3502

thats why i suggested to OS mp.srk in the corner because he wont/cant teleport backwards or dash backwards. but youre right about it trading with his ex headstomp which is a bad trade but os mp.srk beats out everything else clean (besides super or ultra). thats why i was saying only os tatsu if you think he’s going to teleport/backdash, for everything else, use os mp.srk. i guess we have different views on how to beat bison but i personally OS like its the bible when i play bison. i think its better than not applying any pressure at all.

3503

Oh~ ok. No worries dude. This is all Theory Fighter so anythings fine. I’m just stating the facts so we can start from there.

In the corner, he can still do all 4 versions of Teleport to punish SJ OS M. SRK. That’s 4 out of 8 options, which is still a good 50/50. In my opinion, it really depends on how much experience the M. Bison player has against Ken. The M. Bison I usually play in Tournaments knows Ken’s Option Select Flow Chart so they sometimes would Teleport to bait out my SJ OS M. SRK, even in the corner. So when I Safe Jump without any Option Select and they Teleport behind me, I get to punish. And there are other M. Bison players who think EX Psycho Crusher is a free “Get out of Jail” card and abuse it every time on their wake-up, especially in the corner.

I’m glad you brought up SJ OS in the corner. I was so focused on mid-screen that I forgot it can have different results. So I did some testing in the corner and it looks like Ambiguous SJ OS L. SRK beats EX Headstomp (auto-corrects and L. SRK hits behind him) and Back Dash, and trades with EX Psycho Crusher and EX Scissor Kick (in favor of Ken). If he Teleports, he can still punish you with C. LK but timings really strict. At the spur of the moment, M. Bison won’t be able to punish it.

Edit: After trying Ambiguous SJ OS L. SRK in the corner, it looks like you can also do this in mid-screen! It loses to Back Dash and only 2 versions of Teleport, covering 5 out of 8 M. Bison’s wake-up options. It beats EX Headstomp clean so we can follow up with another DP, Air EX Tatsu, or “fake” Ultra I, and trades with EX Psycho Crusher and EX Scissor Kick (in favor of Ken). This find alone might make me use U1 against M. Bison again.

Good stuff ImagineVC. Theory Fighter FTW!

3504

haha yeah man, theory fighter fighter sucks. no point debating it.
yo! im gonna have to try out that sj os lp. srk. if that covers the ex headstomp option then we’re golden!
you know what? ive actually been using U1 a little bit more than U2 to be honest and thats a good point with the sj os lp.srk> U1. good stuff!

3505

For sure. I like Theory Fighter though. If it wasn’t for it, we wouldn’t have found out about this. The fact that we can punish EX Headstomp is a big find against M. Bison.

Ok, make sure it’s Ambiguous or the L. SRK won’t auto-correct.

3506

wtf do i do when a gief gets in on me. fucking hate command grab characters.

3507

Do you mean when he gets a Knock Down or when he’s doing a Block String?

3508

Both :frowning:

3509

  1. Do your best to avoid this situation. When it happens again, try to make a mental note of what you and/or the other player did to put you in that situation.

  2. To avoid command throws, your best bet is to backdash. That can be punished of course, so against a good player you’ll just have to guess right.

  3. DP fadc can work, but it requires meter and Gief + Hawk can still punish it (among others). You’re better off developing a good, basic defense instead.

@Zangisrk: Seriously? At least half the damn threads you copypasted this in were matchup threads. It’s fine that you’re looking for players, but there’s matchmaking threads for that.

3510

Ok:

  1. When Zangief knocks you down, he’s going to jump over your corpse. Assuming the Zangief player knows what he’s doing, if you Quick Recover (“Technical”) than you can’t SRK. The best thing to do is lie dead while he jumps over your corpse the 1st time and as soon as he jumps over your corpse the 2nd time, get up and SRK. Most of the times, you’re going to be doing a deep SRK. (If he Short Jumps, you have to SRK. If he regular Jumps, you have to auto-correct SRK).

  2. When Zangief is doing a Block String your options are Back Jump, Neutral Jump, SRK, or Back Dash.

  • Holding Back Jump during his Block String can get you out of Tick Command Throws, but you won’t be able to punish it. Sometimes you’ll get hit while jumping back also. And if he times a Low Attack right you’ll get hit and it’ll lead to another Knock Down (EX Banishing Flat) combo.

  • Holding Neutral Jump during his Block String can punish Tick Command Throws with Neutral Jump MK > U2, but if he doesn’t Command Throw it’s a free Lariat and you’ll get Knocked Down again. Sometimes you’ll get hit while jumping neutral also. And if he times a Low Attack right you’ll get hit and it’ll lead to another Knock Down (EX Banishing Flat) combo.

  • SRK is self-explanatory.

  • Back Dash is the best option, but it can be hard to do a “reversal” Back Dash during a Block String (sometimes one of the “Back” input doesn’t register because of the Block Stun).

3511

Hi Ken players,

need some help against vega(claw). How do you guys tackle this matchup? What should you do and should not do against this matchup? Does ken has any reliable poke against vega? Vega always seems to out poke me. Thanks in advance.

3512

I’m also picking up ken, a few questions.

Do you guys pick ultra depending on character or mostly stick with one ultra? I’ve been using ultra 1 more because I can fadc to ultra much easier that way. But do you guys mostly use ultra 2?

Also, how important is doing a kara srk? I tried practicing it yesterday (f+mk version) and it seemed to make hardly any difference, and it was pretty difficult to pull off consistently. But maybe I’m doing it wrong

3513

Character specific. The things you have to ask yourself are:

Do I land low forward a lot in the matchup?
Does the character throw fireballs that are extremely punishable and have average to high recovery time? (Ryu, Akuma, Rose, etc)
Is the character I’m playing against free on wakeup? (Cody, Gouken)
Does Ultra 2 limit or negate the usage of certain character tools? (Many Balrog Dash punches, Chun Li EX SBK, Ibuki air knives, Zangief green hand, T Hawk condor dives, etc)

If the answer to any of these questions is yes, Ultra 2. If not so much, Ultra 1.

3514

I land the low forward a good deal but usually at the range where the fireball can be blocked afterwards.

Is the first hit of ultra 2 armor breaking? I usually do ex tatsu on reaction to his ex dash punches, but it’d be nice to be able to do ultra 2 on reaction as well.

3515

So forgive me if i’m posting something already known, I was doing reading and I couldn’t find anything about this…i’ve been playing around with Ken’s U2, and I find it to be extremely useful dealing with charge characters.

U2 can go through fireballs at all times, fast, lots of hits…ok dmg, and say bye if they crouch.

U2 does not combo after fierce DP FADC and only fireball or EX fireball FADC allows it to be comboed…and it can be tough sometimes.

on Counter hit U2 can juggle but you will not get the full ultra…so if you land your Fierce DP on CH, you have to input ultra when they’re a little lower…i’d say around ken’s head or lower…if it’s too high…you will only get 1 or 2 hits and ken flies away safely, i’ve gotten about 5-6 hits max.

3516

Any time you see Balrog turn yellow (EX), kara throw him for free. Also, I wasn’t referring to hitting him with Ultra 2 while he’s actually doing the dash punches, although that works as well. I meant you can actually block and punish EX dash smash, dash low, and dash overhead with Ultra 2.

3517

Do not jump in
Do not attempt to Shoryuken wall dives, you will miss and eat the edges of his claws
Do not stand in the corner
Do not pick Ultra II
Do not spam fireballs

Dash when he does wall dives
Don’t attempt to absorb attacks with focus they will slide forward after their light punch, try countering with light shoryukens

3518

Thanks Golbez. I’m still on the fence about the kara srk, do you guys frequently/consistently pull this off and consider it very helpful?

3519

it becomes pretty useful once you have the basics down, but before that: not so much

3520

You can’t out poke Vega, but you can counter his poke with meaty normals like C. MP, FS. MP, and FS. MK. Forward Dash, FB, and Step Kick is also a good option after he whiffs his normals. Vega’s best normals are C. MP and FS. MK (this kick has slightly more range than Ken’s Step Kick). He has terrible AA and wake-up options, but until you knock him down he will keep you out. His fastest move is 4 frames so -2 on block is not too bad for Ken (Step Kick, SRK > FADC, and etc).

I usually Step Kick > Kara F. SRK to get in and start from there.

Both Ken’s Ultras are really good. I think U2 can be used against everyone, but not U1. I personally like to use U2 against Ryu, Seth, Gouken, Akuma, Juri, Abel, M. Bison, Sagat, Deejay, Cody, Guile, Zangief, and T. Hawk.

Kara F. SRK is REALLY important for Ken. It’s hard at first, but with practice you can master it. It gets you in safely (SRK > FADC: -2 on block) and it opens 1~3 frame window for your opponent to throw out a move.

Golbez basically covered it.

I thought all Ultras have Armor Break property?

U2 is really good because you can combo into it from C. LP.

No worries, but we already posted this when the game came out.

3521

Thks for the tips guys. Do you guys option select tatsu when he uses Backflip PPP? Or should i say, should i use it? I tried to do it but it doesnt seems so rewarding becuase i managed to get 1 hit only.