If you think he’s going to headbutt, you can always jump back. He has a lot of recovery on whiff. You might be able to jump back and then hit him after you land.
EX Headbutt is almost definitely safe on block against T Hawk. He’s -8 frames on block (Frame data here for T hawk and here for Honda). If T Hawk s.mk, s.mp, s.hp, and cr.mk don’t reach, you can’t punish. You can’t s.hk it on block. You also can’t punish lp headbutt on block with s.hk because it’s -9.
You might be able to EX Condor Spire it on his wakeup.
Are you talking about him doing it as an anti-air or as a reversal? You can’t do much about him doing it as an anti-air at some ranges.
Shoulder doesn’t hit grounded opponents last time I checked it’s air only, unless they changed something. Even if it does, Honda should eat a combo there for maximum damage and stun.
If you’re landing on top or in front of him and he’s still headbutting, then he’s in the air. That’s what I meant. Shoulder has a great hitbox, might beat headbutt clean.
But what are you even saying guys…headbutt is punishable by T. Hawk. You can SPD on block, HP Spire beats any headbutt clean on reaction, Thrust Peak is the better option than cr. lp to stuff headbutts and Ultra 2 does work, too. The guide also says cl. MP works to stuff out headbutts, never tried that though.
Honda is always at frame disadvantage if you block so you can dash up and SPD EASILY.
Why don’t you pick up the guide many people of this forum have been working on so hard:
Dude, what are you trying to say? Do you even play T.Hawk? Just cause it says on the document that headbutts can be blocked and SPD does not make it true. You cannot block and SPD a headbutt (exception, honda against the wall).
You try doing cl.mp to EX headbutt (an invincible reversal) **and see how that works out for you. Show me a video of cl.mp beating EX Headbutt from point blank.
Honda can never be dash SPD’d after headbutt, tons of Hondas will headbutt -> headbutt to catch stuff like this and the headbutt will actually just hit you out of your dash usually. Or he could just cr.lp safely and see if you dash into it and get a hands combo.
You accused me of misreading, I told you what was written in it because you were too lazy to look it up. Fine, it is false information and needs to be changed if this guide gets another update at all, but it’s what it said as I was searching for answers on headbutt. I didn’t say it works, I said the guide says it does. That is all. Do you even play T. Hawk? Don’t give me that bullshit boy, if you come at me with that attitude you can sorta kiss my ass really.
I was just trying to help by posting stuff from the community guide.
@Kikuichimonji: Where did I say it works? I told you about the guide that states it is an option to beat headbutts. Also, we didn’t talk about point blank nor did we talk about just EX headbutts in the first place.
What I am saying is use Thrust Peak. Thrust Peak is EASY to use against headbutts and beats any version free at all ranges. Hands down BEST method if you dont want to risk a jump.
How much invincibility does mp / hp / ex DP have ?
what are the properties of the different condor spires ? at optimal range, what frame advantage am I at ? can I after it if I meaty it somehow ? does EX have invincibility (aside from projectile )
you will never be at a frame advantage when using spire afaik, in fact you will find yourself at a frame DISADVANTAGE on HIT most of the time. spire goes over low attacks, since you are considered airborne and all versions have invincibility for his lower body part. ex spire has additional strike invincibility. normal versions of spire can be focused and you can be thrown out of it because you are not considered airborne from the very beginning of the move. there are frame traps involving ex spire, find them here:
you will want to space spire in a way that makes you land in front of your enemy to surprise them with SPDs or barely touch them so you aren’t wide open for punishment.
ex spire is the only version you can combo into (of a cl mp for example) and it is relatively good pressure when going into it from your strings (c lp c lp lk ex spire for example).
According to the link you sent, wouldn’t H Dp be technically invincible from frames 1-11 total? But that doesn’t sound right…
Also, since he only has upper body strike invincibility, does that mean certain moves with very low hit boxes (juri cr.mk for example) can stuff a dp attempt ? Just curious
To answer your first question, It is…but it isn’t. I know that sounds weird but in the first 7 Frames of Fierce DP T.hawk’s hurt box shrinks down a little bit to make him avoid attacks that hit him in his upper body. After that point (frames 8-11) his hurt box is removed granting complete immunity.
To answer your second question, yes low attacks beat out his Fierce DP but only if they hit you within the first 7 frames.
If you really want to look at the specifics, Hoblino’s hitbox thread is amazing.
Also note that you can be thrown out of all versions before Hawk goes airborne, since they all lack throw invincibility unlike Ryus DP for example.
Now, theres another thing. projectile invincibility, in theory it is there, but the actual window for it to go through is so damn tight and the hitboxes are so meh that you might aswell say it isn’t. Don’t try it.
T hawk can be up to +1 on block on LP/MP Condor spire, up to +0 on HP condor spire, and up to +5 on EX Condor spire, if the spire hits perfectly meaty.