Daemos
3201
Am I the only one who finds Matt Dahlgren’s echoing comments on how the game is “very well balanced” and how they have “a lot of data that says the match ups are fairly equal across the board” to be ALARMING?
It was known about since the very first Beta just like the Kara throw but they didn’t remove it. It is like 70% of why i personally find that character interesting and fun to use, She is so much more fun now opposed to the plain old Chun.
Chun was definitely supposed to have this kind of pressure. It was alluded to even as far back as omega sf4 where they gave her a dive kick. You can tell it was on their minds.
She’s not even op.
As for Cammy, she’s probably gonna have more success post evo. Just a hunch.
If they were going to remove IALL they would have done so during the beta. It was known about during beta 1 and they already applied a “fix” to it. They made the hurt box on air legs bigger and lessened the frame advantage on hit so you can only link into a light. Then later on during the beta they applied other nerfs to her like suddenly giving her the worst throw range in the game.
I think that solidifies that they intend her to have it and just work her around other weaknesses instead.
If chun didn’t have Iall she might be kinda mediocre
I doubt that. Her normals are still stupid good. If IALL wasn’t in low level Chun players might actually figure out that b.hp is fucking godlike instead of wasting their time fucking IALL up.
deleye
3207
Chun is fair as fuck for a top tier, Only change I would make is no IALL on neutral jump.
they will butcher mika though.
Frost
3208
IALL isn’t the be-all-end-all, I have no idea why people think that. It’s just very easy to apply and works kinda like a flowchart that requires you to react accordingly. Chun can just go cr.lp - st.mp(confirm) - IALL on block. If it hits, confirm into cr.mk xx m.sbk. Simple formula and probably carries a lot of Chun’s through their matches.
Now Chun without IALL? Still good, maybe not S+ tier like I think she is now but her buttons are really really good. I’d want more throw range without IALL for sure.
She wouldn’t have the pressure or damage to keep up.
Its the same problem sf4 chun had. Bad damage output, great normals.
That’s not a good character. Rose on the other hand has great damage output. No wonder she was more viable.
She isn’t S+ Tier. It’s hard to say that there was an S+ Tier in Marvel 3 so definitely not going to be one in a game as honest as SFV. If she was S + Tier you wouldn’t have even asked for a buff if they removed IALL. Asking for extra throw range if they remove IALL just goes to show that she is a bit fair.
Yeah I plan to make Ibuki my new main any way just from what I’m seeing with her. In this game getting damage really quickly is more important than even your neutral game and Chun Li is one of the poorest characters at converting mid range hits into damage. Either have to have full super or VTC off a button into EX legs or c.MK for heavy scaling. Chun players always end up burning EX meter just to get a conversion off a mid range c.MK. Which the damage is just not worth it for the meter you burn.
You can just win a round so much quicker with a one/2 meter Karin or Nash than you can with Chun. Just not worth it to play neutral that long vs characters that will make you pay quicker and push you to the corner faster.
For a top 3 character she also has some of the poorest anti projectile options. She actually has to deal with fireballs which is just a waste of time in a game where so many other characters can just shit on them and land damage/knockdown on any read. Just not worth the effort trying to slide and V Skill over fireballs all day, then just get anti projectiled or jumped on whenever you throw yours.
She also has a really slow jump which means she can’t take as well advantage of the current meta of jumping forward with heavy normals and cross ups into combos. Jumping is a legit strategy in SFV and you have to be able to take advantage of it IMO to be one of the best characters. It basically gives you a free large damage or cross up opportunity if the opponent doesn’t AA correctly and AAing is tough enough in this game where it’s very viable. Jumping is also one of the best ways to beat fireballs and her regular jump and V Skill are both too telegraphed to make them viable for regularly jumping over them. Further adding to her issue against fireballs.
Ibuki has walk speed comparable to Karin or Cammy while also having a ton of anti projectile options (probably the most in the game), a HK command dash which is basically a better version of Chun’s V Skill for setting up jump ins/cross ups/projectile avoidance and has the only other safe on block overhead that unique to Ibuki herself can always combos on hit. Meaning people will be standing up a lot to avoid damage from Ibuki. She also looks to have some really solid buttons which makes her a pretty complete package neutrally. Unless something is horribly off with her frame data, it looks like you get the pressure game like a Ken or Nash, but with the footsies/walk speed of a Cammy or Karin.
Chun would be number 1 if the game played as “fundamentally” as it sounds, but in high level play people are dashing in and jumping in with buttons into high damage and saving meter for high damage super confirms. Something Chun just isn’t as good at doing as other characters.
You would think they would love b.hp. I think its not used because IALL is just a cool tool to use.
Chun already has multiple other ways to alter her damn jump arc outside of neutral iall.
fuck that move when you consider it with her walkspeed and her ridiculous normals.
I say nerf that braindead tool by fixing the input delay at the least
This match goes to show that IALL is a lot easier to AA than people realize. You can literally just throw your standing or crouching AA button in advance and it’s still pretty reactable
Nuckledu just took advantage of how much better of a dash and jump arc Nash has to set up dash and jump in buttons into big damage. Chun just can’t force that same level of burst damage. Nuki had to regularly respect those fireballs and generally had way more trouble getting around them than a Karin, Cammy or Ken would have.
Yeah the move is just so easy to deal with, hit it cr.lp or whatever after being completely tunnel visioned on countering it. Successful? Cool you got 30-40 damage. Unsuccessful? Full combo and complete turnover of momentum
It’s hard to be unsuccessful considering how easy it is to react to. Even if they do a perfect IALL if you’re looking for it you can catch it. Nuckledu almost never got hit by IALL. If you’re that scared you can just block and it’s not like Chun has the best mix up in the game where just taking a tick setup or whatever is gonna kill you.
I’m not saying I personally want anything nerfed, and I agree that the game has good balance.
I’m saying knowing the track record, seeing it done the same way like 5 times, I know what’s gonna happen. I have no reason to believe anything else. In fact I’ve never seen any game shoot for “balance”, FG or not, and not nerf things.
It’s the same way I know there’s going to be a Super/Ultra version update for SFV.
Dime
3217
As a chun that tried to abuse this move as much as possible, it isn’t as godlike as you think. On block it pushes chun way out of range of any mixup so it being plus 2 isn’t a huge thing. On ch it’s cc floats so the only meaningful damage is metered and not that much or from super.
The move becomes better in v trigger but still, it’s theory fighter great, game wise though it’s just not that great. Probably it’s best attribute is its white damage into cr.mk kikoken which does a surprising amount of white damage and pumps up chuns next dash in mixup/poke.
Upcoming changes for Gief (maybe):
Lariat sucks in opponents allowing for it to combo from lights at range, similar to how other grapplers can combo (Alex jab jab elbow, Mika jab jab peach, for example).
Lariat has better hitboxes. As it stands now they do not even extend past his fists when he spins. Hitboxes disappear when his arms are perpendicular to the stage floor now for some reason.
V-trigger increases walk speed similar to, but slower than, Birdie when he is in V-trigger.
Combo to V-trigger from mediums, not just counter hit medium.
Take slightly less damage, recover white life slightly faster when absorbing hits with V-skill.
I’d be pretty satisfied with these changes and do not think they are game breaking. I’d love to see combo ex spd, faster walk speed overall, a bit more health (I happen to disagree that him and Birdie have the same HP), and CC cr.hp launcher too but I have a hard time seeing this laundry list being added for Gief.
Maxman
3219
Can Ken achieve dmg output higher than Ryu ?
Probably with a V-Trigger cancel and with his damage boosted uppercuts but I don’t think he can without VT. Ryu has stupid high metreless damage.
