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Here’s what I know about JD’s in MOTW (this might belong in the other thread though):

You can input the JD on the ground 8 frames prior to the hit connection. In the air, it’s 10 frames prior.

Additionally, if your state changes from airborn to ground, the input is automatically reset. Thus, if you input the block button in the air 15 frames prior to reaching the ground, but a fireball connects with your hittable box 4 frames after you reach the ground, you will still JD the fireball, since the counter was reset as soon as you hit the ground. This may apply to other state changes as well (not sure).

You also get multiple “chances” to input the JD in the air, and each input resets the counter. So for example, if you hit block while rising from the ground and hold block for 15 frames, then place the stick into neutral position for at least 1 frame, and then input another block, you will JD the hit (provided to input it within the 10 frame window). Which works differently than 3S, IIRC.

This also applies to ground JD’s, as you’re able to take the stick out of defensive crouch, and put it back in defensive crouch mutliple times before a hit connection. The counter will reset each time the stick leaves a blocking position.

You can not JD during a short jump, though you are able to JD hits while rising from the ground. The command for air JD’s is either back or down+back (defensive crocuh), thus, in order to JD while rising, the stick must be put in one of those positions.

The frames for this may vary between characters, but I believe the game considers you in pre-jump state for 6 frames after leaving the ground. During these 6 frames, you are able to JD. After that 6 frame window, if you are not holding a direction on the stick, the game will put you in a short jump state, in which you will be unable to JD. If you are holding any direction during the check point, you will be put in a normal jump state and will be able to JD throughout the rest of the jump. Thus, you are technically able to have the stick in neutral while rising from the ground, and still be able to JD, so long as the JD input is done before the 6 frame checkpoint – and you are able to JD at any point during a jump, so long as you don’t enter a short jump state.

The ammount of time the game puts both characters in a “freeze” state during a JD is dependant on the the attack, as well as the window of opportunity to GC. I believe lighter attacks have a much shorter window to GC than heavier attacks. However, the directional inputs may be input prior to the JD or during the JD. The only input that must be timed for the GC is the final input. TOP attacks (C+D) can be used as GC’s.

As for Jenet, there’s 9 or 10 frames in between hit connections while JD’ing her qcf+P move (depending on if you’re backed into a corner or not). So, basically you have 7 or 8 frames to put the stick in a non-block position and back, then you have to do it again. In other words, I have no idea how they do it… :bluu:

162

Going back to this OTG thing, is it possible to OTG with a throw/command throw?

And by “low hit”, I’m assuming this applies to anything with a large enough hit box, or is there special properties involved?

Are there any commonly used OTG setups or B&B’s that involve OTG hits?

163

I really wish I had a copy of what all I posted on fierceslash; I did a lot of checking on JDing.

A) This is news to me. Every test I did on the emulator showed the window to JD to be 7 frames on the ground, every time. I dont think I ever tested air JD, except to check which directions could be used. I’d have to test before I agreed or disagreed with the ‘10 frame window to JD in the air’ part.

B) Wow, serious news to me. Requires checking. Your example of hitting and holding back 15 frames before landing, and getting hit 4 frames after landing, resulting in a JD. Is this a typo on your part? Not doubting you, just sounds outrageous.

C) Correct. The one consistency I found is that JD stun froma move is consistently 2 frames shorter than the blockstun from that same move. Lighter moves giving less time for GC makes perfect since, since quick moves cause short periods of hitstun/blockstun, and by extension, JD stun. As far as I’ve found, TOP attacks are treated like specials in every way, including GC and special cancelable moves.

D) Funnily enough, the first JD has to be down or down/back. any Re-JD’s can be any back direction, including up-back. You don’t have to put the stick in nuetral, but a non-back direction, or you can re-JD by wiggling between up and up/back or down and down/back for example.

164

For what I have seen of Otg’s it doesn’t have to specifically be a low attack just have a big enough hitbox. To show what I mean do a counter hit that knocks someone down with rock then doa raging storm. The raging storm does not hit low but it does hit the person OTG because the hitbox is big. OTG’s also reset the next hit as far as damage reduction goes. So if you get a counter hit super. Then follow it up with another super the next super still does full damage. As far as what allows OTG’s I have only seen counter hits allowing this. I will test the thing with Freeman’s Counter super but that would still technically be a counter hit right? And by counterhits allowing this it has to be a counter hit that pops people into the air and it has to be on the counter hit not at say the end of a string with a counter hit in it.

165

I’d like to add a very important thing : Jae’s backdash+launcher command move is cancellable into specials/spupers! In fact, I cancel it almost everytime because the launcher leaves Jae open for a looong time. Basically, you just have to input the special/super before the end of the backdash. To try it is to adopt it !

nothing to add, except that the top attack can be funny to input as your opponent gets up, because if he doesn’t JD it, his guard is already half-crushed (plus the move is sure to come out safely)

Jae has upper guard during the delay… use this to your advantage (e.g : you command backdash but your opponent launches a fireball at short/medium range, cancel to qcf+A/C guard the fireball and punish back - ok, it’s maybe not the best example, but you get the idea)

EDIT> Just forgot : Jae’s clapping hands victory taunt is probably the sickiest I have ever seen, that only is enough to make you want to play him :badboy:
(Btw, victory taunts are a totally optional but clearly essential plus of MotW imho :tup: !)

166

If by 7, you mean on the 8th frame the JD occurs, then yea. That would put the air ones at 9 as well. Maybe I should have mentioned that, sorry.

Not a typo, and it does sound outrageous, heh. That’s what I’ve experianced and tested, for some reason the trigger resets when you land. This applies to normals and specials, haven’t tested on supers yet. I’m not sure what else causes the trigger to reset, so far all I’ve found is landing.

167

:wow: that sound sooooo abusable :wow:

168

Am I the only who finds Dong Hwang more fun/stylistically better than Jae Hoon? To me Jae is always so serious and Dong is more arrogant. How is Jae better than Dong?

169

That was listed earlier. Jae can basically just get in and do damage better.

Dong is supposed to be more arrogant while Jae is supposed to be more like his father.

170

I heard Jae actually plays exactly (or near at least) like Kim, any truth to that?

171

Hey, check this out : http://www.a-cho.com/match/200501_06/mow20050423.html

http://www.a-cho.com/

They had a MOTW tourney 2 days ago (as of this post).

Let’s hope they post some vids. That would rule.

possible spoiler For those who can’t read the Kata, the finals were between Kain and Grant. 3rd place went to a Kevin player and 4th place went to a Hotaro player. And there are 7 Jenet’s on the list. Crazy.

172

He has a lot of the same moves his father had, but he doesn’t play exactly like him.

Jae is a lot better than Dong, he has a lot of combos that do a ton of damage without a super, and they’re all easy to do. Most people say he’s a beast cause he can link 2 supers, but that’s BS if you ask me, the 2 super link is rarely used by anyone who knows what they’re doing, if you combo into it, its a whole nother story, but I see lots of people go for it out of nowhere.

173

They updated with more 5 new fights (44-47-53-54-55)

http://howardarena.sakura.ne.jp

174

I’m not getting enough of those fights !

Btw, the trigger-reset on landing has brought some tremendous change in my way of playing. Thx for the info, I didn’t think I’d learn something so important after so much time :tup:

175

Explain this trigger reset on landing again for me. I didn’t quite get it the first time. What exactly does it do? Does it allow me to input for JD twice? or what?

176

Basically it means that an airborne-input JD may JD after landing if :

  • you inputted the JD after no more than 15frames before landing
  • are hit after no more than 4 frames after landing

Note 1 : I have NOT checked the number of frames (I’m just repeating what Xenozip said
note 2 : Xenozip> Are you sure you need to hold back? I didn’t check thouroughly enough but it didn’t seem that necessary to me. But then again, I mostly tested the trick, not went deep enough to be sure.

177

kevin is sicker than dudley , no wonder is toptier

178

That’s not exactly how it works… Let me try and explain it in different words.

If you hold back for too long before an attack, you will block instead of JD. It’s similar to a parry in that, if you do it too soon, it won’t work. The earliest time you can input a JD is 7 frames prior to a hit on the ground, and 9 frames in the air.

However, if you are holding back while jumping, the game will treat that as a JD input. Once you land, the game will also treat your landing as a completely seperate JD input, rather than continuing the input from the air, even though you were holding back (or down+back) the entire time.

Easiest way to understand how it works would be to jump toward an opponent, and hold down+back during the entire length of the jump, and have your opponent hit you just after you land. You didn’t let go of down+back, so one might think that you’d just block the attack since you’ve been holding down+back for way too long, but instead you’ll JD – and that’s because the JD input was reset the moment you landed.

All this means is that you don’t have to take the stick out of block when you land, in order to input another JD attempt. You just have to continue holding back or down+back, and when you land the game will reset the JD input command as soon as you land without you having to do anything.

179

Thatz a pretty bad ass find Xenozip. I hope we can meet up with you one of these days at a meet or perhaps even at evo.

Keep Play’n. Peace

180

Wow guys! Mus say u cats are official with that knowledge. Don mean to waste space, though I’m kinda like a newbie when it comes to forum usage. Being a strictly console & arcade master, I’ve neglected to learn this avatar & icon stuff.

Peace!