All these buffs are crazy talk. All I think she needs is stand jab to not missing on all crouching opponents. Would improve her BnB/Pressure/Damage. Also, a faster walk speed would help with footsies.
If her cr.mk was really 5 frames then she is actually able to combo into it from far.mp or crouching mp on counterhit which would lead to almost too much damage (around 250 from counterhit + fadc for even more). So yes it is too much to be likely in my opinion.
On the other side a standing jab would just look retarded if it would hit on crouching blanka or Vega. But personally I wouldn’t mind giving s.lk 1 frame more on hit. I can actually do the 1 frame link now yet I don’t want to rely on it either online or offline but then again it is a personal problem. It is not like its impossible to do
actually i was thinking about this very thing for a while now.
i think her backdash is booty.
what i’d like is this.
change the animations for it completely from a backflip to a slide that covers more ground. when i mean slide, i don’t mean a hakan type slide, but more of a MJ thriller slide…if you can imagine that. but not slow of course.
so if she’s facing right with her left leg up she should take a very deep step back with her left foot and then go back to her stance at where her left foot was planted. this motion will cause her to sorta do a 360 degree body turn back into left leg raised stance. if you can imagine what i’m saying.
this move should be fast though and one fluid motion and it should cover about half the distance that her forward dash does. she would be more vulnerable that she is now in where she ends up after the backdash due to her having to switch back to standing on her right leg but right now her backflip doesn’t cover any ground.
chun and rose backdashes are godlike but juri seems to always get caught with any type of attack with her backflip.
well anyway, thats what i would like. a backdash that covers more ground and is faster. coz juri has to lower her right leg down to backflip and that is A)time consuming aka slow and B)ends up not covering any ground.
at least with a slide back it’ll be A)faster and B)covers more distance…even if her switching back to stance leaves her vulnerable due to the time consumption of having to switch her standing foot from left to right again.
give me that and keep her walk speed the same.
screw what i just said, lets just have her hop backwards like jhun hoon when he has his left leg raised stance while facing right…why make it complicated. also…
i would not mind a new extra special move like jhun’s ax kick that like jhun’s…hits like an overhead. just to open up turtlers like the charged characters that are always turtling.
thank you.
First, something like actual invincible start up on EX pinwheel is not crazy talk.
Second, haven’t you ever heard the expression “the squeaky wheel gets the grease”?
If everyone goes into the feedback thread and says, “Juri’s pretty ok, maybe one more frame please?” then Capcom’s going to go, “I guess Juri’s pretty ok. Better give her some token nerfs for good measure.” Meanwhile the people yelling that Sagat has to win majors or they’ll set themselves on fire in the street and the people insisting Balrog needs a fast, safe, armor-breaking overhead and maybe a command throw will be getting some nice buffs for their characters.
Start negotiations by asking high.
I have always thought the backdash should cover more distance as well!
THANK YOU!!!
Here’s my list. The first half are basically “fixes” that have mostly already been mentioned. I’d like to especially say that I cannot condone any buffs to far mk, as it’s already one of the most godlike normals in the game. You can stuff Honda’s headbutts, Blanka’s balls, Dictator’s psycho crushers and scissor kicks, Zangief’s green hand, most fireball startups, damn near anything with this move if you’re spaced properly. I’m praying that nobody decides it’s too good, to be honest.
Absolutely critical:
-
Extend the hitbox of fireball store forward horizontally. Most of Juri’s normals are unsafe on block up close and need to be cancelled into a store to be safe, but this whiffs a lot and we get punished anyway.
-
Fix lk pinwheel being -8 on block vs crouchers. Either extend the hitbox of the second hit downward vertically, or increase the blockstun of the first hit.
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Fix ex pinwheel trades leaving Juri at a ridiculous negative frame advantage. This requires more hitstun on the first hit of ex pinwheel, but it should still be less than the second hit has.
-
Extend the hitbox of st lp downward horizontally a bit. It shouldn’t hit all crouchers, but right now it only hits 7 out of 39 characters. Half would be nice.
Important:
-
Give regular ex pinwheel invincible frames through the first or second active frame. We don’t mind trading, but getting outright stuffed is just stupid. Speaking of which…
-
Improve the hitbox / hurtbox on ex pinwheel so that simple jumping normals don’t beat it. Zangief can headbutt us right out of it, for one example.
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Fix ex counter moving relative to the direction you are facing. It should move right if you’re holding right. We’re spending a meter on a reversal that does no damage, at least make it work the way everyone thinks it should.
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Allow ex pinwheel to hit grounded opponents behind Juri. Just the two existing hits. Rufus’s elbows can catch people behind him in his U1 but Juri’s spinning legs of death pass right through people??
Please?:
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Reduce startup of all counters to 1 frame. Like someone else said, SFxTK has this and it’s definitely not broken even without the armor break mechanic.
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Fix far hk in FSE whiffing completely on crouchers. Just give it the same hitbox it has outside of FSE.
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Fix cl mp in FSE having slower startup than outside of it. This is just a minor irritation really.
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Allow the different angles of ex divekick outside of FSE. Right now whoever spent time making this move might as well have been asleep instead, it’s an utter waste.
Not that important, but would be nice:
-
I must admit, far mp being special cancellable would be amazing.
-
Cl hk needs… something. It has almost no use right now. Maybe make the second hit special cancellable.
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It would also be nice if fireball store had 1 or 2 more active frames. It has 6 currently. Yun’s palm has 10 and had 15 in original AE, for comparison.
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Ultra 2 should hit on both sides as well as directly above Juri. I don’t think it needs any frame buffs, I just hate animations that have really different hitboxes.
Absolutely critical:
- Extend the hitbox of fireball store forward horizontally. Most of Juri’s normals are unsafe on block up close and need to be cancelled into a store to be safe, but this whiffs a lot and we get punished anyway.
Agree.
- Fix lk pinwheel being -8 on block vs crouchers. Either extend the hitbox of the second hit downward vertically, or increase the blockstun of the first hit.
Not critical at all. While it would be nice - it’s not really important unless you want short pinwheel to be entirely safe on block so we can use it to end a blockstring.
- Fix ex pinwheel trades leaving Juri at a ridiculous negative frame advantage. This requires more hitstun on the first hit of ex pinwheel, but it should still be less than the second hit has.
It would be nice, but I don’t care personally. Learn to armour pinwheel.
- Extend the hitbox of st lp downward horizontally a bit. It shouldn’t hit all crouchers, but right now it only hits 7 out of 39 characters. Half would be nice.
Not really important either, but would be nice I guess.
Important:
- Give regular ex pinwheel invincible frames through the first or second active frame. We don’t mind trading, but getting outright stuffed is just stupid. Speaking of which…
Same answer as previous ex pinwheel.
- Improve the hitbox / hurtbox on ex pinwheel so that simple jumping normals don’t beat it. Zangief can headbutt us right out of it, for one example.
Same.
- Fix ex counter moving relative to the direction you are facing. It should move right if you’re holding right. We’re spending a meter on a reversal that does no damage, at least make it work the way everyone thinks it should.
**I’m pretty sick of seeing this to be honest. It’s all relative to where someone is above you. The same thing happens when you try to dash out of certain setups… you get the wrong dash or dash the wrong way. Learn to adjust.
**
8. Allow ex pinwheel to hit grounded opponents behind Juri. Just the two existing hits. Rufus’s elbows can catch people behind him in his U1 but Juri’s spinning legs of death pass right through people??
Meh.
Please?:
- Reduce startup of all counters to 1 frame. Like someone else said, SFxTK has this and it’s definitely not broken even without the armor break mechanic.
XT is a different game. This would make her un-safe jumpable and for 0 expenditure too. Broken buff.
- Fix far hk in FSE whiffing completely on crouchers. Just give it the same hitbox it has outside of FSE.
Don’t need it.
- Fix cl mp in FSE having slower startup than outside of it. This is just a minor irritation really.
Agree.
- Allow the different angles of ex divekick outside of FSE. Right now whoever spent time making this move might as well have been asleep instead, it’s an utter waste.
Broken buff. she would be 6-4 or 7-3 against every character with a fireball purely because even at full screen they couldn’t throw one for fear of eating stupid damage.
Not that important, but would be nice:
- I must admit, far mp being special cancellable would be amazing.
Agree. It’s either this OR the hitbox adjustment on store though, for me.
- Cl hk needs… something. It has almost no use right now. Maybe make the second hit special cancellable.
Doesn’t need anything. Heaps of characters have somewhat useless normals.
- It would also be nice if fireball store had 1 or 2 more active frames. It has 6 currently. Yun’s palm has 10 and had 15 in original AE, for comparison.
It’s fine. Only the hitbox is the problem.
- Ultra 2 should hit on both sides as well as directly above Juri. I don’t think it needs any frame buffs, I just hate animations that have really different hitboxes.
I guess, yeah.
I want it to work the way it seems like it should. -4 at the right range could be somewhat safe, much like Rose’s soul spiral (-4 to -8 on block depending on strength). I do not want this move to be safe up close.
Number of times I’ve seen armor cancelling used in high level play: 1. I appreciate that she has the ability, but that shouldn’t be used as an excuse to leave other things in obviously poor shape. Ex pinwheel basically sucks as a reversal. If it was only meant as a combo ender then why did they bother giving it any invul frames at all??
The problem is that it makes no sense. If you’re in the corner and use lp counter against a crossup, you move out of the corner. If you ex counter and hold away from the corner, you zoom right back into it. Changing it to work the way everybody expects is not going to hurt anything and is definitely worth asking for.
Ryu, Ken, and Akuma would like to talk to you about this new move. It costs no meter, can’t be safejumped, has invul frames overlappinig the active frames, and does damage. Kasatushi just lets you run away, until you get predictable, then it lets your opponent get a free throw or combo. Getting this along with ex counter and ex pinwheel fixes would be greedy though. I’d prefer those get fixed instead.
I think FSE should have all the normal buffs she got outside of it. Granted that some of them may not matter that much, but as a situational “mode” ultra FSE should not have a downside.
Well, that’s a fair point, it might be too good against fireballs. I just hate to see moves go to waste.
Anyway, I don’t think we need a really good ex pinwheel AND really good counters. But one or the other needs to be fixed so we have a good reversal. This idea that a good reversal is something rare to be protected from the majority of characters is just dumb. Ex pinwheel with all the buffs I mentioned would still be one of the slowest reversals in the game, easily safe-jumpable. Counters always lose to empty jumps, do no damage, and on whiff they don’t even put you in the air like a DP. Call me crazy, but I want Juri to be high-tier. Not S+, maybe low A or high B instead of her mid/low B she is now. And we’re going to be working against all the people who have no idea how to play against Juri and so will be asking for stupid ridiculous nerfs just because they don’t know the matchup at all. Please try to keep that in mind, especially those of you who are better-known players, because your opinions will probably have more sway.
I wouldn’t mind this either but it is indeed not something which I would consider critical
You don’t need it ? Well I bet you enjoy teleporting straight into the corner because it is impossible to say in certain situations if its a crossup or not. Gen for example has a crane j.mk fake crossup / crossup setup in the corner where he always hits behind but depending on how late he presses the button its either crossup or non crossup. And to be honest there is a good amount of situations where you end up teleporting into someones face because you guessed wrong. It has nothing to do with adaptation but rather with: Shit I hope I guessed right. So in the end WHY should I even spend a bar for getting out of the situation when the outcome is most likely the same if block/get hit ?
Agree with 11. but are you actually aware of how far.hk can be used as a frametrap with fireballs and other normals inside of fse ? I am pretty sure you are yet as it looks you don’t want to capitalize on it. It is not a major buff which would make her broken but just another tool to add to her arsenal. Why the fuck not ?
It just doesn’t make sense to me why you don’t want some more buffs. She is good as she is right now ? Well let’s wait for the update. She doesn’t rely on most buffs requested here yet it would make her a bit more enjoyable to play. Also it really seems like you don’t really consider that other characters might even get a few good buffs. WHY shouldn’t we demand at least buffs which would make her more enjoyable to play instead of requesting totally broken bullshit (the makoto feedback made me laugh).
Nice post, I agree with many suggestions.
Different angles of ex divekick is something I’ve been pondering about. But how many EX moves in the game have different properties? Juri’s EX fireballs is all I can recall at the moment. So, maybe it would be too good though I share your thoughts on the move.
Speaking of EX fireball, like others and myself have said before, I wish it wasn’t so feeble. And why do they have to be different? LK MK fireball trajectory is long and fast, MK HK fireball trajectory is so short and slow. Why?
give EX divekick the ability to control each hit, like regular divekick.
LK pinwheel buffs ><
This is all my opinion. In the end, I think the biggest buff Juri could get will come from other characters nerfs. Especially the ones with insane Oki.
Things I want for Juri:
Far st.MP: Make it Special Cancel-able. This is such a good button in SFxT in that it stops her Fireball Store from whiffing in a lot of situations. It would also become an even more effective counter poke tool. As it is now, it’s only Super Cancel-able.
cl.MP: Should stay 3f start up while U1 is active.
st.LP: Make it hit crouching opponents. Gives her a more reliable BnB.
**EX Pinwheel: ** Fix the way this thing trades.
Fireball Store into Ultra 2: Make this work on the whole cast mid-screen.
Lk Fuhajin: Less push back. This one I’m not 100% sure about. It would make fuhajin combos work on everyone mid- screen, but then she’d have no reason to use meter. It works in SFXT because she has to work on two lifebars, but in SF4 it might be too much.
You must not be reading the Rufus thread where they’re complaining about st.hp whiffing on one character.
Can someone explain what armored pinwheel is?
You can cancel Juri’s EX Counter into her other specials. This gives you the armor of the EX Counter applied to whatever move you cancel into. It only cost 1 bar, even if you cancel EX Counter into another EX Move.
You have to input the second special before the teleport begins.
you must be too busy still trying to use stand jab on the whole cast and whinging when it doesn’t work, rather than realising it’s virtually useless anyway and learning to utilise other, better things.
like i said, it would be nice to fix some buggy things with her - but things like this aren’t really pivotal to her game… therefore bringing it up isn’t really a priority. there are plenty of other, more important things at hand that could really do the character some good without really changing where she sits in terms of tiers too much - which imo is exactly what should happen.
I’m able to deal with it but personally never knew what CAPCOM was thinking when they made her counter 4 frames on startup. Why not 2 or even 3 frames? But other than that I only want to see a buff on her footsie game. Everything else is extra; just icing on the cake. BUT… I am a big guy so I like me some icing on cake. 
Just giving her a faster walk speed would improve her game immensely. She would have a real solid ground game and not be so easily bullied by heavier footsie characters (players).
After reading some suggestions, like Ryan Harts’s suggestions for Sagat, let’s not be afraid to NOT be conservative here. Put out your ideas, let Capcom brainstorm with them.