hayate’s meeting.

79

Quick question…

Street Fighter EX4, ever possible?

Also, I heard that SFEX4 was denied by Arika from Capcom’s asking to bring back the SFEX series back to life or something…x_x? Sano? lol…

80

Here’s my idea of what it would be like. Nasane, Hokuto, Hayate, and Kairi are fighters working in service to the Bushinryu Clan. However, Akuma wants to see who will be his apprentice- Ryu or Kairi, seeing how Kairi knows Ansatsuken and he is more likely to become evil. Doctrine Dark would also be working for Bison and Garuda would be one of Bison’s minions. Chun Li, Guile, and Cammy would all be fighting the evil of Shadowlaw, while Hayate, Hokuto, and Nasane are looking for Kairi.

Sagat would work for Bison at this time, and Sakura would be learning fighting from Ryu. The whole game takes place during the Alpha storyline.

81

That link leads to porn, genius.

82

That link used to… not lead to porn… next time I talk to Jed-Chritz I’ll ask him for a new address since he translated the endings anyway.

RyuKuma - Hayate is not part of or related to the Bushinryu clan, that’s Guy from Final Fight and SFZ. Hokuto, Kairi and Nanase are part of the Mitzukami clan, Hayate is not affiliated with that clan either. Gouki(Akuma) is dead in SF EX too.

Chrno - SF EX4, I dunno. Last I heard neither Capcom or Arika was interested in making another one. But that in itself is a rumor. But SF games don’t ever get up to number 4 anyway. :rofl:

83

Could Capcom ever reference the events that happened in SFEX in their own games? I am thinking that what happened to Doctrine Dark would be a good setting for a showdown between Guile and Rolento.

Also, Ken could mention something about defeating Allen; maybe not by name but certainly in some way.

I also read that Hokuto used Bushin-Ryuu but that was probably a mistranslation or a retcon to clueless western gamers who still believe shotokan is the true style of Ryu, Ken and Akuma.

84

I honestly have no idea where this Bushinryu stuff started. You can’t have a Bushinryu ‘clan.’ There is one Master at a time. At best there is Master/Pupil at any given time, so to speak. Maki’s father was Master, Zeku was the Pupil. Then Zeku is the Master and Guy is the Pupil. Now Guy is the Master and Maki is a… Pupil without a Master who trained under an old Master that shouldn’t of been teaching her anyway? Arguably it’s a lot less confusing if you take FF2 out of the mix but there is no room for Kairi, Hokuto, and Nanase in here. At all.

Yeah, anyone can make oblique references like Chun-Li saying “I’m not a reporter!” in SF3 as a reference to the live action movie. But most of these oblique references come from Capcom USA… I think it would be… sort of difficult for them to reference any of it with SF EX killing Gouki and I doubt Capcom will… kill the guy… and Doctrine Dark makes things even more complex because it marks the only time Rolento turned against the USA Military and he never did in the canon. In short, they could reference SF EX lightly while leaving exact names out and stuff, it’s the equivalent of them sticking Lynn Kurosawa in a few Capcom backgrounds or them using the same Shin Gouki from CVS2 in CFJ (even the same news lady in his ending) without mentioning he’s possessed by Orochi (though I think he is… both CVS2 endings end with Gouki possessed by Orochi or having been influenced by ‘TEH EVIIL POOWERZ DET BEEZ!’ AKA more or less the same thing and he has the same CVS2 kanji on his back too…) but even the merest references will -

A) Mean nothing to fans who don’t care about Fighting Game Storylines.

B) Mean even less to those who don’t care about SF EX.

C) Just confuse the crap out of those who care about the storyline (IE me and the rest of the SF Plot Guiders…)

Heh, Capcom now says that each game is an island and there is no continuity anyways, at least that’s what they told Studio Udon, but there is still evidence that there is ‘canon’ or at least there was at one time… even CFJ character to character quotes still give out snippets of storyline(though the game itself isn’t canon but versus games always reference canon)… um, I think it’s a case of some of us fans knowing SF’s storyline better than current Capcom does… course all of the main SF people like Nishitani, Okamoto and Funamizu are gone from Capcom anyways… but with this ‘way of thinking’ chances are SF4 won’t reference, anything, it won’t have to because the game will be an island on to itself… I mean I at least expect the characters to be older and acknowledge ‘basic stuf’ like Ryu and Ken training together for pete’s sake but they won’t have to reference anything that happened in SF3 like say the end of the world prophecy… course quotes again in versus games like CVS2 and CFJ may prove that wrong since they usually reference canon events(but those are rarely translated)… and if Capcom USA makes SF4 there… might not be any quotes in the USA version but they might be there for the Japanese version since they are used to it by now and which version will be correct??? Um, yeah, with each game being an island, it doesn’t matter… BLARG!!! I DUNNO SO I JUST WENT OFF ON A TANGENT!!! :rofl:

To my knowledge, none of the character to character quotes from the versus games that went untranslated by Capcom ever refer to SF EX. Even in Rolento’s CVS2 ending he’s trying to team up with Heidern, Ralf, Clark, and Leona. So he’s not really against USA at all like he was in SF EX.

Oh yeah, Jerry of Sota was asked if they could make Sota Action figures of the SF EX characters. The SF EX characters were included in Sota’s favorite character Poll too(put together by board members of Sota.com of course). Jerry said they couldn’t because Arika owned the rights to the SF EX characters. So Arika still mantains the rights for SF EX characters. I suppose Capcom using them or referencing them would be as hairy as them using Strider who’s rights are pretty darn convuluted, IE Arika would have to approve their use and be credited with copyright info almost at the intro screen of SF4(making people think Arika made SF4 causing people to run for their lives? :rofl: Joke, joke. I love SFEX2 myself)… it’s a lot to go through because of legal jargon I think… course I don’t work for Capcom so it’s just my guestimate on all that… the moral of this post is that McDonald’s coffee is super strong and one cup will have you rambling needlessly to no end. :sweat:

85

Spoke to Jed. He says that Hayate and Nanase met but didn’t fight, “crossed paths” like he said before. He’s looking to see if he can find a usable link to the SF EX2 endings.

86

Who is to say that Rolento never turned against the U.S. military? Just because it wasn’t mentioned in official canon, doesn’t mean it never happened. If SFEX never existed, Rolento wouldn’t have turned against the U.S. military but because SFEX says he did, then he did. The trick is to work it into the story and keep it making sense and coherent.

Anyway, as far as legal stuff goes - how is this for a Guile vs. Rolento battle? We know who they are talking about and what event they are referencing to without Doctrine Dark being mentioned by name.

Guile: “You! You wiped out my unit! I finally caught up with you!”

Rolento: “From what I heard, there was only one other survivor. Didn’t he go a little crazy?”

Guile: “Damn right. I had to beat some sense into him - but I won’t let you think you got away easily!”

Rolento: “My unit beat your unit last time! Even in a one-on-one battle, the results will still be the same!”

87

so explain the bushinryuu fighters to me more.

you say they can’t have a clan so whats the hierachy?

Where exactly were Maki and Guy when Maki’s father was the Master and Zeku was the pupil?

88

I guess that would work out okay! :tup:

Heh, in comic books after the Avengers/JLA crossover DC actually tried to continue the crossover, get this, without Marvel! The idea got scrapped early on though. I wonder what they’d be saying, “Hey Batman, remember when you fought that guy with a shield?” “Oh yeah, C… OH NO THE JOKER IS ATTACKING!” :rofl:

89

By “clan” I kind of mean more than one, sort of like the Mitzukami Clan (Kairi, Hokuto, Nanase) or Ibuki’s clan. Their can only be one master of Bushinryu at any given time.

I have no idea when Maki’s father trained Zeku but it could of quite possible happened before either Guy or Maki were born.

Back during Final Fight 2, none of this “succesor” stuff mattered. Maki’s father was Guy’s master. Maki had recieved some training from him too(at this point in time you can argue it was more of a clan.)

SFZ2 changed all of that. In SFZ2 it was stated that their could only be one master at a time and it was retconned making Zeku Guy’s master. Capcom apparently forgot about Maki’s father and said Maki’s father was now officially Zeku’s master. Guy defeats Zeku and Guy is the one who inherits the style.

Wiether or not Guy killed Zeku is another argument all together. There is however zero evidence if Zeku survived, and the wording made it seem like it was a death match. How/why Zeku did not kill Maki’s father (if it was indeed a death match) seems like it’s the current loophole/unexplained event.

Maki apparently will be the next to inherit the style. In CVS2 (unofficial game) Guy is missing. In SFZ3 on the Gameboy she is looking for Guy(but is she really supposed to be there or is that an Easter Egg… and, wouldn’t she of found Guy since he apparently goes back to Metro City for Final Fight 3?) Anyway, looks they are supposed to have a match at some point and/or a death match but they prolly won’t show it ever.

So basically right now Bushinryu is -

Genryusai, Maki’s father - Defeated. No longer practices the art. There’s the off chance he died of old age sometime after FF2, no official statement. Guy is dating his other daughter Rena.
Zeku - Defeated and/or dead. Either way, no longer practices the art.
Guy - The Bushinryu master
Maki - A pupil of her father, perhaps looking for Guy to train her and/or a match?

So the style is really now Master/Pupil even though the Master hasn’t actually trained the pupil as far as we know.

Probably the best comparison is Fist of the North Star. Their can only be one inheritor of the Fist of the North Star (Hokuto No Ken) at any given time. All other disciples that are not chosen to be the inheritor are either -

A. Killed by the Master and/or Inheritor - Raoh, Jagi
B. Must willingly give up the style - Toki who used the style to heal the sick
C. Have their fists crush so they can no longer use the style
D. Have their ‘memory’ pressure points pressed so that they forget that they learned the style in the first place.

BTW, Sho of Captain Commando is also a Bushinryu master apparently was a student of Guy. So that would make Sho the successor. But Captain Commando was made before SFZ2 and before Capcom altered what Bushinryu was, so who knows if Captain Commando really exists in the SF Canon. In Namco x Capcom both Guy and Sho are working together, but in Namco x Capcom the World’s have “merged” and that’s the game’s plot. Guy is from our current world, the “Physical World.” Sho is from the “Far Future World.” Due to the worlds merging in NXC that’s how they are able to come together. The other worlds in the game are “The Makai,” (AKA the Underworld) “The Fantasy World,” “The Spirit World” and the “God World.”