you gotta consider some things. A popular “style of play” in Asia is the “wineglass grip” which benefits from having lighter joysticks like the LS-32 or JLF. it’s just generally easier to handle by generally everyone, in any kind of balltop grip.
man I wish we could have a one-on-one talk with Sanwa Denshi and get clearer answers as to why things are such.
You got to factor in different play styles.
Many American players grew up on Happ, IL, Suzo and Wico Joysticks. All of those have larger, stronger, much beefier springs.
Those players are used to muscling the joystick. These parts are designed with durability in mind. They are after all mounted in a an inch and a half thick wooden panel.
American players, specially ones who play on American parts, have a Eagle or Iron grip.
Kinda like the image above
Japanese parts are designed with precision and quick movements in mind. Mounted in think metal, plastic and fiberglass cabinets.
And as Hibachifinal pointed out, typical Japanese gamers have a much more gentle grip or hold such as the “wineglass grip”
Wow, that’s a good summary, with good example images. I didn’t know there was a “wineglass grip”. It also explains the existence of balltops, which I had been “scratching my head” over for the last few weeks. Now I understand why they exist, outside of games like Pacman and Galaga.
Around 15 seconds in.
https://youtu.be/ND7DFcbHLrc?t=15
I feel this is the most comfortable for me with the side of the palm resting on the top panel, fingers and some wrist do most of the work.
I usually see people doing variations of it at tournaments holding the ball with 2-4 fingers/thumb and the shaft if between the ring and pinky finger sometimes.
I definitely don’t hold the stick that way. In fact, it also explains why Japanese players made absolutely no impression on me during the 1990’s tournament scene, those poor guys weren’t used to our joysticks.
You should have brought this up way earlier in the thread, it would have completely changed the tone of the conversation and would have given me better insight much sooner. In fact, this is the first time I’ve seen any illustrations of grip anywhere, it certainly didn’t show up in my searches on this forum.
@momosgarage did you ever consider switching to a Sanwa JLW or a Seimitsu-LS-40?
The Sanwa JLW is the one Japanese stick that could be compared to American style sticks.
They have separately a optional circle gate (they also have a 2 Way gate for some older games)
The LS-40 is very, very similar to the Sanwa JLW in many regards. You want the S-plate to mount it correctly in a stick that perilously had a Sanwa JLF.
How is the LS-40 different from the LS-56? Is it the spring and no option for octo gate?
The LS-56 is a smaller, lighter stick. The only the shaft cover and dust washer is the same.
The LS-56 has a Octo Gate http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/gates/240-seimtisu-octagonal-restrictor-plate.html
And a round gate http://www.paradisearcadeshop.com/605-community-made
The LS-40 lacks those options.
I mention the LS-40 is it just happen to have parts that are exchangeable with the Sanwa JLW. When stock the sticks are similar (but not the same)
I use my bat tops like how that guy uses ball tops. That’s what feels good for me, yeahaz
There’s a grip called after Daigo Umehara himself, and it explains that most of the force is on the finger/hand than the arm… so lighter joysticks are obviously easier for that kind of practice.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1908672/candy/umeharagrip.JPG
here’s a good rundown of most common “balltop” grips…
http://arcadestickinfo.web.fc2.com/sousa.html
It’s good to note the author says there’s no real proper way, see what fits you most…
I know the site is in japanese, but the visual cues should help. it’s an interesting article which also talks specifically where the force and muscle control is centered on each kind of grip.
I use “つまみ持ち1”, the one right beneath the Daigo grip.
I use sorta what’s described as 二本指スタイル, but I also use a bat-top.
Which is coincidentally funny, because the description for that style says that this style is common with “overseas players”… 
I use the ウメハラ持ち grip with a bat top and a stock JLW and an LS-56 before that. I have used that with both circular and square gates. Odd that this thread turned into a conversation about grips though. But I guess it’s related so why not.
I guess my grip shifts between the Umehara grip and the one above it. No wine grip for me. I like slightly higher tension. That wine grip just doesn’t feel right.
This discussion should have started with grips , but no one stepped up to the issue until later in the thread. PresidentCamacho was on the right track, saying that the standard throw was somehow an issue with the way I used the joystick. Not knowing any better, I initially thought it was all because of the square gate, but it was not. My problem was a grip style that does not agree with normal throw and lose springs, coupled with a square gate. Once I changed the throw using a Kowal adapter and put in a stiffer spring, the square gate was no longer an issue. I assume, in hindsight now, that the problem I was having was mostly related to grip.
Its obviously faster to change equipment, than it is to change 20+ of muscle memory, but thanks to PresidentCamacho, I don’t have to make drastic non-standard hardware changes, with hoping for broader hardware offerings having a circle or octo gates and battop. Now I know, I can simply use or look for square gate joysticks with stiff springs and reduced throw, to get the same results. Hopefully, other old players, newish to SFIV, whom are used to HAPP’s, will see this thread and have a similar revelation and start moving beyond their opinions.
I still believe that despite one’s personal hardware preferences, one should familiarize themselves and become at least somewhat comfortable with stock JLF tension/gate and Sanwa buttons since this is what you will mostly run in to in the wild. I use and prefer my own unique hardware setup but still pick up a stock Sanwa stick every now and then just to make sure I can play OK if I was to borrow someone’s stick when my own hardware isn’t available. Many people will never run into that situation but IMO it’s valuable to be comfortable on numerous hardware setups.
I don’t disagree, but I personally can’t get any consistency out of the stock actuator and the loose spring. I did try both the spring and the Kowal individually and its almost entirely stock throw thats causing me problems. Maybe, over time, the Kowal will help me get more accustomed to using a square gate without the kowal installed, don’t know. Buttons are not an issue for me, there was a LOT of variation in the cabinets in the old days. I doubt many people today could play on the old stiff concave buttons that used to be on most of the arcade machines in the before 2000.
I don’t mind concave, but I always here horror stories from MVC2 players back in the day that tried to slide/mash buttons for Supers and got their fingers caught between the high sides of the concave plunger and the rim of the buttons and ripping their skin. So I’m just psychologically adverse to concaves if even the opportunity to play on a different sent of buttons. Other than lolrippingurskin, I’m not picky with buttons as long as they’re sufficiently responsive.