^^^yup. ex messiah is my fave
How would you guys suggest i handle a chun li and balrog? A very aggressive balrog
I’ve been playing Eric Kim’s Sagat a lot this past week.
It’s stressful. Here are the ups and downs:
Ups:
1.) Sagat cannot punish EX Messiah with a quick uppercut. I believe this is the reason why most Japanese Sagat’s don’t SRK immediately before the axe kick. If you stall the axe kick, it can tie or even beat Sagat’s uppercut (EX, too). It’s pretty ridiculous, but against Sagat, he needs all the extra help eh can get.
Downs:
2.) Dive kick is pretty much useless. Sagat can uppercut Rufus on a blocked dive kick if he attempts to follow up with ANYTHING except EX Messiah, which is a waste of bar since it only hits once (Sagat leaves the air).
3.) When Rufus is knocked down, Sagat has a mean mix-up.
- c.lk, c.lk, (hit confirm), c.lp, srk
- c.lk, grab
- early whiffed c.lk, grab
- overhead
If I can predict Sagat doing c.lk, I can sometimes successfully land a LK Messiah. Sometimes I get c.lk’ed before it comes out; not sure which one should be hitting first.
4.) Tiger knee eats everything Rufus has.
So if you can’t jump, divekick combos dont work, and links get SRK’ed I don’t know what a Rufus is suppose to do. He takes away every strength that Rufus has in other match-ups and leaves him with barely anything to work with.
I imagine if he is upper cutting everyimte he blocks your dive kick, maybe blocking might work (unless you dive kicked high enough for him to recover before you, but if thats the case not even EX messiah kick can save you).
You have free ultra, combo, taunt, ect. After you have them afraid to TU after blocking your dive kick then you can put your tick grabs and block strings back into the game.
Be careful if they have meter, they may be willing to risk a TU if they can get out safe with a FADC.
I really feel this match up thread is a bit of a mess. If people can post their thoughts on a certain match up i will happily spend the time updating my own post in a organised way with the info posted. Going through this thread will be very time consiuming.
I will try summarise some info from the thread, but i am an intermediate / beginner learning. I am using what is posted and trying to give credit where its due. Sorry if i paste something in here that is incorrect, please pm if i have posted something incorrect i will fix it ASAP.
So if the better players can post in the following format i will gather any information and Put it in 1 or 2 Posts.
Matchup :: Abel
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
**
Matchup :: Abel**
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
*Can block cr.HP and punish with Ultra. Can punish Messiah (all) with Ultra.
*Dive Kick shenanigans aren?t great against abel unless you mix it up.
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
*Close/(maybe) far St.mk beats out Wheel Kick. Jab SS beats out wheel kick randomly. St.HP as well.
General Notes
throw Abel out of his abel roll
s.hp works as a decent AA
Matchup :: Akuma
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
*EX SS Air Fireballs
General Notes
General Notes
-roll under his fireballs.
-upon his teleporting away from the corner on wakeup, remember to jump away the 2nd time you get him on wakeup in the corner
Matchup :: Balrog (Boxer)
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
his cr.jab will beat you everytime.
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
cr. hp beats dash punches(but is slow)
ex tornado beats ultra
tornadoes are amazing
St.MP is your best poke here.(beats certain dash punches too)
Tri Jumps whiff.
Crossup dive kick is great against Boxer.
Can combo GT > Ultra anywhere on screen.
General Notes
His hitbox is wierd and dive kicks ARE NOT AS USEFUL imo vs Boxer.
c.mp>all his jumpins
Matchup :: Blanka
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
- You can CR.LP his horizontal Balls.
- CR.MP Vertical Balls.
- ST.MPbeats blanka balls
- If you are standing you can punish Horizontal Ball on block if you dash forward and CR.FP.
- Electricxity can be beaten by CR/FP at 3/4 Screen (roughly)
*You can EX Messiah Kick Blanka out of his Ultra as long as he is still rising.
General Notes
**
CoosCoos :: ** First thing is that from about 1 and a half character screens away, Blanka’s j. fierce beats every anti air but ex Snake. You can counter this by walking a bit forward and doing cr. mp, but be careful cause he could just choose to do j. mk instead into dumb ass mixups.
Also, although it’s hard as fuck, I find that making the Blanka think he can’t ball for free helps big in this match. Do cr. lp to stuff it, tornados to stuff it, walk two steps cr. fp to punish if you block it. Granted it’s difficult to do these things at times, but it really helps a lot.
Doing more low to the ground dives helps to bait up random up balls and ultras. When he’s crouching you should NOT be jumping a lot. Also, as previously stated, low dives beat out electricity for a potential big life combo on him. Otherwise either do a spaced cr. lk/cr. mk xx ex tornado, or just tornado him out of it.
The universal tactic of focusing Rufus’ cr. fp pays off big in this matchup. Do not throw this out blindly at all against Blanka cause you could be in for some hurting or a knock down into his mix up game.
Also be on the look out for crossups big time. Watch out for the command hop to throw/cr. lk/crossup j. mk/electricity dumbness. Rufus gets crossed up really easy so you need to be wary of this a lot of the time. That being said, you want to be wary of how you use Rufus’ roll (df + mk). You could be playing right into his hands at times if you roll at the wrong time.
Here’s some random stuff about what pokes beat what or whatever. You can far st. mp a whiffed cr. mk from Blanka. You can also far st. mp a Blanka cr. fp, but if you have meter it’s better to cr. lp xx ex tornado his cr. fp instead. You can st. mk his cr. hk when his leg starts rearing back. You could also cr. lk xx ex tonado his cr. hk, but that shit is way too hard. For his st. hp, you can cr. mk xx ex tornado that as well if you’re really looking for it, but it’s safer to just use your sweep at max range to hit him as his hands are coming down. Max range sweep also takes care of st. hk as long as you hit him after he is done with the flip.
As stated earlier in one of the threads, for ultra, block it low, wait until he starts descending then ex messiah if you have meter. If you don’t have meter, then block it low, then high, and punish afterwards.
Blanka on WAKE UP : Common things that the Blankas here in my area do are up ball, electricity, command hop back, and of course, Ultra.
Usually if the don’t tech, I whiff a low trajectory dive on wake up and either block/close st. lk into a string or throw setup, alter the timing so that the dive hits meaty then do the aforementioned, or I’ll just do nothing but bob up and down to make them think that I am going to do something then walk backwards while randomly crouching (just wiggle your stick from back to down-back, it helps to bait a lot of things, and keeps you safe from lows whatever).
Now if they tech, what I do is highly dependent on where they end up. Most of the time if the end up near you, they will try and mash electricity so you can try a low dive to tag him and then go into a big life combo. Alternatively, you could just walk back and do cr. mk xx ex tornado. Also, for a mid range tech, you can use a dive to gain ground on him, but be wary of up ball and ex elec.
Also I find that it helps that you do a lot of option select crouch block techs in this match when he has revenge gauge. Keeps you safe, and you could potentially put pressure on, or hit a combo if they decided to mash elec since cr. lk beats elec as well.
These are just some ideas and stuff I’ve tried though, and it’s been pretty successful as of late, again, I stress that you watch what he does on wake up then adjust what you do accordingly.
Also, some other thoughts that I may try out a little today:
After blocked dive, I started to do close st. mp, link far st. lp, link far st. mp as a block string. This sets up a distance where it gives Blanka the illusion that he can jump on you, which from the distance this sets up, you can easily spot and react to it. Also, this sets up walking st. mp’s, as well as put you at a distance where your sweep beats almost everything he beats out afterwards.
Alternatively, after a blocked dive, close st. lk, link close st. mp, link cr. lp put you at a distance where you can punish things with cr. mk xx ex tornado, so keep that in mind as well.
Mixing those strings when you’re in may help you get some good life on him.
**JustinGroton :: **
*cr.lp and st. mp beats blanka balls
*cr. mp beats rainbow (vertical) blanka balls
*dive kick does beat electricity at the edges, I’ve proven this one over and over again. so, when you do this, add in st.hp xx hp.tornado. does beautiful damage.
*i have actually beaten rainbow balls with j.rh, but it’s a weird timing
*cr.mp xx ex tornado, cr.mk beat electricity also.
*treating electricity and blanka balls like fireballs and using tornado work
Matchup :: C.Viper
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
-well placed dive kicks that aim for her back on wakeup stuff her dp
-burning kick is fa’able(as is groundpound, but they’ll catch you w/ burn kick if you do that)
Matchup :: Cammy
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
well placed dive kicks that aim for her back on wakeup stuff her dp
General Notes :: What she does
Kritz :: They mostly start off doing Cannon Drill, so I always end up blocking low then punishing it with a throw, if they decide to do a Cannon spike and you block it punish it with Cr.HP. Also if you know she is about to Cannon Strike “from air”, you can punish it with regular snake strike or EX. You should be able to FA her Cannon strike I don’t think it has armor breaking properties lol.
**Kritz :: **HK Spiral Arrow (2hits) - It can be canceled on the first hit that’s why she can do the “Cannon spike” right after, and for the Low and Mid Spiral Arrow when blocked is -17 so Rufus can do what ever he wants.
Cannon Drill --> Spike can be punished. Timing Needs to right go into practise mode and practise the timing.
Bbursine :: c.fierce punishes blocked cannon spikes easy, but can be counter supered on hit
cozeny :: cammy
- crouch block at all times, she has no non-meter overhead right?
- tech obv throws
- cr.MP
- punish spikes with sweep
- punish drills with st.HP xx HP tornado or launcher > ultra
- punish whiffed ultra with launcher into ultra or sweep
**Matchup :: Chun Li **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
J.MP and J.MK are good Air-to-Air tools.
She has a floaty jump. Ex SS her.
Dive Kick beats EX SBK.
General Notes
*when dive kicking sbk, watch for delayed sbk(which WILL beat divekick), at that point you’ll halfto mixup dive timings.
*focus hazan shu’s
*dive kick her head instead of feet when she starts mashing c.lp’s
**Matchup :: Dan **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
know when he can throw you(so you can throw him back… i.e. after dankukyaku’s, etc.etc.)
Matchup :: Dhalsim
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
Biggest issues people have w/ sim are getting in (obv.)
use:
-hk messiah kick
-jump forward hp
-fa his j.hp’s and dash forward
-delayed dive kicks
Matchup :: E. Honda
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
JustinGroton :: cr. jab beats headbutts
if you block any headbutt except lp headbutt, you can punish with cr. hp
cr. mp beats butt slam thing
tornado beats headbutts.
crossup divekicks stuff everything on wakeup
General Notes
Matchup :: El Fuerte
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
focus his wakeup whatnot.
snakestrike if he tries to do his throw extensions
Matchup :: Fei Long
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
**Matchup :: Gen **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
**Matchup :: Gouken **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
-delay divekicks or mix up empty jumps when you have a counter happy gouken
-c.hp from max range when he does fireball shennanigans
**Matchup :: Guile **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
this is like an annoying sim match really-divekick stuffs his wakeups
-jump out of his c.rk’s
-if he’s airthrowing your jumps out of his sonic boom, then fa/tornado/messiahkick through them
**Matchup :: Ken **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
-crossup divekick beats all his wakeups, but you’re NOT in a good 50/50 position upon landing.
**Matchup :: M.Bison (Dictator) **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
-one of two ultras in the game who’s ultra beats rufus’s ex messiah kick upon activation
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
-c.mp beats both parts of his stomps(all versions, when spaced accordingly)
-c.lpXXex tornado after blocked rk scissor kicks
-fa c.rk’s
**Matchup :: Rose **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
-corral her to the corner slowly. the fireball throwing roses only know how to go back, until they hit the corner.
-option select throw after they d/f.mk
-never jump when she’s half screen away with ultra
Matchup :: Rufus Mirror Match
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
Rufus paper Scissor
c.mp>snakestrike
fa>c.hp
j.vertical mk>j.rk
crossup divekick>wakeup snakestrike
fa>divekicks
Matchup :: Ryu (note: There is a seperate Ryu matchup thread which is also very useful
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
Matchup :: Sagat (Note there is seperate Sagat Thread which is useful)
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
**Matchup :: Sakura **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
**Matchup :: Seth **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
General Notes
**Matchup :: Vega (Claw) **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
Jump back j.mp/j.hk takes care of most wall dives
Can combo GT > Ultra anywhere on screen.
General Notes
-option select throw when he does his jumpy axe kick
-throw him when he recovers from back flips, or learn to hit him meaty out of it
-crossup dive kick>his scarlet terror
**Matchup :: Zangief **
Adv vs Rufus :: How to Counter them
He has priority on all his throws / piledrivers. KEEP THE HELL AWAY FROM HIM unless you have meter for Ex Messiah Kick.
Disadvantage vs Rufus :: How to use it
You can FP. Tornado -> Ultra midscreen
CR.FP and ST.FP are you friends. When at full screen snake strikes to build meter for ex messiah kick.
**Blitzman_G :: **Most giefs use lariet almost everytime you jump. If your sweeping distance and you are jumping in use the roundhouse as the two hits usually beat the lariet. Cross up dive kicks beat lariets but you dont wanna stay in long because a second lariet can own you.
IF the zangief is playing mad cross up game a wake up ex scissor hand can punish him (you can also do this if they are jumping in)
Wake-up EX Messiah can get you far away from him so use it to run away!
NO JUMPING TATSU FOR US
Most giefs also spam lariet to build meter you should C.HP when the lariet is almost done to stop him from building meter and to shut him up
General Notes
-Lariet can be beaten by a well zoned ST.FP.
-lp snakestrike>larriet
-c.hp punishes both larriet’s recoveries
-s.hp beats larriets and jumpins
-fa him out of the air what s.hp cannot
-throw him after blocked ex greenfist
-ex messiah kick/ultra him between spins if you’re under his larriet
Space reserved
123
Spoiler
Abel
Close/(maybe) far St.mk beats out Wheel Kick. Jab SS beats out wheel kick randomly. St.HP as well.
Can block cr.HP and punish with Ultra. Can punish Messiah (all) with Ultra.
Dive Kick shenanigans aren?t great against abel unless you mix it up.
Akuma
EX SS Air Fireballs.
Balrog (Boxer)
St.MP is your best poke here.
Tri Jumps whiff.
Crossup dive kick is great against Boxer.
Can combo GT > Ultra anywhere on screen.
http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=187004
Blanka
Cr.MK xx EX Tornado to punish electricity.
Block Blanka Balls standing. Walk forward a little bit, and use Cr.FP to punish.
Meaty cross up dive kicks can punish electricity on wakeup.
J.HK into either Ultra or EX Snake Strike on blocked Rainbow Balls.
Ex GT slides if you need the damage. Cr.MK xx EX GT if he is close and slides.
You can EX Messiah Kick Blanka out of his Ultra as long as he is still rising.
Can Ultra Blanka.
Cammy
FA is a godsend here.
Crimson Viper
Chun-Li
J.MP and J.MK are good Air-to-Air tools.
She has a floaty jump. Ex SS her.
Dive Kick beats EX SBK.
Dan
Dhalsim
E. Honda
Cr.MP beats out Buttslam.
Cr.LP beats out headbutts.
El Fuerte
FA when you are getting up to take away of his options. Can still throw you.
Fei Long
Gen
Gouken
Bait parry?s with short dive kicks etc.
Guile
Ken
Far St.HP beats step kick if you predict it.
M. Bison (Dictator)
Cr.MP beats out Headstomp and Devils reverse. EX SS is good here too.
GT beats out scissor kicks.
Rose
Rufus
Ryu
http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=185142
Sagat
J.MK can cross up Sagat.
Crossup Dive Kick is not useful here. He can punish, even on hit.
Cr.HP under High Tiger shots.
Sakura
Seth
Vega (Claw)
Jump back j.mp/j.hk takes care of most wall dives
Can combo GT > Ultra anywhere on screen.
Zangief
St.FP for anti-air and punishing lariats that are closer.
Cr.FP for punishing lariats across the screen.
Stay away from dive kicks. Tri Jumps whiff.
Don?t EX Messiah from half screen. Lariat beats it. Use it if you predict lariat on wakeup.
Can combo GT > Ultra anywhere on screen.
This is what I have gathered from the thread so far. I think I stopped on page 12 or so.
Why do Abels never go for low from change of direction?
Also can the change of direction + p + p be punished during or after?
You can EX Messiah after the second mid, or do whatever you want if you block the whole thing (pretty much). The reason most Abels won’t go for the low is because it’s super obvious and it doesn’t fully combo, e.g. second mid, finish low won’t combo. However, second low, finish mid will, so you may see that get some use from Abels. Finish low is pretty much Thanksgiving. 22 frame startup with -44 frame advantage for the Abel on block.
I dont know if this tactic is legit or maybe just the gief i played was shit but that move gielf does when he runs towards you with arms out wide, its pretty much asking to be GT’d yes? I kept doing it and hitting him.also i found GT overall quite effective. Can you be hit out / grabbed during a GT?
A short list of things you can do to this move:
a) ultra it edit: make sure you take your shirt off after doing this
b) cr. mk xx HP GT the non-armor version for no meter (230 damage if you time it well, 160 damage if you hit cr. mk at the tip, but still a better option for both damage and stun
c) if you have meter and wanna (hell yeah), or need to beat the armor version, cr. mk XX EX messiah (fadc to ultra optionally awesome) and if you want to get the max damage of the situation and/or KO zangief if he’s almost dead, don’t forget to use MP snake strike after fadc for best results
d) jump up, and delay a mk as his whiff lowers his hitbox, then perform your choice of free combo therefrom, e.g. jump up mk, st. hp, hp gt. this works on both ex and non ex versions.
e) use a plain gt to beat an ex version, and then do a midscreen ultra on zangief cause you can, and who can say no to a free hype-ass ultra
So I just got finish playing Eric Kim for like 2 days straight. More things to note and could use some advice on other things.
1.) When Sagat is throwing out c.lk chains, Rufus can LK Messiah during the links to interrupt the chain.
2.) Back-dash. On wake up, the most frequent thing Eric did with Sagat was back-dash. It helped him escape my dive kick alot of the time. What is the best way to fully punish this?
3.) How do you handle standing roundhouse in close range? The only poke that reaches (while Rufus is crouched) is c.hp but that gets stuffed most of the time. I’m guessing once you’re in that range and you’re crouched, EX Tornado would be the best bet or simply EX Messiah if I think he’ll throw another HK.
4.) Forward roundhouse is a TRAP! If Sagat approaches with a whiffed forward roundhouse (taking into consideration your crouched and below it), it’s a scary guessing game. There’s like no recovery time so he can go into uppercut, grab, or block. It’s a really scary guessing game.
5.) Don’t FA. Tiger knee eats it for free. FA’ing any jump ins can be SRK’ed after landing.
6.) Dive kick to s.lk is out. On wake up, I only go for dive kick to s.hp since it gives him less chances to SRK out of the links.
This shit is really hard. You have to be really, really patient. Even if you score the knockdown, crossing up is pretty risky if Sagat has enough meter to FADC.
what i can add for now
thanks for that, post updated.
thanks for the tips on Blanka matchup. That was my most difficult matchup, especially with electricity killing my dive crossups.
was gonna put this in the general strats thread, but since it seems only to work on dictator… matchup it is
firstly: if this has been mentioned before, i apologize (quite possibly i should just preemptively apologize for mentioning it @ all lol)
secondly: i actually thought it was online shenanigans but its just a highly situational occurance… & pretty much only useful for making dic go "wtf?!"
anyway enough prefacing!
vs dictator
corner on crouching dictator: close hp xx hk mess
resuts in: crouching dictator getting crossed up by hkmess :lol:
i know… its rediculous =P
you can replicate it in training by telling the dummy dic to crouch&autoblock
instead of hp, you can also cancel from close mp or close mk
it may work vs some other chars… aside from dictator i tested it on boxer & ken, worked on neither
& i know this has been mentioned before but i didnt see it in zaffys cleanup attempt post…
vs zang
crouching under or just outside the lariat: crouching :mk: :karate:
Nice read but
In the end…What count the most it’s
1:Reflex
2:Practice
3:Mind Game
Theory it’s nice but it’s does not win you match.
Attention all Rufus players!
I’m from the Ryu forums and DarthPaul1982 is coming up with an interesting idea to get people together who are serious about the game and want to get together with other serious training partners.
Skill level is irrelevant at this point, but dedication is a must.
Weekly online matches and tournaments are required. Tournaments are for practice and gauging your own improvement only. A point system is being established to help keep track of active members so you can clearly see who is serious and who isn’t.
We’re still working it out the details, but if you are interested, please check out thread here.
This thread needs to be organized. This is a disgrace.
more organized 1st post, went through all the pages for that, I used puffs format, if theres something youd like me to add post it here. If theres something you think I should change (format wise) let me know.