What are some rush down characters in SFV?

[Tebbo]

Yeah he’s not one dimensional or anything he has options.

I just don’t see his pressure being anything near someone like Necalli. His ability to confirm is tied closely to back strong or mk. In both cases you are losing all momentum if they block. That’s not good for a character with no 3 frame normal and the only normal with some + being standing blockable and 5 frames, which again only links to something confirmable if you’re at throw range it seems.

His dash is great and I think that fits with being able to take advantage of whiffs and things to approach where slower characters really cant. Ken can do something like dash and lk tatsu or lp shoryu. These aren’t things you do if someone is just blocking.

I think a lot of this is also how you think of ‘rushdown’ since it’s not a perfectly defined term. In my mind a good rushdown character is one where even if the opponent is blocking and prepared, they are not going to find room to do much. A constant stream of attacks keeps them hemmed in and the defender is often in frametrap situations, unable to do more than take a gamble on some kind of reversal style special.

I’m not talking about how good he is either. It just seems clear he isn’t for ‘rushdown’. He’s definitely an aggressive style character. But not in the way Necalli is. Who, to me, IS rushdown in 5.

Regardless, I appreciate the discussion and I guess we will see how he develops as the whole game develops.

[Muttonman]

Yeah he’s not one dimensional or anything he has options.

I just don’t see his pressure being anything near someone like Necalli. His ability to confirm is tied closely to back strong or mk. In both cases you are losing all momentum if they block. That’s not good for a character with no 3 frame normal and the only normal with some + being standing blockable and 5 frames, which again only links to something confirmable if you’re at throw range it seems.

His dash is great and I think that fits with being able to take advantage of whiffs and things to approach where slower characters really cant. Ken can do something like dash and lk tatsu or lp shoryu. These aren’t things you do if someone is just blocking.

I think a lot of this is also how you think of ‘rushdown’ since it’s not a perfectly defined term. In my mind a good rushdown character is one where even if the opponent is blocking and prepared, they are not going to find room to do much. A constant stream of attacks keeps them hemmed in and the defender is often in frametrap situations, unable to do more than take a gamble on some kind of reversal style special.

I’m not talking about how good he is either. It just seems clear he isn’t for ‘rushdown’. He’s definitely an aggressive style character. But not in the way Necalli is. Who, to me, IS rushdown in 5.

Regardless, I appreciate the discussion and I guess we will see how he develops as the whole game develops.

Try using his TC1 xx EX Hadoken more. It’s probably the best looping pressure in the game.

Necalli gets a giant toolbox to use for his rushdown; you don’t want him pressuring you because he can do a strike/throw/command throw/overhead mixup and push you to the corner.

Ken’s the mistake forcing rushdown character. He has the tools needed to stay in your face and to prevent you from getting in his. He ability to open people up is more limited due to a lack of command throw or great confirms outside of point blank but he’s good at staying in and has actual oki. He stays in doing safe stuff until you guess wrong then does it again

Nash is more of a setup based rushdown thanks to his fireball. He’s got the easiest time getting in but the hardest time opening people up due to his buttons being slower. I don’t know how good his EX Sonic Boom continued pressure is but Moonsault pressure is pretty fake and we’re already seeing people anti-air it every time.

[TINYANGRYCRAB]

Apparently Ryu is played as kind of rushdown at high levels? Lots of dashing and getting up in people’s ass etc

[Tebbo]

Yeah he’s not one dimensional or anything he has options.

I just don’t see his pressure being anything near someone like Necalli. His ability to confirm is tied closely to back strong or mk. In both cases you are losing all momentum if they block. That’s not good for a character with no 3 frame normal and the only normal with some + being standing blockable and 5 frames, which again only links to something confirmable if you’re at throw range it seems.

His dash is great and I think that fits with being able to take advantage of whiffs and things to approach where slower characters really cant. Ken can do something like dash and lk tatsu or lp shoryu. These aren’t things you do if someone is just blocking.

I think a lot of this is also how you think of ‘rushdown’ since it’s not a perfectly defined term. In my mind a good rushdown character is one where even if the opponent is blocking and prepared, they are not going to find room to do much. A constant stream of attacks keeps them hemmed in and the defender is often in frametrap situations, unable to do more than take a gamble on some kind of reversal style special.

I’m not talking about how good he is either. It just seems clear he isn’t for ‘rushdown’. He’s definitely an aggressive style character. But not in the way Necalli is. Who, to me, IS rushdown in 5.

Regardless, I appreciate the discussion and I guess we will see how he develops as the whole game develops.

Try using his TC1 xx EX Hadoken more. It’s probably the best looping pressure in the game.

Necalli gets a giant toolbox to use for his rushdown; you don’t want him pressuring you because he can do a strike/throw/command throw/overhead mixup and push you to the corner.

Ken’s the mistake forcing rushdown character. He has the tools needed to stay in your face and to prevent you from getting in his. He ability to open people up is more limited due to a lack of command throw or great confirms outside of point blank but he’s good at staying in and has actual oki. He stays in doing safe stuff until you guess wrong then does it again

Nash is more of a setup based rushdown thanks to his fireball. He’s got the easiest time getting in but the hardest time opening people up due to his buttons being slower. I don’t know how good his EX Sonic Boom continued pressure is but Moonsault pressure is pretty fake and we’re already seeing people anti-air it every time.

Maybe. I’m just not feeling him that way.

That’s my personal take but I don’t see anything overly rushdown about him except having a fast dash and a command run. Everything else doesn’t work well to pressure someone. I’ve had more success using those tools to position where I want and convert crush counters. Ken just doesn’t have the normals to keep up the pace without taking risks or completely stopping the pressure (ending at -2 with no 3 frame normals seems to be a bad situation). Like crab said, Ryu has some rushdown. His normals work well to keep him at some kind of advantage and keep going and allow him to pressure safely and also convert on hit easily. Ken has the conversion part but he has to stop every time it’s blocked (kicks or punches).

But I think Ken maybe has some flexibility. He has those elements he can mix in that keep people on their toes.

I feel like Karin, Cammy and Rashid can work well in a rushdown sense also.

[Muttonman]

Yeah he’s not one dimensional or anything he has options.

I just don’t see his pressure being anything near someone like Necalli. His ability to confirm is tied closely to back strong or mk. In both cases you are losing all momentum if they block. That’s not good for a character with no 3 frame normal and the only normal with some + being standing blockable and 5 frames, which again only links to something confirmable if you’re at throw range it seems.

His dash is great and I think that fits with being able to take advantage of whiffs and things to approach where slower characters really cant. Ken can do something like dash and lk tatsu or lp shoryu. These aren’t things you do if someone is just blocking.

I think a lot of this is also how you think of ‘rushdown’ since it’s not a perfectly defined term. In my mind a good rushdown character is one where even if the opponent is blocking and prepared, they are not going to find room to do much. A constant stream of attacks keeps them hemmed in and the defender is often in frametrap situations, unable to do more than take a gamble on some kind of reversal style special.

I’m not talking about how good he is either. It just seems clear he isn’t for ‘rushdown’. He’s definitely an aggressive style character. But not in the way Necalli is. Who, to me, IS rushdown in 5.

Regardless, I appreciate the discussion and I guess we will see how he develops as the whole game develops.

Try using his TC1 xx EX Hadoken more. It’s probably the best looping pressure in the game.

Necalli gets a giant toolbox to use for his rushdown; you don’t want him pressuring you because he can do a strike/throw/command throw/overhead mixup and push you to the corner.

Ken’s the mistake forcing rushdown character. He has the tools needed to stay in your face and to prevent you from getting in his. He ability to open people up is more limited due to a lack of command throw or great confirms outside of point blank but he’s good at staying in and has actual oki. He stays in doing safe stuff until you guess wrong then does it again

Nash is more of a setup based rushdown thanks to his fireball. He’s got the easiest time getting in but the hardest time opening people up due to his buttons being slower. I don’t know how good his EX Sonic Boom continued pressure is but Moonsault pressure is pretty fake and we’re already seeing people anti-air it every time.

Maybe. I’m just not feeling him that way.

That’s my personal take but I don’t see anything overly rushdown about him except having a fast dash and a command run. Everything else doesn’t work well to pressure someone. I’ve had more success using those tools to position where I want and convert crush counters. Ken just doesn’t have the normals to keep up the pace without taking risks or completely stopping the pressure (ending at -2 with no 3 frame normals seems to be a bad situation). Like crab said, Ryu has some rushdown. His normals work well to keep him at some kind of advantage and keep going and allow him to pressure safely and also convert on hit easily. Ken has the conversion part but he has to stop every time it’s blocked (kicks or punches).

But I think Ken maybe has some flexibility. He has those elements he can mix in that keep people on their toes.

I feel like Karin, Cammy and Rashid can work well in a rushdown sense also.

I don’t find Karin to rushdown that well because her throws completely end her pressure. She’s got great buttons but you just don’t have that much of a threat in close. Similar issue with Cammy in that once you’re more than a jab away she can’t really force the throw mixup. Ken and Nash both have looping pressure strings for 1 bar and can get pressure going after a throw. Ken very much has the issue of a huge deadzone (so I’d say he has the + on block going for him but not the conversion), but I don’t think playing him at st.hk range is going to be very effective as a lot of character shellac him at that range.

Personally I was really hoping they’d make his cr.mp +7 on block or his sweep 6f so you had a conversion on CH when you’re outside of point blank but that’s life.

[Cipher]

I feel like Karin, Cammy and Rashid can work well in a rushdown sense also.

Cammy is oldschool Rushdown tbh.
Similar to CVS2,pressure and footsies with good Normals and throw/frametrap Mixups.
She relies a lot on a good neutralgame, but she also teaches a good one,since all her tools need the right timing and/or use.

Karin relies more on Mixups, less range and worse defence than Cammy and also lower damage.

Rashid relies more on pressure and his mobility, he relies the least on footsies and has also the lowest damage. Mixups and confusing with mobility is his business.