SSF4 Makoto Thread: Return of the Mak!

mogwaimon · 2010-04-12T13:03:00.000Z

Wow, guys, I hibernate a bit waiting for Super and dreaming of finally being able to main a character I like in the SFIV series and now I come to check on things and it’s all doom and gloom, haha…

How could Ono fuck it up this badly?Damn, man. She was beastly in 3, yea, but you had to put a shitload of work into her to get to that level, she was never a character you can just pick up and go 10-0 without ever using before. I can understand having to translate a character into a different system doesn’t always work well, but shit…

Ah well, I’ll still main her. I don’t give a fuck, haha, I like her so I’ll take her as far as I can go with her. Besides, who knows, she may pull a Viper and start off mid and somehow end up near the top. That’s the optimism kicking in, though =P

Antihippy · 2010-04-12T13:11:26.000Z

otter:

thats what people said about Ryu for awhile and then it became all about the super. I think this is a similar situation in the sense that both their ex moves dont open up any new options, they just add a little damage to the existing ones. people are overestimating random ex hayate so far.

if you can save up a super, your opponent will understand that eating one hayate equals supercancel into knockdown + oki. which gives you a better chance of landing a karakusa while you have that meter stocked because they have to hit less buttons.

I dunno really. Ex hayate being super fast, ex oroshi having some kind of invincibility, and ex karakusa having armour seem alot more enticing to me.

Then again I mained sakura in SF4. :lol: Gotta burn that EX to get anywhere really.

Stay_Crispy · 2010-04-12T13:24:37.000Z

otter:

thats what people said about Ryu for awhile and then it became all about the super. I think this is a similar situation in the sense that both their ex moves dont open up any new options, they just add a little damage to the existing ones. people are overestimating random ex hayate so far.

I actually don’t remember anyone ever saying that about Ryu. He was the only character people would say actually would use his super. Plus, Ryu is a much more versatile character that Makoto is. He NEVER needs to depend on EX and his ability to build meter is rivalled only by Sagat and Akuma.

Makoto is definitely going to NEED to be using EX chops regularly. EX axe kick and EX hayate will be mandatory for certain match-ups where she struggles to get in and needs to knock the opponent back into the corner.

So far, EX karakusa seems useless. I’m going to test if it somehow has a kara that only works with the EX version. You never know.

These things will be much more useful that a 4 meter over glorified FADC

The_Mullah · 2010-04-12T13:31:18.000Z

i think ex kara is very useful, people dont meaty with armour breakers normally, and its good for crouch techers/jab mashers like chun/boxer. all her ex moves are good except ex tsurugi, imo. iirc i did an ex tsurugi to break someone focus and it wasn’t deep enough to hit twice, if i didn’t imagine it (its day one so phantom sightings are common) then its crap.

wtf i can’t edit out the jab techers bit above, new srk is so bugged.

v-ryu · 2010-04-12T13:48:14.000Z

i think EX tsurugi just before landing will be good as anti-throw (like cammy or viper). You cannot do big combo after, but opponent will think twice before mashing tech-throw when you land.

do you think that (in corner) EX hayate -> FADC -> U1 works?

can anyone try the combos i posted in the “theory combo” thread?

LuMaLo · 2010-04-12T13:53:17.000Z

Why do people keep saying “IF kara karakusa is in”… it IS in, it has already been confimed, it is done with f.lk, and u can see it in Sharins videos.

What is so hard to understand about that?

v-ryu · 2010-04-12T14:34:39.000Z

because Sharin’s video is not the final build of the game. And things change…

in zak’s makoto video, he does EX hayate (guard) -> karakusa.
Karakusa throws VERY far (like it absorbs dudley crLP (or MP, dont remember).

this move is so strange.

@mullah:
does 2MP (no counter)-> EX hayate works?

because 2MP option select (EX) hayate is a great tool.

Negro_Ninja · 2010-04-12T14:41:28.000Z

How do you option select the hayate ?

The_Mullah · 2010-04-12T14:42:26.000Z

yeah it works. ex hayate is faster than mp and hp hayate (startup) i think.

kara is in.

karakusa range isn’t great but its not bad, the problem is that most normals put you out of karakusa range and on dash makoto is popped an inch away from the opponent (sfiv system for you) so its very easy for them to walk out of range.

Antihippy · 2010-04-12T14:44:05.000Z

v-ryu:

because Sharin’s video is not the final build of the game. And things change…

in zak’s makoto video, he does EX hayate (guard) -> karakusa.
Karakusa throws VERY far (like it absorbs dudley crLP (or MP, dont remember).

this move is so strange.

Wait wait wha-

What are these videos?

v-ryu · 2010-04-12T14:51:40.000Z

Negro_Ninja:

How do you option select the hayate ?

2MP -> 236+PP

if opponent gets hit by 2MP, hayate goes out. If not, it doesnt.

I thought about stand MK -> OS EX hayate too, but not that great, because if opponent jumps and gets hit by stand MK…EX hayate will go out too

you can do it to beat back dash too. After a karakusa or on wakeup, it will be good
stand MP -> delay a bit -> hayate.

if:

stand MP hits or guarded, hayate wont come out (because of delay), but you can see the hit, and confirm with another MP -> hayate for a 3 hit combo
stand MP whiff (back dash), hayate comes out and punish the back dash

That’s the same way i do against viper, with gouki, in vanilla.

link string -> 2MP option select shoryuken.
If viper gets hit (or guard) 2MP, the shoryu doesnt come out. If she does burning kick (0 frame startup to avoid throw), my 2MP whiffs, and the shoryu punishes her.

@antihippy:
[media=youtube]4bNC7W_tepc&playnext_from=TL&videos=rm7Wd-Fp7Co[/media]
@2min20. Oh, and it was not EX hayate, but normal hayate…

The_Mullah · 2010-04-12T15:10:17.000Z

v-ryu:

2MP -> 236+PP

if opponent gets hit by 2MP, hayate goes out. If not, it doesnt.

I thought about stand MK -> OS EX hayate too, but not that great, because if opponent jumps and gets hit by stand MK…EX hayate will go out too

you can do it to beat back dash too. After a karakusa or on wakeup, it will be good
stand MP -> delay a bit -> hayate.

if:

stand MP hits or guarded, hayate wont come out (because of delay), but you can see the hit, and confirm with another MP -> hayate for a 3 hit combo

stand MP whiff (back dash), hayate comes out and punish the back dash

That’s the same way i do against viper, with gouki, in vanilla.

link string -> 2MP option select shoryuken.
If viper gets hit (or guard) 2MP, the shoryu doesnt come out. If she does burning kick (0 frame startup to avoid throw), my 2MP whiffs, and the shoryu punishes her.

@antihippy:
[media=youtube]4bNC7W_tepc&playnext_from=TL&videos=rm7Wd-Fp7Co[/media]
@2min20. Oh, and it was not EX hayate, but normal hayate…

i can’t view youtube at work but if its the same vid i saw yesterday i believe in that vid mak grabbed dudleys cr.lp startup as it extended his hitbox, the normal karakusa wont grab after a hayate but most defo will with kara kara.

Fulaani · 2010-04-12T15:53:18.000Z

FreddyL0c0:

so let me get this straight
karakusa is straight up garbage. my opponent can either jump straight up, back dash, reversal special thus breaking my ex armor property, mash jabs or simply grab me and gets to punish ME for attempting it…oh and i get no range…hum sounds like Fei Long’s command throw

Arc-rail:

Sounds like Karakusa in 3s

Yeah, that does not sound like 3s karakusa at all.

Arc-rail · 2010-04-12T16:10:12.000Z

Eh, you can theoretically get jabbed/reversaled out of it, they can backdash or jump to avoid it. Maybe it was harder to punish but if someone was really set on not getting grabbed, they wouldn’t. That’s all I was trying to say.

More or less, I don’t expect people to test you with neutral jumps very often. That’s an expensive guessing game for an opponent to play, with the weak jumps in this game and the new fukiage being made for that niche even if the move is questionable otherwise.

moe5000 · 2010-04-12T16:59:15.000Z

Mullah thank you for being the first person to whoop some ass wit makoto

gen · 2010-04-12T17:05:19.000Z

from what i’ve seen, post hayate, neither HP fukiage or EX fukiage has the range to punish neutral jump??? am i wrong? i haven’t seen it yet, anybody got a vid?

The_Mullah · 2010-04-12T17:09:21.000Z

hp fukiage should, and kara hp fukiage defo would

The_Mullah · 2010-04-12T17:11:14.000Z

hp fukiage should, and kara hp fukiage defo would

i might have whooped even more ass (but not against hoys vega hes too good, nor tamana’s honda, he’s too solid) had the tvs not been so laggy. i hope the 12 win streak was uploaded before hoy took me off.

oblivioner · 2010-04-12T17:15:05.000Z

v-ryu thanks a lot of those OS, please share if you can think of some more.

gen · 2010-04-12T17:19:19.000Z

NICE! a 12 win streak, i’d like to see those matches.