I think setups will become more prominent than before. That’s the last thing I’m gonna play around with tho. Meaty s.hp, Meaty Smasher, Meaty Raze, etc - all those with a good setup could become match winners. So let’s find them!
So do you still end your combos with it when you can or opt for the hard knockdowns? We’ll definitely need to work some oki setups now, I would not be surprised if Mortar Punch’s auto correct makes it able to meaty normal wakeup/punish rolls but that sounds too good.
Think we can play some games again someday? I haven’t gotten too much better but I would like to see firsthand what people are doing with Paul now, especially string/frame traps/ch setups.
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I dunno, after my short set against my brother, I kinda dropped Paul. He seemed too strong imo, so I’m not gonna play him that often anymore, at least for now I think.
I bought the character DLC yesterday and I’ve been working on my Cody/Cole instead.
There are plenty of characters that giggle at the new paul. He has still flaws, where other characters just herp-derp-stomp over everything. There is SO MUCH POTENTIAL in the other characters that hasn’t been discovered and\or made public yet. Expect half the cast to have some ridiculous stuff.
Every character has flaws, that’s not really the point, I just don’t get the same satisfaction as before.
To be honest, Paul is much more enjoyable for me right now, i’m in love with his new walk speed and forward dash, and i love too his crazy damage output now, damn, HK Shredder seems broken. xD
I will definitively stick with him, time to find an other partner for him.
Well, would anyone else like to use their Paul against me? I wanna get stomped Phoenix style.
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other characters have better tools, more damage and are more abusive. that’s what I’m saying. TBH, I doubt there will be paul hype a few\weeks days into the game, since a new character will be in the spot light. paul just has his 15 minutes of fame.
Well, I do understand Ralenzo a lil bit. He is not too strong when compared to other casts in the game, but after playing 2012 Paul for such a long time, 2013 Paul definitely feels OP lol
We’re going to have problems again when it comes to high-level play. Then it’ll get fun again with trying all the CH baits and stuff. I think I’m going to have fun with LP Sway.
Yes that’s what I’m talking about.
He’s not too strong compared to other characters in the game (Dudley is just ridiculous for example), he just seems too strong for me, myself.
In 2012 I had to put a lot of work to make Paul work, there was no auto win button, but now he seems to have an answer for everything.
In 2013 they made his oki game even better, buffed his damage output (for what reason?), gave him reliable AA’s, gave him a reversal and increased his walkspeed.
The only thing I needed was for ex.Shredder to hit crouchers that’s ALL, but now they gave him so many stuff, seriously to me, especially compared to 2012, Paul feels OP.
I’ll do some LP sway related stuff today. I wanna check how it can be applied during his normal gameplan. Mainly testing how s.hp xx LP sway fares in comparison to a normal s.hp (-8). CADC pressure are also on that list.
Edit: TBH Paul should always have the damage. He lacked a huge portion in v2012. They just went a bit over board with his damage options: Mortar comboable, +40 damage, groundbounce on CH, Raze tweak, HK Shredder 110 damage in combination with Smasher’s and Supers’ juggle potential increase etc. He also got other tools on top. For instance, I wouldn’t have minded not to have LK/MK Shredder. A reversal for 1 bar was necessary tho.
[433] j.hp, cl.mp, c.hp xx lk Raze, c.mp, c.mp, c.hp xx Smasher
Was his most damaging meterless combo in the corner, I’m pretty sure there are only a handful of characters who could top that in Vanilla.
Damage was definitely NOT something Paul was lacking.
EDIT: They should either remove the groundbounce of mortar punch or remove his advantage on block. The move was already good, Balrog his overhead for example is slower AND punishable on block, and that’s almost his only way to open people up.
Probably not the best comparison to make, but u get my point ^^’
it includes a j.heavy attack. it does 393 damage without it. many characters can\could do that meterless midscreen. he lacked damage for the flaws he had. there is no way around that. he had none of the tools other characters had, nor the mobility nor the “right buttons”, and even his optimal bnb was rather tricky to time consistently, for mid-tier damage.
speaking about corner, 1 meter corner specific combo without shredder for a whooping 6 damage then your typical shredder combo:
[LEFT][456] cl.mp, c.hp xx Raze, cl.hp xx EX Mortar, cl.hp xx Smasher[/LEFT]
The change log states this:
• H. Shredder - Damage 20+20+60(100)->50+30×2(110)
- Invincibility time changed from 1~9F->1~11F
- Will now hit crouching opponents
But I can get hit out of it, and it doesn’t hit crouchers. EX Shredder does though, so I guess those changes are for EX shredder, while HK Shredder only got the damage?
Yes those changes are for EX Shredder. HK Shredder is a combo ONLY tool, hence the damage.
I’m not sure how long EX Shredder has invincibility tho, since the start up was decreased in another patch log to 7F. I would assume it’s 1-8F invincible now.
The OP has all changes figured out correctly, thanks to street11’s translation directly from the source.
Ah, thanks.
I’ve updated the general discussion. I could use some feedback on noticable normals though. Stuff like Pokes/AA, special porperties etc. I tried staying away from frames since we already have detailed frame data in your 2013 thread.
s.lp - still good for pressure and frame traps
cl.mp - frame/hit advantage, close hit confirmation - most important tool up close
c.hp - anti air
cl.hp - raw punisher (forces standing) more damage in combos as c.hp.
far s.hp - ch crumble. decent poke now
c.mk - 7frame slow, low poke
c.mp - 5frames fast combo tool used in hit confirmation combos
f.mp / f.hp. overheads, f.hp has high/low mixup potential and can combo into smasher / CADC / super etc it’s 4 frames slower, but yields a better reward. f.mp ch groundbounce
df.hk - decent ranged low option for mixup with overheads / mortar
j.lk - best a2a
nj.hp - good on offense (oki, after jump in etc)
nj.hk - decent a2a when neutral jumping
j.mk - cross up
j.hp - probably best iump in.
I think that’s about it.
s.mp is actually also a decent poke as it moves forward. it beats some high / mid hitting pokes by other characters - loses straight to any low poke tho.
I wonder if I should add JP stats into the frame data. I was thinking on doing it initially, but didn’t do it in the end.
btw cross art is now 150+ damage. ^^
far s.MK looks like a good poke, is it? (I still have barely played this vs people XD)
It’s rather slow with 10 Frames start up. It’s okayish to beat lows, has a tiny bit more reach then c.mk, but isn’t cancable, so all you get is that 60 damage unless you buffer into s.hp and go into a chain. It’s by no means a Bison s.mk.
Ok. I just figured it looked a lot like Dan’s far s.MK in AE, and that’s one of his best pokes.
Btw, you should definitely add the juggle data to the frame data. I’ve already done all the dirty work, all you need to do is check all the hits of the Tekken strings, basically. Cross assault will allow you to check every single move easily. I could do it if you don’t completely grasp the juggle system though.
Updated the post with the data you gave me now.