115

I just started using her counters like i do with karin so against anyone with a quick reversal i make them scared to use it. Its funny doing her counter on Chun-li ex sbk.

116

I don’t really see the point of a counter for baiting reversals, if you know a reversal is coming, just back off and let it whiff and get a full damage combo rather than exposing yourself upclose for like 180(?)ish damage.

117

or you could back dash or you could do a dive kick and have the dp whiff that way and get a punish from that. Counter is more of a scare tactic imo. You should show it once. You either do it to tell your opponent i can stop your frame traps or our moves won’t work on me on wake up. Other then that use counter sparingly.

118

I counter often when people like to spam reversals. So like 3 reversals is like 400+ of your life gone to counters.

119

Or one bait = 400+ of the opponent’s life with no risk :stuck_out_tongue:

120

Counters should be used strictly to discourage block strings that don’t force guard. Not a move you wanna just throw out there. I ran a set with a euro player on irc and took 900+ (full health kill) away from him in one hit because he just thew that out there.

121

I basically use it on people who just really spam reversals everytime i make a break on my block strings, other wise i CADC off another move to continue some pressure. Its mainly to check if they’ll mash. I also did that because i originally thought lili’s f+mk + f+mp string was +2 on block when its actually -1 on block so i just use counter on people who try to jump in with normals moves other wise its adante or another AA.

122

Lili’s counter is what GLK said. You’d only strictly use it to let your opponent know, HEY stop that shit or as a fear tactic. Fear is important with lili since she’s a heavy momentum base character who feeds on opponents who are afraid to press a button. Your counter is important because it stuffs all offensive base frame traps or wake up moves. If you’re not using counter with lili then you’re making a ton of match ups tougher than they need to be, and this goes for all Lilis. Learn to just sit there and block with lili, this is very important, and figure out the frame trap your opponent likes to do. You have to lead them on and the second they get careless and you make a good read, BAM, counter.

123

The reason I don’t like random counters is because one you have to guess(no reason to do that to yourself) , and two neutral jump blows it the fuck up even if you use the high counter.

124

hence why you would learn your opponents habits. any Lili who just throws out counter for no reason or cause will get what they deserve. Something or a Full ass punish. Our counter isn’t full proof and hardly brain dead. Stupid lilis always end up as dead lilis.

125

I test with her forward string to see how my opponent reacts. If they throw out pokes i can’t counter. Then the next time i know i can just maul them because they are scared.

126

And another thing. You guys are off topic. GTFO of this thread.

127

So been messing about with v.2013 Lili in the lab today. She’s not bad so far, in my opinion she didn’t change too much. Ok I know there’s talk of her re-stands being removed but, meh I never really used those to begin with.

Now about Akuma/Lili since this is the synergy thread.

The damage off of Akuma’s SRK is still present around 480 without gems using the follow-up

:qcb: + :lk: or :mk: > :hk: follow-up > st.:hp: > :qcf: + :hp: > :f: + :mk: > :hp:

However the airborne launcher after the following follow-up.

:qcb: + :lk: or :mk: > :hk: follow-up > airborne target combo :mp: > :hp: > launcher.

No longer connects. It now will whiff which sucks but hey I think there could be another way around it.

I have found that you can do a st.:hp: after aerial target combo: :mp: > :hp: after doing the second follow-up. I don’t believe that this was possible in version 1.07 so I suppose it could be somewhat useful.

Akuma’s SRK isn’t that great for escaping anymore but you can still use the EX SRK to get out safely at the cost of 2 bars provided you have no gems setup beforehand.

Akuma’s other set-ups like :f: + :mp: still work and the team can still juggle together pretty well.
Far St.:hk: hitting crouchers is a pretty good way to get Lili in as well as using :hp: Red Fireball to tag her back in from a tag.

As for Lili to Akuma. She does help him out especially in the Pandora set-up department. You can now use EX :dp:+:2k: > Jump Cancel > Pandora into cl st.:hk: Misogi for Akuma as well as EX :qcb: + :2k: > :hk: follow-up for a decent Akuma aerial juggle.

Akuma’s cl st.:hk: ground-bounce on aerial opponents is good for safe tags after Lili lands a launcher as well. You have enough time to do two cl st.:hk:s in a juggle off of a launcher by CADCing in between each one.

His ground bounce cl st.:hk: also does set up some much better oki. Not sure about damage since I’m still trying to find some more damaging set-ups. Sorry but I was a little too distracted with the new stuff

So far, I suppose it will be feasible to run the team in the order: Lili/Akuma. But I suppose it can be seen as pretty bold because of Lili’s over-reliance on meter to do damage and for mix-ups. Don’t get me wrong though, I’m quite tempted to try it out myself :).

So this is what I found so far. Within a short space of time of messing about in the lab with these two post patch. I hope to try to do a combo video showing applications of their changes.

128

I’m thinking about using Lili/Heihachi myself, think this team would work out well? I notice a lot of Lili players play her as a second, she a no-go as a first?

129

Whilst she can be used as a point character much more effectively than in the previous version, many Lili players prefer to put her in the anchor slot because a lot of her best moves come from using meter e.g. EX Angel Knee ( :dp: + :2k: ) : a ‘DP’ style move which is invulnerable for 13 frames. Goes into EX Angel Knee Ascension which can be jump cancelled for more damage and is one of her viable reversals and EX Sunflower Lance ( :qcf: + :2k: ) : a fast 2 hit overhead which puts you at advantage on block should the second hit connect just to name a few examples. She also needs meter to alpha counter because she isn’t good at taking pressure as well.

However, I don’t wish to force you or anyone else from putting her as a point character. Hell I’m even thinking of switching the order of my Akuma x Lili team myself. She has good AAs to stop jumpers in their tracks as well as good pokes which are made deadlier by her faster walk-speed (which incidentally now out-paces Akuma’s walk-speed now). Her close range game is also pretty good as she can constantly lock your opponent down in the corner with block-string after block-string, shutting down their options.

That said, the Lili/Heihachi team relies on you getting in your opponents’ face A.S.A.P and never letting up. The team can dish out the pressure but they can’t take it themselves, also usage of this team will require a solid knowledge of meter management, wasting meter with these two is not a good idea as they both rely on meter to help them out. Particularly Heihachi if he is being the victim of keep-away strategies. To offset these weaknesses, they both do a lot of damage off of single hit confirms which is only augmented by using meter for either EX moves or Tagging into one another.

130

Well, it’s a good thing that at the very least it sounds do-able, though I can see where the weaknesses come from in terms of meter. It’s good to know about the EX version having 13 frames of invuln to it (I just got the game, don’t know the frame data yet, just trying to get a firm grasp on characters at the moment), and that Sunflower is + on block, was unaware of that.

I’m also really glad they buffed her walk speed, if it weren’t buffed, I honestly probably wouldn’t use her on point, went through the trial mode (Which doesn’t have the 2013 changes I noticed) and it’s quite a bit slower.

Also, I am pretty aware that I will need to be on the offense constantly with my Lili/Heihachi team (Honestly, if you have Heihachi on your team, I can’t imagine it NOT being a team built around never getting off the opponent). In terms of meter management, well, I may struggle at first, but I am usually pretty good with meter managing. I use Gen and Rose in SSF4 and have gotten some decent-ish meter management skills from those two, but only time will tell I suppose. Thanks for the lengthy/nice response, it really does help.

131

I’m thinking about Gief/Lili. Can she be played defensively or is she all about rushdown? Also,her only real reversal is EX Angel Knee, or am I wrong?<div><br><div>Also, do you think this team builds enough meter? I’m a bit spoiled in that department because of my Raven/Dudley and Raven/Lili team I ran since the update.</div></div>

132

Thoughts on Christie/Lili? I’ve been running Christie with Lili anchor but I don’t know if I’m gimping either of their potentials. They are both by far my favourite characters. I figured I’d abuse Christie’s mixups, vortex and good meterless damage.

133

I’m just getting back into fighting games in general, but I was wondering what the Lili community thought of pairing her up with Chun? Tagging Lili in from lightning legs for some ambiguous shenanigans is something I’m gonna be trying out. Is Chun much better as a 2nd, though? I don’t have much to add right now, but Ken/Lili sounds pretty awesome, too.

134

Chun is pretty much one of the best point characters in the game. She is really good on an anchor spot as well but she can provide so much to your anchor it’s almost always better to put her on point unless you pair her with another exceptional point.

And since Lili is really good with meter available to her, Chun/Lili can be a really potent combo.