"We finished practicing now?" Cody Match-up Thread

[HeavensCloud]

This might be a personal thing, but I struggle more against Yun than Rufus. Most Cody players have Rufus and Cammy (AE 2012) as his worst match-ups but Yun drives me nuts. Yun and Rufus both wreck Cody when they get in but Rufus is easier to keep out. He’s also easier to rush down when he has no meter and is more susceptible to frame traps.

Cammy is not one of Cody’s worst imo. She’s hella annoying when she finally lands a spiral arrow but she has to get past Cody’s buttons and rocks to do so.

The reason Yun is an overall easier match than Rufus, for Cody, is because of his dive kick (mainly). Yun has a height restriction on where he can dive kick from because of that he’s somewhat more “predictable” and easier to control.

Using normals preemptively, that hit at angles where Yun could dive kick, is useful for keeping him out. Normals such as:

• s.Hp
• s.Hk
• s.Lp

You can preemptively focus Yun’s dive kick and crumple the trip guard. A badly spaced dive kick can be punished with c.Lk.

Then there’s the ground game. Yun has no safe blockstring against Cody. You can punish all shoulders with c.Lk -> Mk Ruffian (at least).

You can safely chip Yun with well spaced LP CU blockstrings as well.

The worst thing about the Yun matchup is his command grab (which he does not deserve) but trying to get away from that is generally what allows Yun to get all the damage he does.

Rufus has no height restriction. He can dive kick at a height where you’re inclined to go from a stand throw. This alone makes it more difficult to deal with.

The relentless dive kicks, mixed with throws (which beat EX CU) makes it difficult to escape his pressure. And he has normals specifically designed to hit opponents trying to jump away (f.Hk, jf.Hk).

EX Zonk isn’t really an option during his pressure as the dive kick makes it whiff and he can punish.

Cody can more easily keep Rufus out but when he gets in, Rufus wrecks him.

(I didn’t even scratch the surface btw)

I meant Cammy in AE 2012 was his worst match-up. It’s still bad for him now but no longer his worst. In my opinion, Ibuki is now his worst match-up.

Yun has a height restriction but I don’t think it matters that much, he can still use it to cross up after a knock down and blow up your normals. st.HP and st. HK do work but they have to be used early since they’re slower and at specific ranges. A good Yun player won’t dive from those ranges. st. LP works but does no damage so it’s not exactly a deterrent. Admittedly, I haven’t tried focusing so I’ll give that a shot.

You can punish all shoulders but it is a frame perfect punish which can be tricky. If you miss it you’re in their face at frame disadvantage. Another thing I hate about the match-up is buffering lights into medium ruffian kick, if the Yun happens to lunge punch it will be an air reset and the ruffian kick will come out leaving Cody open to be punished.

St. HK can be used in the Rufus match-up and is way more effective. He has trouble approaching Cody, just like a grappler, when st. HK is on the screen. Yun on the other hand is much more slippery. When Cody has Rufus knocked down he can safely pressure Rufus when he has no meter, and with meter he only has to worry about ex. messiah kick, which is a good option but if baited can be fully hit with U1. Yun on the other hand you have to worry about his upkicks as well as a backdash, and the Kazunoko special - mashed 3 frame jabs.

Yun does bleed more than Rufus but Rufus has lower stun.

I dunno, I’m not seeing how Rufus is so much worse.

[Eternal]

PBS is necessary because once the rock leaves Cody’s hand you can input anything, meaning if she flip kicks after you’ve released the rock you can EX CU/U1 etc. It also means if Poison decides to go for a jump in during the fireball war, you’ll recover quickly enough to AA.

Okay, but isn’t what I said valid about her having a larger window to hit you during startup? Yes you recover quicker after the rock is released, but you’re vulnerable for longer before the rock is released. I mean if she reacts to the rock pickup animation with flip kick it’ll beat anything - rock, PBS or sometimes even fake rock. She can do it pre-emptively too given it’s safety on block - Cody can’t be in a position to react to it every single time. And doesn’t EX flip kick beat EX CU? It did against me the other night, although that might have been range/timing dependent.

Shouldn’t beat EX CU since EX CU is invincible to strikes first active frame. Only will beat it if you don’t hit first active frame, I think there might be like a perfect storm situation where she can hop over first frame and hit you before tornado comes out but it’s super spacing/timing specific. This is just a guess however.

• He can evenly play the fireball game (PBS is necessary)

I’m not sure I completely understand the benefit of PBS in this situation. Yes, it’s 1 frame faster overall than normal HP rocks (I went back to Eternal’s video to fact check this!), but if the startup is slower surely it’s even more susceptible to getting counterhit by her flip kick? If someone can explain this more clearly I’d appreciate it.

Thanks for all the other notes. Some stuff I was already aware of, but a few things to try next time I run into her. The one thing I would say is that, in my opinion, some of this stuff is a lot less practical online. Maybe it’s just my connection/setup, but I find it nigh on impossible to consistently punish stuff like Poison’s rekka/Decapre’s hands online. The SRK frame data says it’s -4, but can she space it to be better than that? I seem to always end up having to resort to raw EX ruffian as a read on blocked rekka > backdash to try and stop her abusing it.

PBS is necessary because once the rock leaves Cody’s hand you can input anything, meaning if she flip kicks after you’ve released the rock you can EX CU/U1 etc. It also means if Poison decides to go for a jump in during the fireball war, you’ll recover quickly enough to AA.

Connection obviously factors into 1/2 frame punishes online but she can never space it better than -4. You can always punish it.

You’re talking about flip kick being -4F at best right? Flip kick is still -1F if blocked. Extra frames of recovery only applied to on WHIFF. Go ahead, load up training mode, record Poison doing flip kick and blocking, try and punish with a 3F or 4F DP. Always blocked. Record it with her jumping after. SPD whiffs. Always -1F at worst, +2F always for EX at worst.

That certainly explains the match I saw of you at Bracket Reset where you got counterhit by flip kick (blocked) - crLP 3 times in a row. That was the only offline poison match I could find of you sadly, was hoping for a few more I checked through all of the bracket reset streams that were archived, they did say you’ve been tearing through local Poisons.

[Eternal]

double post

[Packz93]

You’re talking about flip kick being -4F at best right? Flip kick is still -1F if blocked. Extra frames of recovery only applied to on WHIFF. Go ahead, load up training mode, record Poison doing flip kick and blocking, try and punish with a 3F or 4F DP. Always blocked. Record it with her jumping after. SPD whiffs. Always -1F at worst, +2F always for EX at worst.

That certainly explains the match I saw of you at Bracket Reset where you got counterhit by flip kick (blocked) - crLP 3 times in a row. That was the only offline poison match I could find of you sadly, was hoping for a few more I checked through all of the bracket reset streams that were archived, they did say you’ve been tearing through local Poisons.

I was speaking about Rekkas. You can’t punish flip kick… So it definitely doesn’t explain that match lol… I already know it’s unpunishable.

And that was the first time Afii has beaten me in a match for like a good 2 months…

[Eternal]

Ok, you can see how I was confused though, right? Seeing as you didn’t mention rekkas anywhere in that entire reply. Flip kick was only move you mentioned in the post so I misunderstood that it was a reply to the 2nd part of the previous post. My bad though.

My own testing shows that there is a fairly small range where if you crouch blocked her LP Rekka your crLK wont punish. I tested with tool assistance to make sure it had no human element. It’s pretty small though, a smidge over half of one of the smallest training blocks and if you stand block at that range it whiffs entirely. For practical purposes it should pretty much always be punishable and no reason to ever expect it landing in that small area, pretty much would just be a fluke if they got it but it’s worth noting it IS possible to be safe so if you ever think you know you had it timed right but couldn’t get it, could be that.

Not disagreeing with anything you’ve said, just discussing it and I would love to actually see how you’ve approached it in more matches. How do you approach getting trapped in the corner? You were stuck there a while in the match I saw, like 3 or 4 reps of fireball strings IIRC. I feel personally like holding 2 zonks and alternating which one you release then charging the other just with timing it in case she goes for a non-true blockstring version might be a good option since the L3 Zonk would beat a throw attempt or another fireball.

[GroundedSF]

Shouldn’t beat EX CU since EX CU is invincible to strikes first active frame. Only will beat it if you don’t hit first active frame, I think there might be like a perfect storm situation where she can hop over first frame and hit you before tornado comes out but it’s super spacing/timing specific. This is just a guess however.

Played another Poison tonight and then tested this myself in training. Basically if you do the EX CU with the normal timing for beating an untrue string then the EX CU will lose. Presumably this is something to do with projectile invulnerability and maybe her elevated hurtbox making the initial hit of the CU (which doesn’t count as a projectile if I remember right) whiff. To beat or trade with the EX flip kick you have to delay the EX CU, which I found to be pretty difficult in a real online game. Everyone else’s mileage may vary of course!

[Eternal]

Shouldn’t beat EX CU since EX CU is invincible to strikes first active frame. Only will beat it if you don’t hit first active frame, I think there might be like a perfect storm situation where she can hop over first frame and hit you before tornado comes out but it’s super spacing/timing specific. This is just a guess however.

Played another Poison tonight and then tested this myself in training. Basically if you do the EX CU with the normal timing for beating an untrue string then the EX CU will lose. Presumably this is something to do with projectile invulnerability and maybe her elevated hurtbox making the initial hit of the CU (which doesn’t count as a projectile if I remember right) whiff. To beat or trade with the EX flip kick you have to delay the EX CU, which I found to be pretty difficult in a real online game. Everyone else’s mileage may vary of course!

Has to be the elevated hurtbox because of the fact first 2F active of EX CU are a strike not a projectile. I was referring more to doing it in neutral not from a block string though.

[GroundedSF]

Just played a high-rated Hakan on XBL… but seemingly he didn’t need to do anything except pick between SPD and diving SPD to absolutely wreck Cody. I was under the impression that if I read diving SPD I could mash crouch jab to prevent the uncrouchable setup, but apparently if he times it right even that doesn’t work. If Cody doesn’t have Zonk charged or U1 then he has no way to escape being grabbed by that move in that situation. Absolute insanity. Oftentimes it’s virtually impossible to charge for 2 seconds to get throw invincibility on regular Zonk (which sucks anyway because he can late jump over then regular SPD), and using the airborne frames of ruffian doesn’t work either. Help!

[Packz93]

Just played a high-rated Hakan on XBL… but seemingly he didn’t need to do anything except pick between SPD and diving SPD to absolutely wreck Cody. I was under the impression that if I read diving SPD I could mash crouch jab to prevent the uncrouchable setup, but apparently if he times it right even that doesn’t work. If Cody doesn’t have Zonk charged or U1 then he has no way to escape being grabbed by that move in that situation. Absolute insanity. Oftentimes it’s virtually impossible to charge for 2 seconds to get throw invincibility on regular Zonk (which sucks anyway because he can late jump over then regular SPD), and using the airborne frames of ruffian doesn’t work either. Help!

Backdash works for me. Meaty Oil Dive won’t catch backdash I believe (I haven’t tested this but I’m going off my experience in the match).

[Gobias_Employee]

Hi all,

Anybody have experience vs Elena? I have no idea what she does except for the long ass slide and her floaty jump is easy to anti-air. In the mid-range, I feel as if I am playing UMVC3.

Thanks

[Eternal]

Hi all,

Anybody have experience vs Elena? I have no idea what she does except for the long ass slide and her floaty jump is easy to anti-air. In the mid-range, I feel as if I am playing UMVC3.

Thanks

Don’t feel too bad, look up online matches of Cody v Elena and you’re mostly going to find Cody players losing. It’s tough. Get your punishes on point for sure, most of her stuff is punishable.

[Packz93]

Hi all,

Anybody have experience vs Elena? I have no idea what she does except for the long ass slide and her floaty jump is easy to anti-air. In the mid-range, I feel as if I am playing UMVC3.

Thanks

U2 is the one to use in this matchup.

Good Elena players should not be jumping, especially against Cody who has good AAs with long active frames,unless they’ve landed a hard knockdown.

Her slide is what prevents you from spamming rocks against her and is something to look out for at long range (I suggest going into training mode and practising punishes on block. Has weird blockstun.) Other than punishing on block, you can preemptively focus to crumple it.

Elena will sit at full screen and spam LK Lynx Tail to build meter. There is absolutely nothing you can do about this. When I’m in this situation I throw a HP rock and whiff Zonks to build meter of my own (careful, LK Lynx Tail recovers quickly so make sure you’re at a safe range before whiff in Zonks).

There is no such thing as “out-footsie-ing” Elena. Her normals are too quick and they outrange Codys. You have to play the matchup reactively. Elena doesn’t have a safe way to open Cody up, all her blockstrings ending in a special can be punished (majority of the time).

LK Lynx Tail is -7 on block. With u2 stocked you can reversal punish it at any range. EX

Mallet Smash is -5. You can punish it with c.Lp -> cl.Mp.

Spin Scythe is -7 or worse on block. You can reversal u2 this as well.

Practice all your punishes in training mode to prepare you midgame.

(I’ll edit and continue this post a little later. At work.)

[Ramma]

Who posted my match-up notes from here: http://blockstring.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=562

on the SRK wiki? http://embed.gyazo.com/759e2c5a3e539755e5a2a98c36f02ce0.png

Someone literally copied and pasted all my stuff, and gave me zero credit.

[GroundedSF]

I thought I remembered seeing someone ask your permission in a previous post…

Edit: Never mind, looks like it was someone else’s thread where permission was asked.

[Eternal]

Who posted my match-up notes from here: http://blockstring.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=562

on the SRK wiki? http://embed.gyazo.com/759e2c5a3e539755e5a2a98c36f02ce0.png

Someone literally copied and pasted all my stuff, and gave me zero credit.

It’s sort of credited via the link to mapleleafs drop box which specifically thanks you and blockstring and says it was almost entirely from you other than a couple of things he added. It was put up by BixHD who asked if it was ok back 7 months ago.

TBH I don’t care about credits myself unless you are outright claiming its yours when it not, but that’s just me. I added a link to the original blockstring thread though at the top of the match up breakdown.

I would like the Cody section to be cleaned up a bit if I’m being honest. The layout is a mess with the match ups and combos. I also feel like the language for the attack info could be better written but that’s just me. The entire frame data section will be updated once james gets around to transferring over the stuff I wrote up for every character. There is a lot more new info on there.

[Ramma]

It’s sort of credited via the link to mapleleafs drop box which specifically thanks you and blockstring and says it was almost entirely from you other than a couple of things he added. It was put up by BixHD who asked if it was ok back 7 months ago.

TBH I don’t care about credits myself unless you are outright claiming its yours when it not, but that’s just me. I added a link to the original blockstring thread though at the top of the match up breakdown.

I would like the Cody section to be cleaned up a bit if I’m being honest. The layout is a mess with the match ups and combos. I also feel like the language for the attack info could be better written but that’s just me. The entire frame data section will be updated once james gets around to transferring over the stuff I wrote up for every character. There is a lot more new info on there.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t care if someone uses anything I write/put together, but a simple mention would have been nice. When someone gives me a concept or starts the idea and I move forward with it, I try to give people credit. I even try to credit players who drill match-ups with me because they are part of the discovery.

Obviously BixHD made a mistake or whatever, but it didn’t seem like that at first (because even the emoticons are in there).

I know Maple/Chil used a huge chunk of it in his dropbox, and it was no big deal. It’s no big deal if it’s copied and pasted on the wiki. Hell, I wouldn’t mind updating info/contributing on the wiki (as it is, a bunch of the match-ups on their are outdated because they are pre-Ultra). Realistically, it’s accessible information here, there, twitch, YouTube, etc. at this point. It wasn’t like my plans to make a new console were stolen by Microsoft and used.

Thanks for clearing it up Eternal. I do appreciate it.

And yeah, the moves section is a bit off. I think Cody is one of the only characters with a wiki that has any notes to begin with, so at least it’s something. With SFV on the way, I don’t know how much that will change.

[Gobias_Employee]

Thanks Packz, I appreciate the help with Elena.
I watch your matches on the WSO Sessions to learn as well.
I seem to get hit by random EX mallet smashes or crouch MP to EX mallet smashes a lot. Do I just have to take it as part of her mixup or has anyone tried to reaction Zonk or Ultra 1 through it?

[Ramma]

Video on dealing with E. Honda’s wake-up game. Reversal stuffing, Reversal whiff and punish, stuffing EX Headbutt in strings, etc.

[Eternal]

Thanks Packz, I appreciate the help with Elena.
I watch your matches on the WSO Sessions to learn as well.
I seem to get hit by random EX mallet smashes or crouch MP to EX mallet smashes a lot. Do I just have to take it as part of her mixup or has anyone tried to reaction Zonk or Ultra 1 through it?

Non-EX zonk loses to all mallet smashers.

[quote=“Ramma, post:2123, topic:98500”]

Video on dealing with E. Honda’s wake-up game. Reversal stuffing, Reversal whiff and punish, stuffing EX Headbutt in strings, etc.

[/quote]

Have you tried using farMP in the match up? Stand JUST outside of the range of his farHK and you can use farMP fairly safely. It’ll punish a whiffed farHK and beat all of his Headbutts including EX and is far/fast enough to recover from most punishes in time unless he does an amazingly timed EX headbutt/U1 since there is only 11F recovery on farMP AND the headbutts wont hit on the first couple active frames. He’d need to stand up and do a farMP with precise timing to beat / whiff punish it.

FarMP is also safe from Honda’s crLP at that range, actually it’s possible to CH the crLP if you’re a little bit closer than Honda’s FarHK. I think it’s worth exploring.

[Ramma]

Have you tried using farMP in the match up? Stand JUST outside of the range of his farHK and you can use farMP fairly safely. It’ll punish a whiffed farHK and beat all of his Headbutts including EX and is far/fast enough to recover from most punishes in time unless he does an amazingly timed EX headbutt/U1 since there is only 11F recovery on farMP AND the headbutts wont hit on the first couple active frames. He’d need to stand up and do a farMP with precise timing to beat / whiff punish it.

FarMP is also safe from Honda’s crLP at that range, actually it’s possible to CH the crLP if you’re a little bit closer than Honda’s FarHK. I think it’s worth exploring.

So much yes. I like far st. MP and far st. LK in that match (as well as buffered cr. LP and crack kick). Both are not typically used for some reason (well, st. LK does like no damage, but it’s a nice pester button. St. MP is really great vs Oni and a number of other characters). I don’t see Cody players using enough crack kicks against those Honda players that rely too much on st. HK. And if they buffered hands with cr. LP, Honda can air reset you and you can punish.

I had an entire section on footsies and keep away/anti-airs, but the video would have been well over 10 minutes long and was getting too technical. It was going from Match-Up Tips to Advanced Guide lol. I’m trying to keep all of them under 4-5 minutes, while including underutilized tech and tech that isn’t common knowledge/unknown.

There’s a lot to be explored in Cody/Honda that will probably match the match very favorable for Cody. Cody can do a lot of things in the corner that won’t work mid-screen (like punishing headbutts with super).