I dunno. A trailor? T-Shirts? SRKers having a direct hand in something. Like maybe an all star team tourney or something cuz, in reality, this new team thing is fun but means absolutely nothing. There’s little difference between the singles and the team. It’s the same games and the winners of the singles are just going to have some folks ride their coattails for money. Singles OR team makes some sense. This is a “for fun” thing(not that the whole event isn’t for fun. This is just a couple of tourneys that don’t matter). Now, if the format for the games were different like maybe having tourneys with other IN GAME CvS2 formats, the game would be different and the results would be also. I really don’t see how this is better than previous WC vs. EC or USA vs Japan. Those actually had a purpose. At least that’s how I see it. To me, this is done more for the dvd to have more top player footage even if there are plenty of upsets in the singles. There’s really no justifiable reason, competitively, for there to be both team and singles. This is to let more ppl play in tourneys that may only play the 2 most popular games and fives those a chance to shine that, well, may well not shine in singles. That’s part of the point in competition. To me, this makes the both tourneys less intense. It’s second chance time with a top player helping you out.
The new tourneys just don’t add any oomph except for the players involved. I mean, when you can see how good they are in singles? The singles tourney is the serious tourney, imo. This format is the same so, I don’t see any point aside from “Hey, we’re all together, let’s have another tourney!”
Really, the team tourneys are a chance for SRK staff to play a game without playing. They pick everyone. It’s just like picking horses in a horserace. They’ve handpicked what they think to be the best teams to have them compete. I can see Tom whispering to Tragic, “see? I told you I’d come up with a better team!” Really, this isn’t on the level of WC vs EC or USA vs Japan. The only ppl that get bragging rights are those that picked the teams. Oh, and the one member of the team that brought his team to victory that just also happened to place top 3 in singles. Aaaaalrighty then.
Now, if SRK voted on the teams, they would be more involved in the tourney and have more interest beyond those that are actually in the tourneys. As is, it just seems like a game for SRK staff to play.
Just calling it like I see it. I don’t get the “evolution” this year either. Last year, the trailor gets a weak rush job and this year we get no trailor? Is that punishment for complaining about last years’ trailor? Shame on us complainers!!!
Now if you wanna play the stupid “SRK tries to give folks what they want!,” let’s get real. If that were true than the GG players would get their #R tournament. It’s blatantly obvious that that’s EXACTLY what the players want and they proved it with the poll. They got dissed since SRK wrongfully announced an XX tourney first. Regardless of what you say, SRK doesn’t bend for the desires of SRK peeps. Every main decision was done without player input. I didn’t see many polls asking what anyone wanted. I don’t see any evolution this year unless switching to console is the big deal. Appeasing everyone would’ve been evolving. Appeasing one group now, instead of the other, is just change, imo.
I know you don’t want to post seriously anymore but, hey, when you post in response to me like that, you’re just asking for me to be serious:)
Yes, I understand that this is a convention now. They should call the tournament “metamorphosis,” not “evolution.” The tourney didn’t evolve, it just changed into a less serious convention.
Seriously, it would’ve been so easy to use the other in-game formats of CvS2. There’s some purpose there since the dynamics of the game completely change. Nothing changes in the team tourney. But I’ve already gone into that. Still, going console could’ve given them a chance to introduce other formats thus, reinvigorating the games’ scene again.
What’s missing? Trailor, T-shirts, Evolution. That’s what’s missing. Along with your marbles for acting like SRK gave ppl what they wanted because they made more team tourneys when the big deal about last years was WC vs EC and whether Justin lost legitimately. There was no real cry. GGXX#R was a real cry and proof that shit like that gets ignored. Way to add things up there buddy.
Apoc complains that Evo staff didn’t get SRKs opinons about anything. Apoc is full of crap. Explanation follows.
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We had that exact same idea for CvS2. We also had lots of other crazy ideas, like drafting MvC2 characters. Who shot down each and every one of these suggestions? SRK forum posters!
In fact, it is the SRK forum posters who decided the exact format of the team tournaments, by participating in polls and submitting comments.
The SRK forum posters are also responsible for the round robin pools this year, through a poll we had early in the year.
We can summarize this first complain as, “Apoc doesn’t read SRK forums.”
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Wrongo. We pick the captains, and the captains pick their team. You know, the exact same format we used for the 5on5 that no one had a problem with last year. All of this was explained in the original team exhibition thread.
We can summarize this second complain as, “Apoc doesn’t read SRK forums.”
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That is Apoc-branded-bullshit. As tragic said in the #R poll thread, the tournament is XX because you don’t change the rules 3 weeks before the tournament, after people have committed money and vacation time to attend.
I know several players that have a chance to do well in XX and do NOT play #R. These guys have been practicing XX specifically because that’s what the tournament was announced for. If 2 months ago the #R players had organized and held their poll, it would have been easy to switch to #R. That’s enough advance notice to let people make their own decision about whether or not to attend, instead of tricking them into attending an #R tournament by telling them that it’s XX, then switching at the last minute.
Changing to #R now would be like holding a SF3 tournament, but then on the day of the tournament BANNING a character by player vote. Nevermind that you’re totally FUCKING over the players who play that character, some of whom travelled hundreds of miles to attend the tournament. Hey, majority rules right!
Oh wait, didn’t you do exactly that in your Vegas tournament?
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Except for the format of the exhibitions, what exhibitions to hold, and the format of all the tournaments. Wait, what does that leave? Oh yeah, the trailer! Yes, I decided to not do a trailer without player input, because I’m a little busy planning the actual tournament this time around.
Tell ya what. You’re so down with the players and so eager to contribute, you come up with a trailer. You can even put “This is the APOC Evo trailer” in glowing dancing letters along the bottom, so everone knows its YOUR trailer, not the evil SRK people’s trailer, since we don’t really care what any of the players think, except when we’re posting polls to get their feedback and approval on every single tournament format for Evo.
Did you know that pretty much the exact same tournament, 3 on 3 regional, was going to happen unofficially? And they say srk doesnt listen to the forums.
I can fully admit to not reading everything. I don’t believe the moderators do. I can honestly say that if some of these things were discussed in an MvC2 thread(like last years 5on5 being MvC2), I probably missed it.
It’s nice to know that I have my own brand of BS:)
Further, knowing me, at least through my posts, I find it funny that you brought up the 2i ban since I intended for you to. Only funny because you don’t think I made that parallel initially. I just waited for you to bring it up so that I could illustrate the difference. Firstly, that isn’t exactly what happened but the vote was taken on the day of the tourney. This XX poll was made a full month before the tourney. Players, even at this point, can call and cancel their flights in many cases. There could also still be an XX tourney, for them to play in, in the casual room. EVEN NOW a change can be made to appease the majority of the players. Yes, I do believe the majority should decide and THAT was not the flaw of the Vegas fiasco. If I had done a poll and SRK was around then, I would still go by what the players wanted. If the majority thought that Akuma was a skill-less, overpowered character that only served to skew rankings(a la ST Gouki), then I would abide by that just like I abide by the decision to ban Akuma in ST without ever once making a stink. When one person decides, there’s the risk of biasness. If the majority all agree, and only a few disagree, I’m going to appease the majority. The only thing that would make me do a double-take on that would be if the issue affected players like Daigo, coming. Then, I may reconsider. Who knows? But generally, appeasing the majority is the best decision. Especially when the majority are freely giving legitimate reasons for their opinion like in the GG poll thread.
If the majority of players thought that RCing ruined CvS2, I wouldn’t care what Japan did. We can think for ourselves.
As for the round robin poll, that was done after I made a stink about not including players in prior decisions regarding this evo. Whether you intended to before I made a stink, I don’t know. All I know is, until I made that stink, there was no evidence that players had any say in Evo. So, that doesn’t give me confidence in that fact when I had to point it out to everyone before something like that happened. If the poll was done before I made a stink, then I’d give you credit. To me, it looked like damage control due to the order of things. You didn’t want players to think you were thinking “fuck what these fools think!!” and, rightfully so. It was the right thing to do.
Moving along. You pick captains. Why not have separate regions vote? Or maybe you just went by most recent winners, I don’t know. Still, you pick captains and they pick their teams. Their criteria isn’t forced. There could be plenty of teams that are formed without the basis of fairness. Again, this does not illustrate the players deciding. You pick your peeps and they pick their peeps. It’s as simple as that. You’re trying to make it out to be a an SRK made tourney when it isn’t. It’s completely of your design. You can do what you want(obviously) but I’m just saying, don’t make it out to be shit it isn’t. I still suggest you make some all-star teams that SRK nominates and votes for because it’ll be more fun for those who aren’t playing if they had a hand in coming up with their teams. Just a suggestion.
As for the trailor? No one expected you to do it. I thought Tragic did one before. Either way, if you didn’t have the time, it wouldn’t have been hard to ask some folks to make one. You could’ve even made it a contest with a prize. A friend could have just done a favor. I don’t expect you to do everything. The term “Staff” is not lost on me. If I was into video-editing, I would do it. I think it’d be better to ask someone who makes vids already, don’t you? Could’ve asked a year ago even. Why not delegate next years’ trailor to someone NOW. Just a suggestion. I know you could just as easily not have one.
Oh, the t-shirts:p
As far as me being so down and whatever, I’m not the same guy I was. The scene’s taking some turns and I’m reminded of Watson’s words at the end of BTM. While I never was the type to think like that before, I am now. With new games being added and good games being dismissed while no new great games are coming, along with where the focus is going, the scene is changing, not evolving. For me, it’s losing it’s heart and my heart for it is dying. It’s BEEN dying for the last few years. Now, I just don’t see the same heart and integrity that the scene once had.
I mean, you didn’t put that poll up on tourney formats UNTIL after I spit that yall weren’t getting any player input on ANYthing. You can perpetrate the front but, you hadn’t cared what the players thought until it was pointed out to you that it was obvious that you didn’t care. Like a good politician, you posted the poll and I posted there saying that it’s good that you’re doing it that way, NOW. K, I just had to put it straight, I can’t try not to offend you. What were the polls regarding last years tourney? The year before that? Nope. Still looks like damage control while trying to highlight a plus for consoles when everyone is screaming “FOUL.” Nice spin.
Yo, if you really cared what the players thought, you’d have them vote for the games and vote for the teams and the team captains(ALL OF THEM). Not that “captains” mean anything. Not if players decide. If you cared what ppl thought you would’ve done a poll on the format for every game as well as a vote on which games, if any, we all think should be on cabinets. I say that because you said that it wasn’t a financial issue. Just knowing that MOST of the players were upset over the console thing should have lead you to show some kind of sympathy. Perhaps allowing ONE game to be on cabinets that the players could vote on. You would have let them vote on which exhibitions to have. You would have a poll regarding sticks and such. Seriously, you act as if you don’t make all of the decisions yourselves. That’s blatantly untrue aside from this years’ tourney format poll.
Seriously, if you really cared about what the players thought(yeah, Vegas was a fiasco, but don’t act like it doesn’t also illustrate that I walk the walk when saying that I care what the players(majority, not favoritism) think), I wouldn’t feel the way I do about the scene. Folks watch SRK and follow suit. Unity is a must. SRK, being viewed as the leader(Godfathers of SF, remember? Of coooourse you do, big guy:)), picks the direction that MANY follow. SRK helps choose what games ppl play tourneys in as well. If you cared about what players thought, there wouldn’t be anyone viewing SRK as the leader. They’d view SRK as the organizer while knowing every player had a say. SF’s caretaker, if you will. Nowadays, I think that we all know we don’t have any say because we aren’t SRK staff. Heck, I used to view yall and SRK as SF’s caretaker. Forgive me if I feel a lil stab in the back when SF takes a backseat.
It’s just insulting to try and pass off Evo decisions as if they were part of some democracy.
Hey, I can appreciate what yall do. A wacker scene is better than a completely dead scene. I don’t think I should apologize for not agreeing with the cold heart fever that’s going around. I mean, we even have Seth starting mess with A3 players for no reason than to appease his own ego.
The way things are done now, isn’t the way that I remember the scene coming up. I’ve already pointed out that you’re more about numbers than staying true to SF. Yall being the leader, that’s a big change to the SF community right there, for me. I’m all for change but, I’m gonna analyze it first. I would’ve held tourneys for HF back in the day, even if MK had a gazillion more players that would attend and add money to the tourney. Why? HF is a better game. Of course more ppl are going to play the stupider game. More ppl can compete on them. The tourneys are less intense and the respect for the games diminish because it’s clear that the tourney is based on popularity and not quality of the game. Of course, quality can be a subjective term. That’s why I used HF and MK as the example. The quality difference, as far as gameplay is concerned, was rather obvious to all but the youngest kids who played. Even grown up MKers can admit to the blandness of MK.
Perhaps we just back different scenes. You must back the fighting game scene and I back up the SF scene, like you used to. I’m all for expanding my horizons but not for cutting of strong parts. I like the fighting game scene but, SF comes first for me. That’s why I post on SRK and not other game sites because this site is capcom based with a heavy SF influence.
So, I’m not going out of my way for a scene that is no longer being the scene I supported. SF doesn’t come first anymore. I don’t mean parts of SF. I mean ALL SF came first back in the day. Now, parts of SF take a back seat for games that already have their own scene. No matter how you slice it, that’s not loyalty to SF, that’s loyalty to numbers. That type of mentality doesn’t motivate me. SF is kind of the last thing that I wish to remain idealistic about. I still want to keep it in my heart as something special, even it won’t be, anymore. To do so, I have to drift further and further from the scene. Ask anyone around me, I’ve lost all heart regarding tourneys and SF. It’s just been killed for me. You should take delight in knowing that. For all the grief you say I give you, I don’t think you get sad when thinking about the scene. I do, all of the time.
I’m sure your hand is forced and you HAVE to do things the way that they’re being done but, I’d just as soon not do it if I were in the same position. If I couldn’t do it and put SF first, forget it. But that’s me. I don’t expect you to not make compromises.
Still, for a guy like me, the scene was better when it had heart. Now, there isn’t a common heartbeat. It’s like anything that might go mainstream. You’re going to lose half of your original fanbase to bring in a ton more ppl. If SF and tourneys get more mainstream, I’d have to have it go mainstream on its’ own terms without compromise or not allow it to go mainstream at all. I’m not for ripping the insides of something out to make it more suitable for ppl that didn’t love it before. I’m more the type that I’m gonna focus on those that helped things grow before I focus on those that didn’t care to begin with.
See, SF was going to be something that spanned generations, I thought. But look around. The older generation is losing heart, now, AFTER they’ve been in it for years. It’s not because they stopped liking the scene, it’s because they see where it’s going and it makes 'em want to quit.
The way that things are going, you’ll have plenty of younger ppl playing, always. They’ll jet when they get older. I would rather it be something that ppl of all ages would enjoy and be able to compete in. It’s not like boxing where age matters a lot, and it shouldn’t be. But yo, the scene is becoming unrecognizeable to me. It’s the fighting game scene and I’m trying to see the SF scene in the middle of it all and it gets harder and harder to see.
Sorry if you get so urked by what I post, Tom, but, that’s what’s in my heart. My energy for the SF scene has been so drained, I’m just running on fumes posting until it completely dies in me. I’m just kind of trying to fight when I really don’t have any steam left.
The scene’s all yours, man. I know this. Have at it ole boy:) I’m just running around the block until I give out. Our scene(the one that started it all) was clearly the foundation for this scene. I try to catch falling remnants when I can.
Don’t waste your time on me, Tom. I’m not worth it. However, if you feel the need to defend yourself, I understand that. But really, I’m not saying that you’re doing anything bad. I’m saying that I see things as bad. I’m sure to some, this shiet is going just great. Just because I say something sucks doesn’t mean I’m speaking for everyone. I’m never meaning to attack you personally, I do mean to attack certain decisions though. Just as my words are offensive to you, I hope that you can understand that, being in the scene as long as I have, your decisions can offend me. In a way, I’m only trying to defend something I cared about. It’s my way of trying to still care. It just so happens that my weak defense is what offends you. I hope you understand the real intention and know that I’m not intending to undermine you, personally. Although, I’m sure you feel that I do, and that, in the end, is regretable. Hey! You’re the ones that wanted to take the reigns. Who else am I supposed to bitch at?
i can understand where wanting a majority vote comes in, but the cannons and the srk staff have to have some charge. if they left it all completely to the members of srk to make evolution a fuctioning tournament, i have a hard time imagining it being half of what evo2k4 is expected to be.
it’s like at school. a principal runs the school, and yes, he does take student feedback. but think if the principal let all the students make every decision. it’d be chaos and nothin’ would get done.
without the cannons putting a foot down, in a sense and really moving things along, we’d probably still be talkin’ about what sorta’ exhibition we’re gonna’ have or what game’s we’re gonna’ have. i’ve come to realize that when the cannons are involved, shit usually gets done.
not tryin’ to take any sides, 'cause everyone makes good points, but that’s just my view on things.
I agree! If you’re not use to console tournaments I suggest you disconnect that yellow analong button “AKA the DQ button!” Either cut that wire or pull it out. That’s a long way to travel just to get DQ’ed over something you could have fixed before you got to EVO2k4.
Just a random note on the XX crap being talked about. IIRC there acctualy was a thread a couple months ago maybe a bit before about switching to reload for evo, and I remember the majority wanted reload still then as well. Guess that thread musta got lost in teh clutter or just forgoten or something shrug.
This question isn’t about the team tournament, I don’t know where else to ask so I will ask here.
I was wondering if people could bring their custom music edit’s to play on when their turn is up? Like, could I bring mine to play on in the tournament or whatever? I could bring extra copies for evo if you guys want me to. The edit is pretty dope and I’m sure people would like it. Anyways, somebody like inkblot or ponder let me know plz, thank you.
BTW, I made a new edit. It’s not that crappy one people heard at the March Madness tournament here in philly.:o :bluu:
I dont think they let you bring custom music anyways cause its not an “official copy” of the game. I believe it has to be an official copy cause its an “official tournament”. But then again Lloyd Banks is number 1 on the charts so anything can happen.
For the remaining wildcards i say let Vegita-X and Dr.B pick their teams. Maybe they would get a chance. I have to check out Vegita-X’s Rogue i hear its far out!!! Anyone agree?
