-- Weightlifting & Nutrition Thread -- v9.0 Optimized

[erco]

I’m not really sold on dynamic exercises for beginning lifters. They just don’t have the strength to move a meaningful weight with any sort of speed.

One thing I really like about the Westside for Skinny Bastards template is that it has a huge amount of emphasis on upper back thickness and lat development. Beginning lifters just don’t have lats or any sort of traps or rhomboids. Doing reps of face pulls, chins, lat pulldowns, rows, dumbbell flies, etc. twice a week are things absent in a lot of programs and are definitely necessary for the underweight guys to give them a more stable platform for benching, squatting and deadlifting.

I think if you took out all the board pressing and the chains and band exercises, you’re still looking at a great template. I think it’s silly that he has those things in there, since really skinny bastards aren’t really gonna have access to or be able to use 120 lbs of chains around an oly bar. Floor presses are a good substitute for board presses though.

[HeaT]

Started lifting in April of '06. Goals up to this current point and time have been for gaining size since I was around 135 lbs. when I started lifting.

Never tried doing 1 rep max on deadlifts and squats, but each weight for when I do 5 sets of 5 reps is 170 and 165 respectively. Over the summer I was 165 lbs. and did 190 with DLs 5x5. Bench I assume is around 170 or 175.

Right now, I want to focus more on having strong muscles, particularly my whole body (chest, back, arms, legs). It would be mainly for the gym, but functional strength would be something I’d want to.

about your strength question and building strength…mens health currently had a good article abour periodization for a 12 week program for overall body strength, supposedly it was recommended by a trainer who trains athletes…it went like this…

Weeks 1 - 3
3x10 (3 sets 10 reps) for exercise, say bench and say you are doing 100lbs
thats 3000lbs total volume

weeks 4-6
4x5 with 125lbs for bench
thats 2,500lbs of total volume

weeks 7-9
3x8 with 110lbs
thats 2640 lbs of total volume

weeks 10-12
5x4 with 135lbs
thats 2700 lbs of total volume

i think this is a great priodized plan…i will start it in about a month to throw a new twist on my routine…but you would do this with whatever exercise you have in your routine…hope this helps…

im outi

Roberth

[ssjbrydon]

Hey, I got a question.

I run quiet often, about every other day, but lately as I’ve been running I’ve been ganing some strange back pains.
Could this be an issue from what I’m running on, or am I just working myself too hard? If anything, could it be 'cause to my new bed?

Perty much my question would be, why am I suffering from random back pains when running?

stretch your hamstrings!!!

i had the same problem a while back. really troublesome lower backpains while on the treadmill. i just started stretching my hamstrings out real well before i jog/run and now i have 0 pain anymore. stretching is overlooked a lot imo, i now stretch for like 10 minutes before i even hit the gym.

actually someone on this thread gave me that advice.

[masher]

any1 know of a good portable Ellipticals?

or a site that reviews Elliptical?

[Soldier_Zero]

You, my friend, are a skinny bastard.

However, there’s hope in the form of the Westside Method. A lot of the Westside stuff is definitely better suited to more advanced lifters (band resisted dynamic box squats…), but Joe DeFranco has adapted the method very well for beginner/intermediate guys.

Check this out. It’s definitely the next step you should take after using a 5x5 training scheme.

Thanks for the link. Since it’s lengthy, I’ll have to read it tomorrow.

snip

Thanks man, appreciate the post. Now I have 2 questions about this. Each week consists of 2 days. I go to the gym Mon, Wed, and Fri. So would in week 1, I should do day 1 on Mon and Fri? And then after week 2, should I make day 2 my Mon and Fri?

Chin ups. What kind of grip and width on the bar is best? Underhand and hands shoulder-width?

*EDIT: Max incline DB bench and max dumbbell shoulder press, are those both 4 sets?

snip

Ugh, my subscription ran out last money. Thanks, I might just go to the store and take a pic with my phone of the programs they put in each issue, lol.

[Random_Hero_360]

If I workout at home just doing stuff like sit ups and push ups, can I just do them? Or would I need to do some cardio to get my heart rate up for the push ups and such to be effective?

[Team_Cable]

What’s up, guys, I’ve been reading this thread all during winter break. I’m getting back into shape and I had some questions for all you knowledgeable folks. Please bear with me, this might be a long post.

First off, I’m a big dude, (6 foot 3, between 330-340 pounds). I don’t look that fat, but you see my gut and all the fat is trapped there. I got some man boobs as well, but they’re kinda defined, as is the rest of my body from working out for years. I can even flex my pecs like you see all those weightlifters do.

Okay, enough bullshitting, on to my questions. My diet is terrible and that’s something I’m definitely working on. I’ve read about protein shakes and shit after workouts. Should someone my size be drinking these?

Now two questions about working out: the first is what do you guys do to get strong forearms? I use those wrist squeezers a lot. Will doing that give me a strong grip? I’m not looking to get diesel, just stronger forearms.

Second question is has anyone used jump soles? Are they worth it? I’ve always wanted to dunk, but my plyometric workouts have never been the best.

Finally any tips on my workout? I usually lift four or five times a week and I go for total body workouts. I try to switch up between machine and free weights as much as I can. For cardio I do lots of DDR (despite my size I can do the most difficult songs except for the 10-footers), cardio kickboxing, punching bag work and jump roping. I also spend some time in the sauna to sweat as much excess water out.

So far I’ve been doing well in the week and a half since I started. An old shirt of mine fit well after just a week. I fit in that shirt after about five months of intense DDR training last year. My goal is to get to about 275 and look like the Rock, you know a big, strong dude, but not overly muscular.

Sorry for the long post. Thanks for any feedback and/or criticism.

[Soldier_Zero]

Now two questions about working out: the first is what do you guys do to get strong forearms? I use those wrist squeezers a lot. Will doing that give me a strong grip? I’m not looking to get diesel, just stronger forearms.

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=4016203&postcount=3713

[PozerWolf]

stretch your hamstrings!!!

i had the same problem a while back. really troublesome lower backpains while on the treadmill. i just started stretching my hamstrings out real well before i jog/run and now i have 0 pain anymore. stretching is overlooked a lot imo, i now stretch for like 10 minutes before i even hit the gym.

actually someone on this thread gave me that advice.

Oh shit, yeah I completely forget.
Didn’t think it would make that big of a differences, thanks for the tip :wgrin:

[Truong]

Thanks man, appreciate the post. Now I have 2 questions about this. Each week consists of 2 days. I go to the gym Mon, Wed, and Fri. So would in week 1, I should do day 1 on Mon and Fri? And then after week 2, should I make day 2 my Mon and Fri?

Chin ups. What kind of grip and width on the bar is best? Underhand and hands shoulder-width?

*EDIT: Max incline DB bench and max dumbbell shoulder press, are those both 4 sets?

Eh, I don’t quite get your first question, lol. Like, for me, Day 1 would be Monday and day 2 would be Thursday, since I take two days rests in between work outs. So my next day 1 would be on Sunday, and next day 2 would be on Wednesday. With this schedule, and my recovery time, it’s never a set day for day 1 and 2. Again, I stress, that your ability to recover is hugely important. You can very well do this program Mon/Wed/Fri/Sun if you’re one of those freaks who can recover with only 1 day of rest. On the other hand, some people take as much as 3 days in between workouts. Again, it’s hugely dependent on your training intensity and how well you eat/sleep/recover. It’ll be up to you to find out.

For chin ups, whatever you feel most comfortable with and can crank out the most reps. But as a rule, the closer the grip, the easier it is. I always just use a very slightly inside shoulder width grip. I don’t think it makes sense to do chin ups with anything wider than shoulder width. If you’re doing wide grip chin ups, might as well do pull ups. Chin ups bring the biceps more into play, while pull ups uses less, and stresses the back/lats more.

Max incline bench and shoulder, yeah, about 4 sets. 3 sets of warm up with light weights, then about 3-4 work up sets to my max. For example, last dumbbell press for me was:

35lb x 3 sets, 10 reps
70lb x 2 sets, 7 reps, 5 reps
75lb x 1 set, 4 reps
80lb x 1 set, 3 reps

Play around with the sets on max, find out what it takes for your body to warm up and prime for the max.

[Team_Cable]

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=4016203&postcount=3713

Good shit. I have dumbbells at home. I never thought about simply walking around with them.

Anyone else with some input about my previous post?

[BEEFCAKE]

up your protein intake from 1.5 - 2 grams per lb of bodyweight, don’t just get your protein from shakes/bars either nothing replaces a solid/nutritional diet.

ps:skinny folk, want to gain muscle/size? eat, and I mean eat good calories not empty ones.

[HeaT]

up your protein intake from 1.5 - 2 grams per lb of bodyweight, don’t just get your protein from shakes/bars either nothing replaces a solid/nutritional diet.

ps:skinny folk, want to gain muscle/size? eat, and I mean eat good calories not empty ones.

personally i wouldnt up your protein intake that much…do 1 g / lb of bodyweight…should be sufficient for what you are trying to achieve…

but in all honesty i would more concentrate on losing weight first…with a solid diet…5-6 meals a day, high protein, low calorie…

im outi

Roberth

[erco]

Dumbbell/Barbell Timed Holds
Hand Grippers (Captains of Crush)
Plate Pinches
Wrist Rollers

If you don’t have Farmer’s Walk implements, the above work really well. Fat/Thick Bar deadlifts are good too, but I doubt you’ll have access to that either.

[Soldier_Zero]

Eh, I don’t quite get your first question, lol. Like, for me, Day 1 would be Monday and day 2 would be Thursday, since I take two days rests in between work outs. So my next day 1 would be on Sunday, and next day 2 would be on Wednesday. With this schedule, and my recovery time, it’s never a set day for day 1 and 2. Again, I stress, that your ability to recover is hugely important. You can very well do this program Mon/Wed/Fri/Sun if you’re one of those freaks who can recover with only 1 day of rest. On the other hand, some people take as much as 3 days in between workouts. Again, it’s hugely dependent on your training intensity and how well you eat/sleep/recover. It’ll be up to you to find out.

For chin ups, whatever you feel most comfortable with and can crank out the most reps. But as a rule, the closer the grip, the easier it is. I always just use a very slightly inside shoulder width grip. I don’t think it makes sense to do chin ups with anything wider than shoulder width. If you’re doing wide grip chin ups, might as well do pull ups. Chin ups bring the biceps more into play, while pull ups uses less, and stresses the back/lats more.

Max incline bench and shoulder, yeah, about 4 sets. 3 sets of warm up with light weights, then about 3-4 work up sets to my max. For example, last dumbbell press for me was:

35lb x 3 sets, 10 reps
70lb x 2 sets, 7 reps, 5 reps
75lb x 1 set, 4 reps
80lb x 1 set, 3 reps

Play around with the sets on max, find out what it takes for your body to warm up and prime for the max.

Cool, question was answered even if you didn’t understand it, lol. I get it all for the most part. I assume the angle on incline bench shouldn’t be too much, correct?

Also, I know cleans are very important for building strength, but I’ve never tried them. I’m sure I can get the form down before starting the program, but are there certain exercises I should utilize more to make my form solid on doing cleans?

[System_1]

Hey what do you all eat for dinner? I go to the supermarket and I can never decide on what to buy…

[HeaT]

I assume the angle on incline bench shouldn’t be too much, correct?

i like my angle to be 45 degrees to the floor…if you only incline it slightly, i feel that its too much of a modified sholder press exercise…but that is just IMO of course…

im outi

Roberth

[Truong]

Cool, question was answered even if you didn’t understand it, lol. I get it all for the most part. I assume the angle on incline bench shouldn’t be too much, correct?

Also, I know cleans are very important for building strength, but I’ve never tried them. I’m sure I can get the form down before starting the program, but are there certain exercises I should utilize more to make my form solid on doing cleans?

I always just use the default incline angle on whatever bench I’m using. Basically, the first angle you can modify the bench to. Anything higher and I feel it works my shoulders more.

Cleans are power exercise, not strenght, though you’ll certainly build strength with it. It takes a long time to get proper clean form if you’re doing it the self taught way, which is what I did. High pulls and shrugs will definitely get you started. It’s basically a clean without actually racking the bar on your shoulder. My advice, honestly, is unless you’re seriously dedicated to learning the form properly, don’t do cleans. Done incorrectly, you’ll get almost nothing out of it, and probably injure yourself somehwere along the way.

But as a general rule to doing cleans, arms stiff, never bend til the last moment when you rack it on your shoulders, back always flat and arched, glutes/hips flexed as tight as possible, shoulders over the bar, shins slightly brushing the bar, shoulders higher than the hips, hips higher than knees. Always visualize yourself lifting the bar off the ground with your legs and hips, NOT your back. This is not a lower back exercise, but a leg/hip explosive movement. Your back is not the moving muscle, it’s the stabilizer. And finally, you must realise that there are TWO movements in a clean: the first pull and the 2nd pull, which is where all the power comes from. Never do cleans thinking it’s a 1 movement exercise. Never forget this. That’s all the tips I can give without actually seeing you do it to correct it.

[media=youtube]-B00MTx4hMY[/media] watch this clip and notice that once the bar passes his knees (the first pull), he thrusts his hips forward and sorts of jump back/shrugs the weight. That’s the 2nd pull, and the most important thing to know and incorporate into your clean. Also notice the arms are stiff throughout the first and second pull. Finally, do not attempt to do heavy cleans til your form is proper. Use lightweights til you get the form down.

[Ryad]

Where can I find a comprehensive full out west side regimen?
Showing the various options of exercise per muscle group, set rep schemes etc…
I think its time for some dynamic workouts…

All in!

[System_1]

That whole switching up your exercises is a load of bodybuilding crap. Look at Olympic lifters. They literally crank out hundreds of the same reps/exercise a week, and they’re quite possibly the strongest and most powerful of all athletes. Or powerlifters like guys from the West Side Barbells. Those guys live on Box Squats and Good Mornings year in year out.

You really won’t find all that in strength training. Strength training is less about “switching it up” with exercises and more about switching it up with your rep schemes, your set scheme, your % scheme, or in short, periodization and letting your body get sufficient rest so you can do all that shit over again.

Blah, I’m ranting and I can go on for days about this stuff. Anything else you need to know, just ask away.

I basically agree with you, but to be fair the guys at Westside do change their max effort exercises every couple of workouts.