SRK Math Thread

You mean x has a repeated real root of -1

You’re thinking of factoring by grouping.

Assuming knowledge of arithmetic, Stats would be easier to pick up in the short term. With trig, you have to know algebra and geometry, although really you spend so much time on two "nice "triangles in particular… though later on you learn Law of Sines and Cosines , but these two particular triangles are the only ones that are particularly “easy” to solve.

You also need calculus to fully understand the concept of radians since it is by definition the ration of arc length to the radius.

Seriously? I could know trig by now? Damn. I’d like to at least know that with geometry. Geometry always looked the sexiest to me.

Sure, there isn’t a whole lot to learn in trig. If you understand what a function is, then you shouldn’t have a problem learning about trigonometric functions. Compared to other math concepts, trig is very easy to visualize.

You should really learn geometry first. You need to understand elementary geometric concepts like distance, congruence, similarity, ratios, and basic properties of angles, circles and triangles if you really want to understand trig. A single chapter isn’t going to cover the fundamentals you need. You also need to understand algebra well in order to manipulate trig identities, which comes particularly useful in calculus for solving certain classes of integrals.

Speaking of calculus, you really need to understand infinite series and convergence in order to understand trig functions. Yes, they are ratios, but apart from the “nice” angles on the unit circle, you won’t be able to comprehend exactly why tan(Pi/12) is appx 0.27.

And the answer is not “because my calculator said so,” nor is it “who cares.”

Now that I think about it, you really should learn trig last …

I forgot to mention I took several algebra classes before Stats. So yeah, I can do that.

That’s SRGAY forums for you. It even showed the edited post on my screen.

As Warrior’s Dreams said, you’re thinking of factoring by grouping. I learned it back in Algebra (I’m in Calculus), but I haven’t used it frequently.

This is from the Algebra reference in the back of my book

Factoring by Grouping

http://www.texify.com/img/\LARGE\!acx^3%2Badx^2%2Bbcx%2Bbd%3Dax^2%20(cx%2Bd)%2Bb(cx%2Bd)%3D(ax^2%2Bb)(cx%2Bd).gif

Also, I was bored once and found the Cubic Formula on the internet. It’s really long and drawn out, so it’s probably not practical unless you know how to make an application where you can simply input variables and get zeroes back
http://www.math.vanderbilt.edu/~schectex/courses/cubic/

Well this is nice. Good find xlxlxlxl

Speaking of trig

http://www.texify.com/img/\LARGE\!e^{i%20\theta}%20%3D%20cos%20%20\theta%20%2B%20i%20sin%20\theta.gif

and as a bonus

http://www.texify.com/img/\LARGE\!e^{i\pi}%20%3D%20-1.gif

Is there a book that goes into detail about this? Im in my Calculus class, and then im of to differentials. I look at derivatives/integrals, and can do them even the hard ones easily, but i really don’t understand what the fuck is going on on a fundamental level. And my book doesn’t do a good job of explaining what’ going on.

Is wikipedia a good source for information for this?

And everytime I see infinite series I can’t help but feel humble, especially when it leads to Eulers formula. A beautiful combination of so many mathematical elements.

What is the “this” you are referring to? Is it calculus? If the answer is yes, then the answer to your question is to get a book on real analysis. As you have discovered, the stuff they teach you in Calc I & II is rather watered down. The emphasis there is on computation. The professor may go through proofs, but odds are most people there do not understand what is going on. Unfortunately, if you do not understand what the book is trying to explain to you (what book are you using anyway), chances are you will not understand what a book on real analysis is telling you. If you have specific questions, you can post them here and I will answer them.

Finally, we can have LaTeX in the SRK Math Thread

For people who don’t know, LaTeX is a simple scripting language that takes text and makes it nice and pretty. So rather than having to read this

integral((5x^2 + 9)e^{-x}) from a to b

you can have

http://www.texify.com/img/\LARGE\!\int_a^b%20\!%20(5x^2%20%2B%209)e^{-x}%20\%2C%20\mathrm{d}%20x..gif

You go to www.texify.com and type in your LaTeX code. If you don’t know it, they have a tutorial. You can also google it like “integral + latex” or in general “name_of_thing_you’re_looking_for + latex” and it’ll show up

Then hit the huge “textify” button and copy and paste the code for forums into your post.

Credit goes to xlxlxlxl for first finding this.

I understand the proofs when he (author or teacher) goes through it, and understand it when they try and break it down. (For Calculus 1 my professor didn’t prove anything and just showed us the formulas and a whole lot of examples, for Calculus II, a different teacher broke it down a bit more, but never got into it much because the proofs would have taken to much class time. For Calculus III he isn’t going to prove much because there simply isn’t enough time)

Im using James Stewart 6th edition calculus. He (author) only talks about the proof or idea for a few sentences and then proceeds to do a bunch of examples.

My question is how and why an integral works. And my last question is, can you give me books on real mathematical analysis ranging from

Arithmetic
Algebra
Geometry/Trig
Series / Infinite Series
Calculus

From a geometric perspective, an integral works by using rectangles to approximate the area under the curve you are taking the integral over.
By making the intervals on the x axis smaller and smaller, you in turn make the rectangles thinner and thinner, which in turn gives a better approximation of the area because there is less “error” in the approximation. p. 354 in Stewart gives a good picture of this. The areas of the rectangles in the upper left grossly overapproximate the area under the curve, whereas the rectangles in the bottom right do a much better job. They are smaller, and thus so are their uniform areas. Compare the “overlap” of the pic in the upper left to that of the lower right. The rectangles do a much better job of minimizing the error.

Of course, this intuition can only get you so far. Analysis prioritizes rigor, and as such, you need to consider algebraic inequalities to get a more air-tight view of what is occurring. Look at p. 366. under the definition where it says "the precise meaning of the limit … "

Integrals are limits. Based on the definition of a Riemann sum, they are limits as n goes to infinity in particular. Now look at the inequality you see there. There are several things you should notice:

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!%20\int_a^b%20\!%20f(x)%20\%2C%20\mathrm{d}%20x%20.gif

and

http://www.texify.com/img/\LARGE\!\normalsize%20\sum_{i%3D1}^n%20f(x_i)%20\Delta%20x.gif

are both NUMBERS. If the symbols bother you, use algebra and let p stand for the integral part, and q stand for the Riemann sum.

http://www.texify.com/img/\LARGE\!\normalsize%20\sum_{i%3D1}^n%20f(x_i)%20\Delta%20x.gif

is an APPROXIMATION. Specifically, it is contingent on n, where n is the number of rectangles you decide to use to approximate the area under the curve.

Perhaps you are wondering “why rectangles?” The answer is because if you use the distance of the intervals on the x-axis, this distance is a length. Lengths have numbers … so do sides of rectangles. So we have a side of a rectangle. The other side of the rectangle is the value of

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!f(x)%20%20.gif

on the interval, which of course is a height of the curve … but it is also a height, so it too can be the height of a side of a rectangle.

But how do we make this idea of “as close to the conjectured limit as we please”? The answer lies in the delta-epsilon definition of a limit. Epsilon is some positive number representing that “as close as we please.”

Now, recall the definition of a function: I have a set of numbers called the DOMAIN and another set of numbers called the RANGE. Numbers in the range are contingent on numbers in the domain in this way: If I have a number in a range, this implies that there is some number in the domain that makes it so. So, suppose

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!f(x)%20%3D%20x%20%2B%206.gif

. Let the domain be all real numbers EXCEPT for -1. Then 5 cannot be in the range of f(x). Why? Because if it was, this would contradict the assumption that -1 is not in the domain.

Now, we take this one step further as we tie this into the definition of a limit at infinity. Making the function as “close” to a conjectured limit as we like means that there will always be some number of rectangles N with this property:

for all numbers LARGER than the number of rectangles I use, and for any choice of numbers in an interval in the domain (which of course lies on the x-axis), the amount of error (i.e.

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!\epsilon.gif

) that the number of rectangles that I chose to use to approximate the conjectured limit is as small as I want it to be.

Since

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!\epsilon.gif

is ANY positive number, it represents ANY amount of error. When you used the definition of a limit to solve limits in Calc I, your value of

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!\epsilon.gif

depended on

http://www.texify.com/img/\normalsize\!\delta%20%20.gif

By satisfying this set of inequalities, you find the limit. Since the Riemann sum is a limit at infinity, evaluating an integral is evaluating a limit.

Real analysis is “advanced” calculus, so it is assumed that you know trig, algebra, geometry, elementary calculus, and of course arithmetic. As such, there are no such books as you requested. However, I would highly recommend Euler’s “Elements of Algebra.” The way the English is written is somewhat awkward, but if you can get past that, Euler explains arithmetic/precalc concepts better than any textbook out there.

For geometry, there isn’t really any I can recommend. I would say Euclid’s “Elements,” but translations can be phrased extremely awkwardly. Still, it’s worth checking out

http://aleph0.clarku.edu/~djoyce/java/elements/elements.html

For calculus, I would recommend Howard Anton’s text. I found his explanations to be a lot better personally.

btw, If you’re in Calc III, you need to get a handle on 3D shapes, ESPECIALLY EVERYTHING IN CHAPTER 10 AND 12. You will be in trouble if you don’t, especially when you have to set up multiple integrals on 3D shapes, but can’t because you can’t visualize them. There are also certain integrals that have domains that are MUCH easier to evaluate using polar coordinates.

Actually, you need EVERYTHING in order to understand Chapter 16. You need to understand vector sums in order to get line integrals; you need to understand how the norm of a cross product determines the area of a parallelogram so you can approximate surface areas, you need to understand derivatives of vector valued functions because the tangent vectors of said function are used to make said parallelogram. Make every effort to understand each concept because it will come back to haunt you if you do not.

As usual, keep asking questions on stuff you don’t get.

Yeah you’re not going to find any in depth proof or explanation in Stewart. These texts are usually used in first and second year calculus classes for science and perhaps engineering students, ie., disciplines that do not require proofs. The book that I used in first and second year undergrad calc/introductory analysis was Advanced Calculus 3ed. by Taylor and Mann. Excellent book, but it might be a little tough to read for non-math majors. Still you might be interested in checking it out. There’s a section or chapter in it for practically everything that you’ve listed with in-depth proofs.

As far as integrals go, there are many types of integrals but the two commonly used definitions are Riemann integrals and Lebesgue integrals. Plenty of good resources online for this stuff, and Taylor and Mann covers them both iirc. Actually the wiki page offers a good introduction.

thank you so much, ill reply with a proper response once I digest it.

Thank you so much. I though i and my teacher where the only people that shited on that book, it has its good point.

To succeed in Linear Algerbra, do you have to learn Calculus? Btw, sorry for all these questions. I’m in Stats right now and I hate it! I can’t imagine me going any higher unless I have to.

No, you don’t need to learn Calculus to succeed in Linear Algebra. It would be helpful however, if you were familiar with concepts like sets, functions, and vectors. I don’t know if there is a non-math major option, but traditionally, Linear Algebra is a more proof-based course than Calc or Trig … kind of like Geometry in that sense. So if you want to succeed, it would also be helpful to have some experience writing proofs.

Where I went to university, ‘Stats’ appears to be an early course. It is quite possible it is a very boring class, either because of the teacher/book or simply because it doesn’t challenge you enough. Depending on which department you take Linear Algebra from, you’re going to get different types of content. If I took ‘Math 21: Linear Algebra’ I would expect proofs to be the meat of the course, but if I took ‘Engineer 21: Linear Algebra’ I would expect more computer programming type homework and less proofs.

The more math courses you take, the smarter you get. I recommend learning what you think you can handle while at school.

I really love physics and its application, engineering. i also really love chemistry and its applications. Which is why Im getting a degree in Chemical Engineering. But Im also starting to like the abstract? (would logic be a better word) of math a lot. the explanation of it and the idea behind it.
v

And if so, what are some Degrees in Analytical? Mathematics that would be useful in Engineering.

I also have a question

In basic Chemistry, we learn about Hess’s law. That is, if we know the the specific heat of a set number of subsequent reactions, we can evaluate the specific heat of an overall reaction, even if the stiochometric factors are do not add up, but provided that when manipulated we end up with the same stoichometric factors and elements in the over all reaction.

so for example, we want to know the reaction

http://www.utc.edu/Faculty/Gretchen-Potts/chemistryhelp/Pictures/hess1.gif

and we want to know the specific heat of that particular equation, and we happen to know

http://www.utc.edu/Faculty/Gretchen-Potts/chemistryhelp/Pictures/hess2.gif

[LEFT]obviously, this stiochometric equation is simple, and when you do the addition and subtraction we arrive at the given equation, and we simply add the heat of formation of the three reactions and its equal to -1220 kJ.[/LEFT]
[LEFT] [/LEFT]
[LEFT]So, as for my question, is this a basic application of linear algebra? How does this law work at the mathematical level.[/LEFT]
[LEFT] [/LEFT]
[LEFT]edit,[/LEFT]
[LEFT] [/LEFT]
[LEFT]would I be wrong if I made the assumption hat this could be a type of differential equations? Because say, for every mole of Sr that I burn with .5 moles of O2, I gain 1 mole of SrO, but at the same time i burn that mole of SrO with 1 mole of CO2 (rate of change dependent on another variable, that variable being CO2/O2).[/LEFT]
[LEFT] [/LEFT]
[LEFT]or am I just completly wrong.[/LEFT]

Actually, it’s the opposite. To learn calculus “right”, you need to know at least some basic linear algebra. You can do fine in single variable calculus without linear algebra, but multivariable calculus requires it, which makes it all the more frustrating that so many schools let students take the subjects simultaneously, or even multivariable calculus first, which is a terrible idea.

The good news is that anyone with a decent high school math education and motivation can learn linear algebra. I’d suggest the books by Strang, Lay, Leon (or “Linear Algebra Done Wrong”, which is free online and looks good) and the MIT Strang lectures. Axler and Shilov also have very good books, but they’re harder and mainly for a second exposure to the subject.