"They like me, they really really like me!" (The Ryu Thread)

[FreshOJ]

It’s so not easy. :sad: I’ve tried for like a half an hour straight in training mode with no luck. Do I drum the buttons? When I do the piano tap on the punch buttons I get fierce dp. When I don’t I get fireball. I just don’t understand super canceling in this game. I used to be able to do j.hp, c.hp, super with ryu in training mode in regular ST and I’ve yet to do a single super cancel in this game. Maybe I just suck, but super combos are so awkward in this game.

You are exactly the person that I wrote my FAQ for! Go to GameFAQs.com and read it. I detail how to interrupt normal moves into super combos in there.

Recently picked up Ryu for shits and giggles. Finding uses for almost all his normals, but I was wondering, do you guys use j.hp for anything? Looking at the hitbox it looks like it has some sort of use, but I haven’t figured it out.

It hits higher, therefore making deep hits easier. You don’t remember being able to do Ryu/Ken’s ToD from the front back in the day?

When should you use j.mk and j.hk respectively? Or is it just j.hk all day? Obviously j.hk crossup when you get the chance…

I would guess that j.:mk:'s blue boxes are further back than j.:hk:. Other than that, j.:hk: all day.

Any cool uses for f.hp that one might not think of right away? Obviously I’ll do meaty fireball/super, f.hp, then either another fireball or wait/fake fb and then dp if they jump. Sometimes I use it in blockstrings when I’ve got them scared and they’re not Ken - j.lp, c.lk, f.hp, c.mp, c.hk xx fireball, shit like that. That move is really fun, sometimes I’ve rushed people’s shit down with blockstrings in it. Even though it’s probably not that safe (I get thrown when I whiff which is easier to whiff than it seems)… I know you can do it after a deep crossup but I can’t really get the timing and just stick to hp xx red fireball.

You really need to read my FAQ. You’re further along than you think you are.

By the way, you can use f+:hp: as a dash, too. Kinda obvious, but you didn’t mention it, so I did.

I feel at a loss when people are at that range just outside of sweep/any poke - should I just be patient? If I’m not in the corner sometimes I jump back tatsu/try to juice kick backwards to make space.

Why not try to bait a jump with the fake Hadouken? Mix it up with throwing a :hp: Hadouken and you’ll be in business because the other variations will start flowing from your brain and into your control pad or joystick.

[x1grenade1x]

hello

[Mechanica]

What can you guys tell me about Ryu v Honda besides something obvious (throw fireballs :razz: )? Especially punishing a jab headbutt that I see coming. Pre-emptive f+hp as a dash and then sweep? I sometimes find myself out of range since ryu doesn’t always have a far ranged option. I could always throw another fireball for him to block then fake fireball and react. But I’d like to know what a good option is. Any tips in general for the matchup?

[oldschool_BR]

When should you use j.mk and j.hk respectively? Or is it just j.hk all day? Obviously j.hk crossup when you get the chance…

You should only crossup when you have more to gain than the enemy has when you mess it up or get it countered. Training helps not messing it up; online play, the opposite. Similarly, it is easier not to get it countered online. Anyway, in real (offline) matches there are characters you pretty much never want to crossup, while others are almost helpless when you do it. Guile, Dictator or Fei Long suffer with j.rh, Claw and Boxer have issues with tatsu. On the other hand, Gief can lariat and follow up with his splash, and Honda can headbutt to escape or store oicho to punish anything you do not time right.

Pros often use j.fwd or jab due to their smaller blockstun. As Ryu gets on the ground, he can counter a number of things if he predicts them, or go for the throw. Shoryuken beats Ken’s jab and fierce reversal shoryukens, reversal throw attempts from anyone and general mashing. He can also use walk back -> cr.fwd xx (red) hadouken to beat throws with slightly better range than his, or just use cr.fwd xx (red) hadouken before blocktun ends, to hit enemies as they stand still to do whatever requires such a move (counter throw/throw softening, SRK). Finally, he can use the jump-in attack as a tick and throw afterwards.

Edit: originally posted by djfrijoles: [media=youtube]4K9vKpLGTsA[/media]. It is related to crossups, but most of it work if you use a jab or forward, due to less pushback.

[Raakam]

These threads can be annoying to navigate at times, there never is any one repository of information in any one post on specific characters, it’s all spread out. Maybe we can try and break down every match up, have feedback, and then copy/paste an exhaustive explanation to the ST wiki? A few people asked me to write some information on how I deal with specific characters; I’ll start with Honda, and we can all work on it for a few days and then go with the next character.

Note: this is all based on opinion and my experience with the match against Thelo, Mad Possum and Megaman, which are the best 3 Hondas (in no specific order) I’ve encountered online.

E. Honda - Difficulty 3.5/10:

This match up is heavily in Ryu’s favor. Your goal is to keep Honda locked down under fireball pressure, and punish any attempt at closing the gap with cr.:hk: or a well-placed dragon punch. If you have Honda cornered, the match should be over, assuming you keep your proper distance and don’t allow him to butt-slam his way out safely. Things to avoid: being within jab torpedo range, letting Honda close the gap, sweeping too early on the buttslam and getting knocked down.

Let’s take a look at which of our attacks come into play:

• cr:mp: : this move is very handy in stuffing torpedos as well as beating hundred-hand slap from the right range. It also beats the buttslam coming from above if you are positioned a little too close to safely pull off cr:hk:. Generally fairly effective way of starting the round. Beware, as it loses to Honda’s b.:hk: sweep!

• cr:hk: : your roundhouse sweep is amazingly effective in this match up. It pushes you/Honda away if it is blocked, or scores a knock down allowing the time to reset the distance. Make a habit of canceling the cr:hk: into a fireball if it is blocked. Be careful, if the Honda player has a super meter charged, the sweep xx fireball can sometimes leave a few free frames where the sumo will be able to reversal!

• fireball: your bread and butter. Push him back, and keep him away. At full screen, and with varying speeds, the Honda player has very few options. It’s up to you to keep him away with smart fireballs. The Honda player can react a few different ways. Neutral jump doesn’t do much for him, he didn’t really advance, and you can keep fireballing. If he butt slams, you can just walk up a bit and sweep and score a free knock down. If he jab torpedoes, it depends how close he lands to you. If he’s in your face, no time for another FB, as he can start his HHS and beat you to it. You can just sweep xx fireball in that case. If he lands far enough, you can just fireball again most of the time, though you can walk up sweep xx fireball. Be careful, Honda can buttslam from there and score a knock down if you make a mistake! If he’s far enough, you can fireball again and he normally will not have time to do anything but block or eat the fb.

• fake fireball, or crouching and standing up + jab, or just crouching and standing repeatedly: Basically, anything to get Honda to jump for no reason. Any time Honda leaves the ground, he’s free. You can fireball, dragon punch, standing :mk:, standing :mp: or any number of anti airs. Standing :hk: can trade with Honda’s j:hp: so be careful with that. Remember to time your Dragon punches pretty late or else you will trade hits. Keep Honda guessing!

• dragon punch: obviously serves a key role in shutting down Honda’s areal escapades. If he tries to jump in on you, you can walk up a bit and dp to ensure you do not whiff. Remember, if Honda supers from full screen, you can get an easy knock down. In between the first and second hit of Honda’s super, you can fit in a dragon punch. It doesn’t even have to be a reversal, but the timing is pretty strict! If you take Honda’s ability to close the gap for free with his super, you’ve taken a great leap forward!

• super: do not waste your super. Good Hondas will easily avoid it. Use it to punish torpedo attempts, to punish jump ins, butt slams that land in front of you (if you’re under the butt slam, you’ll get knocked down! dp instead, or just block), or Honda’s super. Instead of using the dp in-between first and second hit, use your own shinkuu hadoken and you’ll nail the bastard!

Once Honda gets close, smart use of cr:hk: or cr:mk: xx fireball pushes him back out. As I recall, if Honda gets you in his knee-bash hold, he can safe jump at you afterward, so be on the look out for that. If Honda walks forward, he has no normals on the ground that beat Ryu’s j:hk:, so feel free to jump at him and j:hk: cr:mk: xx red fireball for knockdown (if the j:hk: is unblocked) or j:hk cr:hk: xx fireball to push him back out (if j:rh: is blocked). You can extend this block string to j:hk: cr:lp: cr:lp: cr:hk: xx fireball to push him further out if you’re comfortable enough with the timing.

Do not fall into the trap of jumping back + roundhouse when you’re cornered. You’ll just eat a torpedo or a butt slam for your troubles. Stay alert and push Honda back out, or you can sometimes escape with a juice kick or even a basic air hurricane kick.

Video Links:
http://www.streetfighterdojo.com/superturbo/ryu/ryumatches.html#EHonda
[media=youtube]cimBGwgy0qU[/media]
[media=youtube]SrBfZKlHwnU&feature=related[/media]

Anyone with anything to add?

[Coth_X]

I remember looking at T. Akiba’s frame data page earlier, and finding that ryu’s and ken’s hadoken frame data differs by 1 frame respective to each hado strength.

My question is along the frame line, does ryu release his hadoken sooner than ken’s.

What I mean is does ryu throw his hado out and spend the rest of his time in recovery, while ken waits to throw a little later and then spends less time in recovery do to delaying his hado release later?

I want to know, because playing ryu’s such as Hadoken69696969 and Haksoukan and DOTA wicked sick, I’ve been having a very hard time keeping up in hado fights. I know ken loses these, but I lose these quickly even when I’m doing jab hados vs. their fierce hados. I’m “recovering” sooner, but ryu still finally overtakes me.

[System_1]

thx raakam looking forward for the rest of the cast.

just 1 question: what’s a juice kick? You say to use it to escape out of the corner. I always thoght it was the hurrican kick but you mention it apart so i guess it’s a different thing. thanks in advance for helping me out on this one

[Raakam]

thx raakam looking forward for the rest of the cast.

just 1 question: what’s a juice kick? You say to use it to escape out of the corner. I always thoght it was the hurrican kick but you mention it apart so i guess it’s a different thing. thanks in advance for helping me out on this one

A juice kick is a hurricane kick done as soon as you leave the ground. It’s basically an air hurricane kick, but if done right, it changes the flight pattern and keeps you lower to the ground, making it much harder to punish than a regular air hurricane kick.

I couldn’t find a video of Ryu doing it online, but this video shows a Ken player doing it in Round 3: [media=youtube]FIhvkGKHILM[/media]

[System_1]

a ok thanks man. keep up the good work you do here, there are a lot of people that appreciate what you do!

[System_1]

Hello Ryu-Masters
well i ran into shari yesterday, and normally i have no chance against him and his vega but yesterday was just plain silly, as soon as i was in the corner and all he had to do was st.MK me to death…i tried cr. MK, cr.LK, hurrican kick, DP, Hado,…everything that came to my mind but nothing seems to beat this shit, i can’t even jump in between his MK’s… anybody give me some advice?

[Shari]

Hello Ryu-Masters
well i ran into shari yesterday, and normally i have no chance against him and his vega but yesterday was just plain silly, as soon as i was in the corner and all he had to do was st.MK me to death…i tried cr. MK, cr.LK, hurrican kick, DP, Hado,…everything that came to my mind but nothing seems to beat this shit, i can’t even jump in between his MK’s… anybody give me some advice?

SRK. Nothing else will work unless the Vega screws up. And it is position and timing dependent if your SRK will hit it.

[Raakam]

Hello Ryu-Masters
well i ran into shari yesterday, and normally i have no chance against him and his vega but yesterday was just plain silly, as soon as i was in the corner and all he had to do was st.MK me to death…i tried cr. MK, cr.LK, hurrican kick, DP, Hado,…everything that came to my mind but nothing seems to beat this shit, i can’t even jump in between his MK’s… anybody give me some advice?

The fight gets much harder if you get cornered, so part of your pre-fight plan is to figure out how not to get cornered - easier said than done. Once you are cornered, Vega players will assault you with st.mk and the occasional st.hp/mp or cr.mp.

Thing to remember: if you are ahead on life, who cares if they st.mk you all day, just block it, it does no damage. Once they try to go for a throw or something, be ready to react. If you’re behind on life, make sure you block for a while before you commit to a dragon punch. Try and find patterns in their pokes, and reduce the most amount of guesswork out of your dragon punch attempt. A well timed hurricane kick will also beat the st.mk, since it has invulnerable frames at start up. If the vega player backs up enough, you can sometimes fit a red fireball in there to score a knockdown.

Once you get a knockdown, get the hell out of the corner asap. This is one of Ryu’s worst match ups. Just work on not getting yourself cornered and you’ll have an easier time.

[Shari]

snip.

I have yet to see Hk ever hit a :mk:.

Invulnerability runs out before it goes into hitting frames in ST.

It was invulnerable until hitting in CE and HF.

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=6170069&postcount=175

[BoggleMinds]

There is no real solution to Claw. But as Raakam mentioned, the longer you can keep out of the corner, the better chance you have of taking control of the fight.

However against good Claw players, Ryu players will surely find themselves stuck in the corner a lot.

The barrage of st. MK isn’t as threatening as repeated well-spaced slides, chained into various pokes with a few rolls mixed in for the chip damage pressure. Ryu cannot jump forward, he can’t stick any pokes as Claw’s footsies are superior in speed and range (spamming cr. LK won’t work either), he can’t fireball, DP’s will be expected and baited. This is the perfect example of tori no kago, lit. ‘bird cage’. Juice kicking over is unreliable and usually punished successfully with a throw or cr. MP. Jumping backwards won’t work as it loses to all kinds of moves.

Short hurricane kick is NOT a consistent or reliable solution, however it is something you can pull out occasionally – unfortunately the sheer speed of Claw’s pokes means it’s a bit of a gamble.

Basically you’ll have to block/turtle if you’re stuck in the corner; in that situation give yourself a moment to analyse your opponent for patterns or other weaknesses in their attacks. Squeezing in a clutch red fireball at exactly the perfect moment and range is easier said than done.

N.B. Wall dives should not be an issue unless you get knocked down somewhere out of the corner. In that case pray for some luck!

[Raakam]

I have yet to see Hk ever hit a :mk:.

Invulnerability runs out before it goes into hitting frames in ST.

It was invulnerable until hitting in CE and HF.

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=6170069&postcount=175

I have occasionally traded with HKs before with Vega’s st.:mk: - I don’t know if they were too close when they did it or what, so I’m not sure what the exact circumstances/frames are. It’s not reliable, but it has worked for me at times.

Edit: Boggleminds has it right. It’s not a fun fight, but learning your options once cornered is essential in pushing the outcome to your advantage.

[System_1]

Ok HurricanK never worked for me and shari knows his distances quite well, so that even SRK doesn’t hit consistently

well shari if you’re online this evening i can continue my training against you even if it means taking some more losses

vggs by the way

[Shari]

Ok HurricanK never worked for me and shari knows his distances quite well, so that even SRK doesn’t hit consistently

well shari if you’re online this evening i can continue my training against you even if it means taking some more losses

vggs by the way

GGs indeed.

If you ever find me on feel free to invite me.

I very seldom turn down any offer to play someone.

[System_1]

ok and i’ll invite my brother too so you can train against blanka

btt

[supreme_jd]

i’m trying to learn this game, help me out here.

i’m looking at the srk wiki and this is what it has for ryu’s bnb’s

Bread & Butter

* j.hk, cr.mk xx fp hadouken
* j.fp, cr.fp xx fp hadouken
* j.hk, st.fp xx fp hadouken

in which situation is each one used? shouldn’t i just stick with the j.hk, cr.mk xx fp hadouken combo because it’s the easiest/has the most range?

Meaty Combos

* meaty f + fp, cr.fp xx hadouken
* meaty f + fp, cr.mp, cr.hk (xx fp hadouken if blocked)
* meaty cl.hk, cr.hk (xx fp hadouken if blocked)
* meaty cl.mk, cr.mk xx hadouken 

• when it says “if blocked”, does that mean that these aren’t combos? why can they be interrupted?
• in which situation would you use each of these?

also, how exactly do you practice meaties? do you need a second player to do reversals, or can you just knock down the dummy and time your hit when they get up?

[Coth_X]

i’m trying to learn this game, help me out here.

i’m looking at the srk wiki and this is what it has for ryu’s bnb’s

in which situation is each one used? shouldn’t i just stick with the j.hk, cr.mk xx fp hadouken combo because it’s the easiest/has the most range?

• when it says “if blocked”, does that mean that these aren’t combos? why can they be interrupted?
• in which situation would you use each of these?

also, how exactly do you practice meaties? do you need a second player to do reversals, or can you just knock down the dummy and time your hit when they get up?

It means if the sweep hits you get a knockdown, and if the entire string was blocked the hado gets chip and pushes them away from you.