151

@Projectjustice‌
you know that guy Reynald that won KOFXIII.
I heard that when he first went online to play GGPO KOF98 he got blown up big time.
Know why?
Cuz he thought he could play 98 like the way he plays KOFXIII. and he was sadly mistaken.
and he got blown up for it. He thought he could jump around, not giving a fuck, being all reckless with “I don’t give a fuck jump ins”…and got destroyed.
Know why?
Cuz in that game, anti-air normals actually fucking hurt. And are more functional due to their good hitboxes and greater active frames than they are in KOFXIII. Couple that with no hyperdrive muscle memorized simon says 25+ hit combo bullshit to make a comeback in case he succeeds on a rare whiffed or stuffed anti-air of his jump in…and all of a sudden you got a guy with really bad basic fundamentals getting blown up.

Modern fighters teaches you bad fundamentals my friend because they’ve strayed away from the core philosophy that the old school fighters taught you which was good fundamentals. That’s the reality.

Which is why, like I said, you should know better for saying you don’t have a problem with gimmicks like Ultras installed into a SF game.

that’s all I have left to say.

152

It would limit Momochi’s options. The difference is that Ryan Hart may not have had that meter for Super available, no, because he may have used EX’s earlier in the fight. Or, if he saved for Super, he wouldn’t have been able to use those EX’s earlier. Also, even if he made the correct read with the Super, it wouldn’t have done as much damage. It also doesn’t have the threat of being a reversal that does 40% damage which limits Momochi’s pressure and mixup on Ryan’s wakeup. You’re also not capable of converting into Super off of an FADC Shoryu because Focus likely wouldn’t be in either, but Super would use the entire bar anyways.

I think I’ve more than made my point and if you’re going to keep disagreeing then that’s just the way it’s going to have to be. The difference between an Ultra and a Super is pretty clear, in terms of how you gain and use the Super resource (and how using and gaining that resource impacts your play compared to using and gaining Ultra), and how many more options Ultra beats compared to Super.

153

In SF4 if you jump a lot you will get blown pretty easy. So I dont know how that teaches bad fundamentals. If you watch Capcom Cup no one as jumping accept on trying to do wakeup vortexes and delay wakeup has tone that down. The only thing I see that really teaches bad Fundamentals is that reversal window. Its the worst thing about SF4. Theres nothing wrong with the Ultra system, you might not like it but the game is balanced around it.

We will just have to agree to disagree.

154

You cant say that 100%. One thing thats certain in fighting games especially in SF, you will have a stock meter within the round unless you get perfect. If the system is different like there’s no Ultra system, you really think EX moves would be used as much as they are now? Fundamentals change according to what tools you have access to.

155

That’s a nice way to contribute absolutely nothing to the conversation.
You said that parries nullify footsies. What that statement tells me is that you have no idea how a game like Third Strike plays.
You mentioned a situation where 2 characters jump at each other in 3s and said how that always results in an empty jump because nobody wants to get parried, that’s wrong.

That right there gives it away that you have no idea what is happening.
What parry does, is that it makes it so you have to completely establish dominance of an angle before your opponent will respect it.
In a game like SF2, if you’re playing in your EVO pools against a stranger, I bet you that 90% of the time you wouldn’t jump at Guile because he is guile, not because of your opponent.
That doesn’t happen in a game with parry. In a game with parry, your opponent first has to let you know you can’t jump at him.

I remember playing a set against Hsien Chang on 3s a while back he was using Ken.
He knew at least 4 different timings to do an anti air uppercut. There were some distances where I had to respect the angle just as if I was playing against an SF2/SF4 Ken. Parry wasn’t the answer at all for that situation, he had the advantage through probability every time. In other words, he had some angles 95% neutralized, so I wasn’t taking any chances after he established that. Once that was established, I sure as hell wasn’t jumping at him even with parry.

Same with the situation you mentioned of two guys jumping at each other.
In 3s, there’s at least 3 different timings to poke when you’re in that situation. On two of those situations, if your opponent parries first, he is at a disadvantage. This means that 66.66% of the time you would prefer it that your opponent tries to parry. How the hell can you say people are “scared” of getting parried when they jump at each other. That is completely insane. Again, just another hint that you do not understand the game.
I hope at this point I don’t have to explain you that this applies to footsies as well. I’d believe you if you said you played 3s and you felt like your footsie game was completely nullified. That is completely possible if you don’t understand the neutral of the game, but to say that the parry mechanic nullifies footsies in general, that is entirely wrong. Go watch the complete set of EVO moment 37 and then say with a straight face that game has no footsies.

I’m not saying that a neutral game with parry is superior or more deep than that of SF4, SF2 or Alpha. Those games also have their own things that make them amazing just like 3s.
I’m saying that a neutral game with parry is different, and its also just as deep as any other great system you could mention. After 6 years with the neutral game of SF2/SF4, I think it’s a good idea to revisit the parry neutral too.

Oh and yes, parry is a very effective way to punish bad habits and cr. tech mashing, so I can understand why a huge percentage of people who were introduced to fighting games through SF4 don’t like it, but still, they have to learn sometime.
I know parry won’t be on SF5 anyway, but I at least hope they revisit the neutral in Street Fighter in general.

156

Well said J.D. if I wasn’t at physical therapy I would be firing up 3SOE right now! Lol

157

listen, that statement I made about 2 characters jumping in on each other, no one hitting buttons from fear of getting parried, and walking away from each other wasn’t even originally mine. Someone else posted it years ago in the FGD boards like 5 years ago. In some thread about “Why SF3 failed to be popular?” or something like that.
I just never forgot it and re-used it here.
The statement that someone made, that statement about neutral jumping in was obviously an exaggeration someone made to prove their point about the ebb flow and pace of SF3.
But it still stands true.
No one likes the parry mechanic…except turd strikers.
Parries are not coming back.
Ever.
Its not, has not, and will never be popular amongst SF players.
The only time Capcom brought it back was in CVS2.
And only to appease the turd strikers.
So,
stop your hopes,
your dreams,
your wishful thinking,
your wants,
your lusts and desires,
cuz its not making a comeback into any further SF games.
The parry is hated by most SF players.
despised by all except 3rd strikers.
So let
it
go.
let it go.
give it up already.
jesus if it isn’t true what everyone says which is that SF3 lovers are hella obnoxious about bringing parries back.

Capcom bringing the parry back for SFV would be 1,000% financial suicide.
And Capcom cant afford to fuck up SFV with the state that company is in. Since its in a teetering state right now where they’ve made the buying out of the company public.
This is probably why I think SFV looks very “back to basics” in its gameplay. Cuz they NEED SFV to do as well as it can and they are seemingly going back to centering the gameplay on fundamentals. Which is sorely sorely welcome by the vast majority of the Street Fighter community.
Stop trying to shoehorn the most despised defensive mechanic into the game and transforming it into something niche for a few players which is what SF3 turned out becoming.

Stop
trying
to
ruin
Street
Fighter!

Others like me are trying to salvage it by bringing it back to basics centered around core fundamentals of any old school fighter which is good anti-airs, footsies using all and not some of your buttons which parries and focus attacks negate, spacing, frame data math that makes sense, rational hitboxes, no op jump ins moves, and great tier balance of all the characters.
back to the basics=popular
popular=success.
period.
parries are not repeat NOT popular!
Neither are focus attacks or ultras!
stahp it!!!
Stop your nonsense of parry and focus attack love affairs, your “I welcome despised by all gimmicky comeback ultras with open arms”, and your “cuz I’m good at 3rd strike cuz i mastered the parry so please Capcom make SFV just like 3rd strike so I can be good at that too” selfish nonsense.
I’m good at guilty gear too but you don’t hear me asking for Guilty Gear mechanics like a burst and roman cancels being introduced into the game now do you?
(-_-)
damnit.
stop your selfishness already.
fucking turd strikers need to let that parry shit go.
this thread shouldn’t even exist.

158

Are you kidding?
What game are you playing?
Have you looked at the hitboxes for some jump in moves in SFIV?
Have you looked at the active frame data and hitboxes for the known anti-air normals for the Alpha, SF2, and SF3 characters in SF4 and compared them to the hitboxes and frame data for the same characters when they where in SF2, SF3, and Alpha?
Obviously you haven’t. Obviously you don’t know
(-_-)
please do so. For your sake and the sake of SFV, please do so.

159

I don’t know what else to say. If he saved for Super then he wouldn’t have used EX moves which limits his options before using Super. If he did use EX moves he wouldn’t have had the Super to use. Instead of landing Ultra through a fireball for 40% damage, he would have had the option to land EX Fireball for minor damage and knockdown, or Super for 20%ish damage and knockdown.

160

Have you watched EVO, Capcom Cup, or NEC lately? Those matches players dont jump, you will get blown up if you do. You are too busy trying to compared things to the past that makes you see things in absolutes. Just cause in past games it was more dangerous it doesnt mean SF4 is a free for all jump game. If you ever played me in SF4 ill show you how bad jumping is. Ive had plenty of matches vs players that love to jump and by the end of the match they stopped jumping. So it can teach bad mechanics. Ive seen it.

161

Thats what im trying to get at. We dont know what really would of happened with a different system. SF4 has its own unique rules but one thing thats certain when you have a fully stock gauge bar it limits your opponents options.

162

If you are old enough to have played SF1 in arcades then why do you type like a spastic 12 year old?

163

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KS7hkwbKmBM

164

Looks like this thread is about to get locked again… facepalm

165

please tell me you didn’t just post that vid link like its your 1st day here on SRK.
Please tell you didn’t J.D.
lie to me and tell me you didn’t.
This isn’t your 1st day here.
you’re a long time member.
you should know better than that.
sigh
http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m580/Axl_m4ster/picard-facepalm_zps6aab8ca5.jpg
Why God why?
Why do 3rd strikers luv to post that vid up on SRK like no one else has ever posted it before?
Why do they always resort to "that vid."
Why God?
Why do they enjoy making innocent lil’ cherub angels cry with posting up the same played out vid?

166

I honestly think this is better than the Daigo video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HD4WnLq6mV4

167

Can you people please stop giving TheKingOfParody attention

The sf4 forum learned how to do it

I believe in all of you

168

This forum got wacky much faster than I thought it would.

169

the parry mechanic aint coming back.
and its unholy conception that was the focus attack that was also hated by all is also not coming back in V.
thankfully.
since most Street Fighter players hate both.
so you’re all wasting your time even discussing it coming back or even foolishly creating this useless thread.

170

Yep. I’ll be reviewing the posts to see if anyone needs any infractions when I get home in about 8 hours.