Anyone wanna check if my safe jump/option select set-up on Bison is viable?
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I posted this in the Strategy and Match-Up Thread, but I realized that there were other OS vids in here as well.
EDIT:
Might as well add this one too. I should really try these in a real match. I don’t know if neckbreaker actually auto-corrects itself.
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your ibuki is coming along nicely chris.
couple of tips:
vs guile:
at around max slide distance you can just punish jab sonic booms with df mk on reaction.
if you land sweep, you can go into the kunai vortex too.
vs characters that you can vortex, it’s probably more worth it to end combos in neck breaker than to go for launcher since they can reversal the launcher reset.
(exception to this rule is when they are in the corner and you can cross up with the launcher)
guile’s love to just throw out their u2 since it’s safe on block. but you should really punish this on reaction with counter ultra instead of blocking it. there’s no reason not to, if you have time to block, you have time to ultra.
vs honda
the correct way to deal with head butts is to jump on reaction. let it whiff then punish the whiff with a knock down and get your free vortex.
you can s.lp or s.lk it out of the air on reaction, but why take this risk for almost no reward when jumping it nets you way more damage and oki set up.
either neutral jump or back jump depending on distance. if you land close to them you get a full combo on their whiff, if you land a little farther just sweep or neck breaker.
as for the general game plan… i’m not sold on one yet as i’ve pretty much destroyed every ibuki i’ve played so far with honda. kunai’s are not bad. but you can only jump back so much before you put your self in the corner which is what honda wants. not to mention if the honda jumps over one of your kunais he gets a full jump in combo on you when you land. also if he guess head butts or u1 under one, you lost a chunk of life. so you want to throw them but you really have to be careful with your spacing and empty jump to fake it. it’s a lot harder than it sounds.
another thing i would say is you should always do neck breaker combos into kunai vortex vs honda. if you try to do a launcher set up you are just asking to be reversaled. the hardest thing about this match up for me when i play honda is kunai vortex after a knock down.
oh and finally, one big tip i always give to people playing vs honda is you have to bait his reversals. one of honda’s main strengths is the safety of his two reversals. ex hb and butt slams. if are ever pressuring from the ground, you should just expect one of these to come out during the gaps in your frames.
you need to have a plan ahead of time for making them whiff ex hb’s (waste their meter) and block (u2 punish) or fa2 the butt slam.
i would go with u1 over u2 in this match. u2 can punish hb’s but a good honda will not use any hb other than ex vs you when you have ultra.
u1 shuts down almost all butt slams since it’s a free punish if your close enough. this literally half’s the number of reversals he has and changes the match quite a bit.
chris just hit me up on live if you want practice with this match up. (or a bunch of other ones, i play quite a few characters now but honda was all i played in vanilla)
Really nice stuff.
Vatsu u didn’t play safe vs. Honda at all. Mad random neckbreakers = no good. Stop using them unless he whiffs a buttslam. Throw kunais all day and dont press offense. Honda’s offense rewards him much quicker than yours does at close range. Unless you knock him down don’t go near him. Build super so he can’t throw specials without losing a bunch of life.
Oh and in that Sagat matchup if u had backdashsed after u jumped away from the first part of Sagat’s ultra u would have moved away from the second uppercut and won.
On the random neck breaker thing, I’ve been flip flopping how I feel about it. My theory has always been random = bad, so I immediately rejected when I saw people doing it for no reason. Then I looked at the numbers on fierce NB, and with so many active hit frames it can be + on block so I thought maybe it’s not such a bad idea. But, I feel like fierce NB travels more than full screen, so you’re not gonna hit it where it’s plus practically. Now, I’m back to it not being very good unless you see a focus charging. There may be some meaty setups on wake-up though, and perhaps you could mix it up with the jab version to bait or apply other means of pressure. If that be the case, that leaves the question why to use that option over meaty kunai, if that is possible in the same given situation.
Overall, I believe it’s much better to use her slide over NB to space in. Use Ex-NB to punish fireballs.
I played too much 3S to give random neckbreakers any credit. Sorry not doing that shit unless I’m feeling psychic. LOL.
You gotta embrace your inner random with this game man. Just accept it!
Well I don’t lose all of my health anymore for guesses like the last game…maybe it’s worth a shot to bring myself back to my glory days. LOL.
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Just watch the first round, second is more of the same; when people do that to me (crossing up constantly) I’m just sitting there dumbfounded- I should really dash and slide more but I just can’t remember to when under pressure, hopefully it comes with more practice…cuz right now all I do is dumb shit. Had a 2 day break from super now because I got worse every minute I played it. :s
Also need some help with bison, will upload the vid later/tomorrow.
@ Datsmadz: Thanks, no the two rep loop won’t work on everyone, but the LP>MP>HP>far st.lp>s. mk will work on everyone, even if they’re crouching, the lp.mp.hp target combo stands them up if you link it after an overhead which is cool.
Unfortunately you can’t substitute the lk>mk target combo in those loops cuz the frames don’t allow it, far st. lp only.
@ alex: the lp>mp>hp>far st.lp>s.mk works on every character. Doing lp>mp>hp>lk.tsumuji>far st.lp does NOT work on every character, there’s lists and stuff that have already been compiled in other threads though. LOL and i wouldn’t say it isn’t difficult, it’s got two one frame links in it, at least online it’s you’ll need a bit of luck with your execution.
@ Smashing: They talked about that in another thread too… It seems to work on big hitbox characters, which is weird cuz rogs hitbox is stupid in this game, anyways i’ve been able to recreate it on abel and sagat like the first guy said it. We believe it has to do with hitting the last HK of the target combo on the very last connectable frame
@Jibbo: It’s never worth it to do random neckbreakers, ever. I’ve been using a lot more of her random pokes to some success, far st. hk is actually cool for whiffed pokes sometimes. And a cool bait i use is blocked cr.mk (not the slide), they feel safe and get up and than you sweep them. Try that out, i don’t think enough people use cr.mk, but DJ talked about it in his pokes writeup in the QandA thread i think, mistiming the slide can really fuck you.
@ Icetrap, you were getting worked by Hondas headbutts, which kind of goes without saying cuz they do monstrous dmg. My buddy mains a rog and honda and i find those are two reallly terrible matchups. With Honda, if you can get an cr.lp pokes in, always try and go for cr.lp>st.lp>st.mk xx ender cuz those frames are much easier to link, and will hit honda cuz he’s gota big hitbox. When you have ultra he can’t spam any headbutts cuz it punishes all of them on reversal except EX. Cross him up all day, fairly solid though.
Your biggest problem isn’t so much the cross ups you were at least blocking some of them. It’s that u would press buttons after he crosses u up. He always did something dumb like whiff an uppercut afterwards. Your biggest problem is that your execution is terrible. When he does dumb crap he gets away cuz u can’t time your LP kunais meaty on wake up and you drop all of your combos. Just get knockdowns and pressure him the same way. At least use j.LK cross on wake up.
After seeing this thread I can confirm myself as the worst Ibuki player ever. D=
In both 3S and SFIV. LOL.
BTW u coming to Xanadu on Saturday? Free BBQ food along with the games.
That’s what I’m suggesting about random neck breakers. There’s no logical reason to do it outside of reacting to a focus charge. I think jab slide can be used to cover space though.
Crouch MK is actually amazing. It’s even on block with good active frames. I need to check the combo-ability with respect to spacing later. Slide is just as good with proper spacing. I believe in time people will discover meaty setups that combo into 123. That’ll fuck Rog’s headbutt and Cody’s Bingo option, amongst other things.
i also get pwnd by that crossup strat when its a blanka… ONLINE… sometimes, depending on lag.
but the universal way to beat that cheese offline is to just do a jump back heavy attack or whatever is your best jumping away AA.
airthrows are even better and ibuki has a good one so airthrowing his ass would have been good as well. airthrow is my most used AA when i play online since the worst that usually happens is that i get hit out of it for negligible damage… grounded AA’s online are much more risky since you risk lag mistiming your stuff and getting pwnd by a jumpin combo.
so yeah try to jump back with hk or mk next time someone does that to you, or better yet airthrow his ass.
-dime
i only use like one poke in neutral game footsies… cr.mk.
(ok i slide a bit as well)
-dime
Alright thx i’ll try to adjust and stop throwing out random neckbreakers. I understand its lame to sit in the back throw kunais at Honda all day but i suppose no one wants to eat headbutts all day.
@Deci How good is the side at beating guile c.jab? I use slide to to pass under the sonic booms maybe to get close but that’s just about it.
@yerffejk thx man
Yeah as lame as it is it’s the safest way to keep Honda under control. The problem is the one time you mess up with up close pressure against Honda you set yourself up for auto lose cuz at close range is offense is much safer and u have to guess against his ochio mix ups. His BnB’s also rape all of ur life super quick. From far range Honda can’t do anything to u as long as u space with the kunais and anti air his jump ins so no reason to not. Once you get super meter the match is so in your favor. Just counter strike camp his ass.
will do… i sorta wish Ibuki had a bit more life though so we could do more, its really frustrating when like 35% of your HP is gone with just two fucking attacks lol
Oh yes, my bad bro. Another option is when they’re whiffing specials to build meter. I read somewhere max range slide combos into far st.lp but haven’t tested it out, in my experience I’ve only been able to use it as a hit and run poke. Let’s hope you’re right about that shit for rog though haha