Because FA lv 2 scales damage by a lot so FADC c.hp does more damage.
SB xx FA2 -> cr.hp does more damage than SB xx FADC -> s.hp xx legs/shoryu unless you’re in the corner.
He’s talking about c.hp after fadc, not s.hp…
What otori said is correct. Also xx fadc > c.hp works at a different (and further) range than xx fa.lv2 > c.hp
If it loses to dj.MK it probably loses to nj.HK. Actually, I think nj.HK just about beats everything clean if you use it properly and the move you’re going against isn’t invincible…
How many frames of recovery does Seth have after a teleportation? After a teleport next to an opponent, can you immediately do a Piledriver before he can throw you? Is this a better 50/50 than Ken’s hurricane kick?
Wtf? Headstomp and nj.hk have completely different angles. Just because one beats Guy’s cr.hp doesn’t mean the other will. And besides, you can’t do nj.hk on a jump-in which is what he was doing.
Divekick is probably his best bet. But honestly Guy has EX tatsu so you shouldn’t be jumping at him anyway.
Seth’s teleport in SSF4 has enough recovery to punish with a full combo on reaction and teleport -> SPD is terrible without either massive surprise on your side or a knockdown/Sonic Boom to cover it. Ken’s EX tatsu mixup is much better. Like twenty times better.
There is frame data for Seth on the SRK SSF4 wiki.
after legs, teleport forward with KKK lands in front, and generally PPP lands in back although sometimes in front. only 3 frame reversals can actually punish you (ie shotos) for it. in this situation, against the right characters (read: not balrog or bison mash jab/low short chars), teleporting towards them after legs and makin them guess between dp or spd can be dangerous. especially if theyre close to stun.
Against Rog/Bison I actually hope that they try to go for the punish so I hit them with DP FADC stomps/ultra.
A jump-in attack does not have to be right on top of him to qualify as a jump-in (semantics if you argue that doing a jumping attack next to an opponent does not qualify as a jump-in…). A nj.HK next to Guy, timed properly, cleanly beats cr.HP. Timed poorly, it trades. I assumed (rightfully) that nj.HK would win because nj.HK is probably one of the best moves Seth has when it comes to his hit boxes.
Have to agree though, EX Tatsu makes my life miserable against Guy. Dive kick doesn’t work very well against him either.
Guy is a pretty solid 6-4 for Seth. I dunno why you’re having trouble in this match in the first place. Seths j.hk can hit ridiculously deep and guys cr.fp is awfully slow. You must be jumping pretty obviously to have him anti air with d.fp. And ex tatsu is REALLY easily safe jumpable, especially after spd.
It’s a 4 frame move so it’s just barely safe jumpable.
everything is easy to safe jump (sans shoto dps but you can easily make those whiff) off of spd.
Oh man…I’m with whoever thinks Guy is a poor matchup for Seth. I’m scared to AA because he can change his trajectory, j.d+M beats everything in the air while it’s active and, when up close…boy I have nightmares with his frame traps and run stop crap. I also love the fact that a random EX grab (nastier on wakeup) takes 1/3 of Seth’s health.
This could all be just personal experience, because one of the best players I compete with happens to play Guy, but this is my most hated matchup for sure. Also I suspect it to be worse in AE, since he got a 3 frame c.lk, better range on normals and apparently you can only stomp him twice.
Don’t really see how Guy is in Seth’s favor. It may be even in Super, though I’m leaning towards a slight disadvantage for Seth. For starters, keeping Guy out is…difficult. As stated, he can change his trajectory. Sonic booms generally are not very wise though you are going to have to use them. If you remain unpredictable you can usually have some success with stretchy arms (but I suppose that is a given.) I might even go as far as to say that the only way to reliably AA Guy is EX Shoryuken. When you’re both in the air, Guy pretty much dominates. The only reliable move Seth can pull out is his nj.HK. Otherwise you will probably get stuffed by Guy, if he doesn’t scoop you out of the air for some huge damage. Then there is the close range game which can get pretty bad, really fast. Eventually, you’re going to have to fight with Guy at this range and he likes it. If Seth initiates this fight, he does have options available. Seth can safe jump Guy, also stated. That’s pretty big for Seth in this match-up, considering that OS Shoryuken loses/trades to Guy’s EX Tatsu. Dive kick is usually unwise if Guy has meter, the risk is not really worth the reward. However, if Guy initiates this game, Seth is in trouble. Guy has a solid pressure game with tricky resets. I think the shining problem for this match up though is simply his command grab. From what I can tell this move has a couple of set ups where Seth simply -cannot- escape it and will lose nearly a third of his health. Realistically, I believe Seth is allowed to make two mistakes in most of his match ups. Versus Guy, he can only make one.
In AE, I think the match is a more obvious 6-4. Considering that Seth does not have his old nj.HP and Guy has gotten buffed.
Hurray for theory fighting.
I don’t feel Guy is a good matchup for Seth. Mostly for reasons stated already.
I want to main Seth and i’m just wondering how the fuck do you play with this character, I know his combos and most of his setups on wake-up of course, but how do you approach a fight with him? Do you usually play a keep away game until there’s a knockdown? Would you say Seth is a good footsie character? I have a match here with Seth but I really don’t know what to do with this character unless i’m close, so how do I get in? Thanks
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Seth has okay pokes, but his slow walkspeed prevents him from playing real footsies. However, Seth has jumping fierce, standing fierce, a divekick, Sonic Boom, and U1 to punish stuff from the opponent.
You can’t just force your way in with Seth, you don’t have the health for that. So you need to condition your opponent with zoning. If they start respecting your zoning, dash up and SPD them or cross them up. Tanden Engine can also be useful here, but it’s risky.
Seth’s mixups revolve around a few key tools:
[list]
[]SPD
[]j.hk safe jumps
[]empty jump cr.lk
[]Empty jump/frame trap hp SRK FADC
[]lp Tanden Engine to continue a blockstring
[]After air stomps, walk under cr.lk or fake walk under cr.lk
[]Instant air overhead headstomp
[]crossup j.hk/fake crossup divekick
[/list]
The biggest problem with Seth’s mixups is that he has few ways to frame trap into a knockdown hit-confirmed. This is why Seth will often just DP FADC if he thinks the opponent is going to hit buttons, or tick SPD will punish mashing non-reversals as well. The only other way I’ve found to frame trap into a knockdown that’s good is cr.mk xx lp Sonic Boom hit-confirm FADC s.hp xx legs/shoryu.
Seth’s best footsie pokes are s.lk, s.mk, and s.hk. cr.mk can be buffered into a knockdown with mk legs but the hitbox isn’t great and it’s slow.
Thanks man it was very helpful, until now I was using HP Tanden Engine in my blockstrings no wonder it wasn’t safe. Also what is the command for his dive kick I don’t know exactly, and it seems to be very hard to combo after his dive fick I tried numerous of times and failed.
It’s :d: + HK, it has to be down and not :db: or :df: unlike the stomp.
After the divekick you can USUALLY land a cr.lp if you have good timing but if you hit the opponent in the head/neck you can’t combo off it. You want to either do a meaty dive kick (fake crossup on wakeup) or aim for their legs/torso to combo off it. You can actually combo cr.mk off a perfectly spaced divekick that hits their little toe just to give you an example of how much the + on hit/block varies based on height.
Oh yeah and if people are holding up back on your mixups do jump forwards mp and put those assholes into a vortex. Jump forwards stomp is great in the corner - it will beat 98% of uppercuts (fuck you Cammy), is an overhead, and you can actually land in front of them sometimes if you come down with j.lk instead of j.hk crossup. Also you can just stomp some more and/or just walljump back to safety. You can be uppercutted during stomps, but it is very hard. Like harder than autocorrect uppercutting.
Two quick ones:
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Does anyone use cr.mp with his crouch tech OS? Both his lk and mp are garbage being 5 frames, so I thought maybe the better hitbox/damage would be worth it, but problem is you can only combo after a counter hit…thoughts?
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I stumbled upon Air’s blog and was reading his Ryu vs Seth matchup guide. He mentions you can safe jump shotos after SPD but doesn’t go into details. I tried a few things in training and didn’t manage to reproduce this and considering the general rules that 3 frame reversals can’t be safe jumped, I quickly gave up. So, is it possible?