Really… that’s interesting. Don’t mean to be a pain, but would you mind elaborating on that a little? I’m well versed in ST Hawk, but know very little about 4 Hawk (aside some basics). Also, which Hawk(s) would you recommend I vid search for? Eventhubs recently posted like 40 min of Itabashi runnin’ em, but every time I attempt to view it, it crashes as though they no longer exist.
Also, how “spammable” (I hate that term) is the new LK spire? Like, id never just try to do it 15 times and KO, but is it safe enough to, once in a while, bust out 2 or 3 as a mind game? The Japanese commentary made it sound like Spire Spire Spire Spire was the new way to go, but I’m sure that was somewhat tongue in cheek. I’m just curious how close to literal that mayve been. Lol
Well ST Hawk was built around one of best option selects conceived but because in IV everyone can backdash and Hawk’s command throw has a whiff animation, he isn’t the same. In Super-AE-2012, T.hawk had flaws in his design preventing him from playing the way you needed to. Capcom would say Hawk is aggressive, always makes you guess and does big damage. The truth was he couldn’t do these things without guessing himself or putting himself in a high risk situation. Now in Ultra he is still flawed, but that is fine because he is still fun to use and more competitive. He now has a tool that can actually apply pressure, he does more damage (check my reply with new damage). But the best thing now, and this is just my opinion, is he doesn’t have to guess anymore! His new spire is so good people actually respect it. People are now staying grounded out of fear of the spire. Now the opponent is taking a risk every time they jump or press a button, if they block then they are gambling you won’t command throw them at some point, but you don’t need the throw - Spire is killing them blocked or otherwise. His command throw was previously the source of all of his mix ups, with the introduction of delayed wake up that became weaker (early days still but it will get worst). With this added strength to spire and slight nerf to the command throw, what would you prefer to do?
Now, Itabashi is good for learning from as he uses a lot of fundamentals but KOG is where it’s at if you want to be intuitive and read based. Kindevu is worth looking at too. In the end it comes down to if you prefer a patient style or a Yolo style.
The Japanese say spire is the way to play, why not? The move is a ridiculous 9 frame start up (Bison’s LK scissors is 10), it does 120 damage, at max range it can be at least +2 on block. These great things however don’t make spire spam able, it’s still relatively easy to whiff punish but it’s good enough now I don’t need a command throw.
Spire is very good and you get a lot of meter during the match now… I hate the motion change, they should of kept the same motion but with kick. the backward motion allowed it to be used more in a defensive situation.
EX Spire is too good also…
Yea then what? Do you still try to OS back dashes? Or just block and lose all your momentum? Cause ppl been doing delayed wake up, mash dp and it’s irritating me
Learn how to make SPD safe on reversal, it will cut down some of the guessing on your end.Mix this in with tick throws to keep your opponent guessing.
Like Jox mentioned you can always cross up CD from a MP.SPD. Here is a vid Ultradavid posted showing some timings for both safe jumps and cross up CD after MP.SPD, check it out.
Ok was playing a friend tonight and something caught my eye. Keep in mind that I haven’t played SF since '10 so this may be old. He did an EX condor dive, not sure the name forgive me, now normally from what I remember he bounces back after you block it and when it hits. Somehow he was able to land instantly after I blocked it. He was just as surprised as I was as there was no follow up and I know he was too high for it to be considered low enough to cancel as we both saw an extra landing animation there. Can anyone shed light on this for me please?
Frustrating day for me today! Lost almost all my matches and went down to 2200PP from about 2600PP… What can I do against Vega’s Flying Barcelona? He manages to catch me whatever I do! Also, Dee Jay’s Air Slasher -> walk forward -> jump forward and ANY normal beats everything I do. Any suggestions for that would be good. I couldn’t decide which Ultra to use against Bison. U2 seemed like the best choice, but they baited the punch version of the down-charge move making me think they were going for the kick version. Also lost to a Guile, but that’s because I was getting REALLY frustrated by the amount of turtling. Guess I need to revise my general strategy against charge characters.
Charge characters are always gonna be shit for Hawk. With Vega at least, you just have to stay on him and don’t let up. He has awful wakeup options, so take advantage of that. If he’s late with the wall dive, then you can wakeup FA > dash and punish, although I’m not sure how much time you’ll have (it’s been a while since a Vega got a dive on me).
DeeJay’s tactic you described is something that you just have to block. Pay attention to what he does though, and surprise him with EX Spire through the Slasher to get him to stop doing it so often. Other than that…just have patience.
I don’t have any strategies for Bison because I’ve only ever beaten bad Bison players LOL
They’re tough but I’m starting to somewhat figure it out.
DeeJay- Never jump in on him, his hey hey hey hey kicks ruin the lp spd vortex. You can not do anything about his slide besides focus through it. His slide even destroys condor spire. Don’t jump besides neutral jump. Lots of ground to cover. Try to corner him and sweep him but that slide… nothing you can do
Vega- Good luck, very tough to punish but he has low stun.
Guile is tough too. He can punish the blocked condor dive easy. At least you can EX spire through his fireballs easily. Keep him close but keep the flash kick in mind. Don’t jump at him, he can air grab you and grab your during condor dive and spire.
Bison- His kick normals WRECK hawk. A tad safer with jumping in. Bison is known for that rushdown pressure. Think of a sumo match, push him out of the circle. You can do it sometimes, when you knock him down they like to teleport their way out a lot. He also likes to grab you a bit so get the techs ready.
Yeah going through slumps is common with hawk at least for me. I jumped from 5000PP to 4200PP. Damn bad matchups and scrubby play by me.
Thank you, Mr. Beef and Jox_in_a_Box. I’m sure your tips will come in handy in my following encounters with them. I got so mad today that I almost quit playing the game altogether. I’ll try my luck again tomorrow.
Nah, If you input SPD a certain way and your opponent does a reversal you’ll be safe.
There are multiple ways to do it, one way is to input a :hcb: wait a few frames :ub: +:lp:
another way is to input a :360: end with :db: then input with punch (This method must be done from a dash,jump,or normal)
Find one you find comfortable doing and learn it,it will help you out a ton.
When Hawk Ex Condor Dives at good spacing he’ll be able to land instantly next to the opponent. He is -1 or even on block but it’s a hit box thing - so it’s not consistent. I will say though, after practise a Hawk player can make an educated guess as to the correct spacing.
I say this too much but… Thrust Peak. Fastest anti air you have, might lose to early claw swipes but then you can focus those.
Use U1. It punishes slide and badly spaced scissors. It can also punish head press and empty devils reverse when you backdash at the last moment. Bison doesn’t have any reason to jump so opportunities to use U2 will rarely come up.