You just need to learn the ranges at which ducking straight is a punish to fireballs and not an invitation for you to eat an Ultra.
Sup guys, beginner Dudley here. If this hasn’t already been discussed, any general tips against Guy? Most of the Guys I’ve fought use the sliding sweep so much that I can’t use ducking or MGB reliably.
So far, ill say dudley worst matchups from my experience are:
VERY hard : Chun, Dictator
Hard: Guile, Ken, Balrog*, Thawk, Dhalsim
Every character that has long range pokes and/or a projectiles can give you a very hard time, once you get in make sure you do the job.
Chun and dictator, plain and simple if they know their shit you are not getting in. Also if they corner you…well you know. Its so funny when you corner dictator, bait his ex PC just to get maybe 1 hit and he is dominating you again at mid range.
Guile can be tought, but i dont think as hard as the two above also if you catch him he has it very hard to recover.
Ken : fwd mk+low forward > dudley. Dudley has no reliable reversal + Ken gets in for free = trouble. Very hard to play footsies against ken with dudley normals only to have to deal with more guessing once you get in due to his reversal.
*Balrog: Still have to play more against rog, wouldnt be surprised to see him being very hard. His footsie game is just too strong for dudley, also dirty bull makes mgb unsafe.
Thawk: Unless im missing something thawk has the edge on this matchup, amazing set of long range pokes, amazing srk, you cant pressure as much as you want due to 360/720 (I know target combos work against grapplers, but thats not enought), SCARY 50/50 mixups that lead into 30-40% of your life and another free mixup.
Dhalsim: Obvious reasons, dhalsim is very good in super and his zoning and long range game hursts dudley a lot.
I think cody is more doable now, dont let him get the knife ever, that shit is beyond retarded.
So… I’ve been playing Duds for the past 4 days or so… and while that’s nowhere near long enough to get all the intricacies of the character, it seems like Dudley was waaaay overhyped…
It seems like he loses to footsies (Shotos, Chun, Bison, Rog, Guile, etc), strong pressure/mix-up games (Rufus, Akuma, etc.) and grapplers. Seems like he’s gonna be firmly planted at mid-tier. He seems like a pretty shitty character to me in terms of his tools with which to win matches, honestly, but the fact that he does big damage keeps him somewhat competitive.
Luckily for him though, he’s fun to play despite the uphill battle in a lot of fights.
Here’s a video of my Day 2 Dudley:
[media=youtube]GNzvX8a49ew[/media]
It was encoded kinda funny, so it glitches here and there. I’m gonna put up 10 games from my set with Philly-One in a day or two also, and another two matches with MagMan’s Guile.
Yeah he’s shit.No one should play him.
Yeah… let’s not speak realistically about the shortcomings of the character, and try to understand each other’s experiences with him. I’m sorry. What was I thinking?
This makes sense, though I’m not experienced at all. I don’t run into too many match-ups where I feel confident except against… maybe… Hakan.
He feels very much like a better Makoto to me.
I agree with most of this. Chun and Bison I find the hardest match-ups at the moment, defintely. I need to find more Bison players to try and figure out that match-up, although against Chun I feel that I have a chance, although it is stacked in her favour.
Guild and Dhalsim I find difficult too, but Rog and Hawk I don’t think are that hard. Rog’s cr.HK is great, but one knockdown and you can pressure the crap out of him, his wake-up game is poor. Also your standing pokes can match his. Ken I think is 5-5, Ryu is much harder to fight than Ken IMO.
What do you guys do against Bison? So far all I’ve got is trying to counter poke his standing HK. I don’t think it’s worth focusing it as it comes out too quickly and recovers fast too. However, as I try and counter poke it so much, I eat a lot of dash -> throw as a result. I need to work on my reflexes in this match-up methinks.
I was talking about that with some other people online. It just seems a lot of people just went strictly by what J Wong said about Dudley when he didn’t really have a chance to see the full picture. Dudley feels like a solid mid-tier character, but it is very early to say for sure. His offense is great, tons of mixups, safe block strings, and significant damage output. He has an extraordinary amount of ways to land his ultra/super. His footsie game is average, but not the worst. Certain characters do dominate him, and unless we find out something extraordinary about the character, you’re just going to have to grind out some wins. The place where Dudley truly suffers are his reversal options, as has been discussed previously. If Dudley’s DP was actually good, he’d be incredible, maybe a bit too good. Amazing offense + good health + invincible dp = ouch.
We’ll find out soon enough, but with Chun looking incredibly strong in Super, Dudley players are going to have to work double time to win. It’s a fun challenge, for sure.
With regards to Ken’s st.mk, a bunch of Dudley’s normal stuff it. I can go about even with Balrog, so I’m not so sure it’s that bad. Anecdotal evidence isn’t really helpful, though. I’ve actually been doing really well against Ken and Ryu, and Akuma is a little more tricky but also doable. Rufus is super fkn annoying, but option selecting cr.lk + cr.lp + cr.hp when you’re not sure if he’s going to dive kick again or throw is fairly effective. It tends to trade at times, but it gets him off your ass. Gief and Hawk don’t particularly scare me, not sure about Hakan yet.
It’d mark the fights like this for now:
Hard(8-2?): Chun, Bison
Difficult(7-3): Viper(?), Sim, Guile
Tough (6-4): Rufus, Dj
Of course this is all based on playing the character for a week, and things will either get better or worse once people get familiar with all the tools and new characters.
dudley loses for free to honda also…like that one is really bad,
yes dudley can use u1 to punish all headbutts on block, but honda is probably in the lead if dudley has ultra, and i dont see why honda would want or need to do a random headbutt in that situation.
i think u1 is overall better because dudley doesnt get all that many opportunities to even land u2 against good opponents, while with u1 u can punish even whiffed normals for a lot of damage, which gives his footsie game some threat, and it punishes so many otherwise completely safe things on block.
I agree with these post 100 %. . Dudley is overhyped.
His footsie are pretty bad
His special moves are almost all very weak outside of combos except for ducking
His option on wake up are terrible.
The only thing thats keep him going is his high damage output and his close range game.
Agreed. Every match is an uphill battle. Why wasn’t anyone smart enough to give some sort of proper invincibility frames or super armor to ex backswing? NOBODY saw that as a glaring hole? His pokes suck. They’re not Rose bad but damn they’re pretty horrible. Anybody remember days of using hp as an anti air from outside? Those days are gone, coz that shit trades while the only thing hk can beat is empty jump. The range and speed on his pokes is just totally gone.
His ultras suck. They’re not the worst thing on the face of the planet, but as bad as he is, you’d think they’d try to beef his ultras a bit…NONE of that. I wonder which idiots were fondling ono’s balls when they said that he’d be good. Then again, if I only played the game in training mode for 2 seconds, based on my 3s experience, I’d probably assume he was good too.
I’m totally disappointed at the SSF4 incarnation of dudley…hell, they put in that stupid charge move so I was hoping for punch and cross but the move that would actually be useful isn’t there. That would’ve put the fear of god in ex armor users off and on.
It’s really bad people. Somebody find something insanely broken NOW!!! Dudley isn’t meant to fly economy class.
Ono-san actually said at the recent London event that the top 3 characters in Capcom Japan QA were Juri, Akuma and Dudley! So maybe there are things we are just not seeing yet. I keep paying a lot of attention to the character punishes thread because some of those can totally swing matches for you.
I agree with you 100% about the EX swing blow though. Why he can be poked out of that thing I do not know.
The high damage output gets stopped by lots of wake-up reversal options. Dudley is very difficult to use.
This is what I’ve picked up from using him:
1.) Dudley is a patience-based character. Weak footsies and lack of aerial options means Dudley needs to do a lot of bobbing and weaving in and out of footsies range to find an opening. Luckily, Dudley has great movement tools (nice walk pace, 3-duck lengths, f+mk, f+hp). Normally, slightly less than half screen is the ideal position for Dudley against most characters. Too far and Dudley is useless. Too close and Dudley can’t set-up too many options for knockdown.
2.) Dudley is a high risk-mid reward character. His set-ups normally start from knockdown and against most of the cast are not safe. The main options for Dudley on an opponent’s wake up is:
- cr.lk xx st.mk (Target Combo)
- Overhead
- Safe jump-in to hopefully ambigious block string leading to tick throw
- Cross-counter
Not having a cross-up means he has to have dangerous block strings (think Boxer). And be able to apply safe pressure. cr.lp/cr.mp xx lp mgb does well in this area.
3.) Dudders is free on wake-up. Learn to block.
4.) His bad match-ups don’t outweigh his good match-ups. He doesn’t necessarily dominate any characters whereas he has several bad match-ups. It’s an uphill battle in regards to facing the 30+ other characters of the cast; especially the top tier characters.
I think the key to playing Dudley is playing unorthodox and using a lot of variety. I don’t expect too much from him, like Hav said he’s still really fun to play. I’m interested to see how the Japanese will open him up.
Good breakdown. I think you missed one of, if not, the most important thing about Dudley oki pressure, and that’s throwing. The fact that you have high/low options that the opponent wakes up into means that OST is a really bad idea against Dudley, which means throws are a lot easier to land. Throw your opponent enough, and it will elicit some sort of response. At that point, everything is easier.
Wait.High risk/mid reward?Ok he may be high risk, but doing a 500 damage practical combo seems like a HUUUUGGEEE reward to me.I don’t even think there are characters except like cody who can do practical combos for so much damage.Oh and after an overhead nontheless.
I totally agree with the rest though.
Also, the guys who says OMG I PLAYED 3rd STRIKE HE IS NOW THE WORST CHAR EVEEER!!. this is not third strike, and i mean that the cast is totally different(except that Chun li still seems hard lol).When judging a character in a fighter, you judge him compared to the rest of the cast, and half the SSF4 cast also has no reversals(except EX, vega not even with ex), and everyone is pretty tame.I am not saying anything about his tier placement, just that there is absolutely no way he is the worst char in the game, or a “shit” char, considering the opponents.When you think about Dudley being bad, think of vega, dan or hakan (because it seems Guile is actually decent now lol).That’ll change the way you see dudley lol.
Welcome to SRK bro…
But yeah, I share your sentiments, Dudley certainly has some weak points in his armor. It seems to me its all about landing those really big assed punishes when the opportunity arises, and yeah, that means hitting those nasty 1 framers every. single. time.
His ducking straight has some interesting properties, it seems like it can really sweeten your positioning, even against Chun I have had success blasting in with it through her poke fest. (I have even used it as a tick throw setup, weird)
Oh, and further notes on Cody, he cannot jump in on Dudley, you can stuff ANYTHING he has in the air, you just gotta watch the low game with him, and punish the right moves (as some are pretty safe on block).
And Shotos, honestly, I think Duds is tailor made to murder shotos, even gawd mode Kuma, the 360 chars are tricky, but simple enough to handle (target combos are amazing against them, specifically lk,mk,mp,hp). I find my self using supers cancelled off target combos more and more in his tricky matchups, the damage output is on par or better then his Ultra setups, and the targets seem easier to get going in his tough poke battle matches.
Also, cross counter is really handy, no joke, SSB has its uses, but does get stuffed a little too much for my own liking. And thunderbolt is cool, but waaaaaaaaaaaay too slow. (I still catch people by suprise once in a while with it though, ;p)
Also, as a side note, Dudley is GREAT in the air, jumping mk,mp and fp are all fantastic tools, jumping rh is a brutal jump in attack with a great arc, and can lead to unreal damage.
With what? Standing HP or C.HP?
With what? Standing HP or C.HP?