MvC3 Actual Balance/Potential Tiers Discussion

[ApocaLips]

I dont think Spencer is that good. He doesn’t do that much damage for a big guys

1.) He’s not big. He just has a lot of health.

2.) He does plenty of damage, including a dhc trick setup.

and once you learn his overhead it’s really not that scary to fight him.

He can throw it out at any time and it’s very hard to block on reaction. You have to be looking for it specifically. Even if you can get around it, he still has really nasty throw pressure.

He’s a decent anchor…but he’s never an issue.

Plenty of tournament matches disagree. It should be saying something when Spencer a huge factor in beating Justin in the only tournament he hasn’t gotten 1st place in.

I hate phoenix, ammy, wesker, and mags 10x more.

They’re not even comparable. They play totally differently.

[Slayerslice]

Top 5 all-around characters, that do not excell in 1 thing

1. Magneto
2. Wesker
3. Zero
4. Amaterasu
5. Taskmaster/Storm

no particular order

[Shiizu]

I can see Morrigan moving up the list as time goes on. She’s got the tools and assets of someone like Magneto which we haven’t seen being utilized in high level play very much. Her normal air dashes aren’t very quick and she doesn’t do a lot of damage, but her fake tri-jump is really fast and she can mix it up between an overhead, low, or command grab. Astral Vision is also one of the best boost-type hypers, lasting 590 frames which is much longer than other boosts and more than twice as long as Dante’s devil trigger. Phoenix’s healing field is the only one that lasts longer at 600 frames.

[Cryoh]

Astral Vision is also one of the best boost-type hypers, lasting 590 frames which is much longer than other boosts and more than twice as long as Dante’s devil trigger. Phoenix’s healing field is the only one that lasts longer at 600 frames.

I believe that Arthur’s Golden Armor lasts longer, but that’s just me picking nits. Morrigan’s got serious potential.

[Ouroborus]

You’re the one playing theory fighter. Every other character in the game is harder to block than Sent. It is easy to block Sent. It is incredibly HARD to block Zero or Magneto. There’s a fucking difference.

go ahead and keep blocking and open yourself up to his throw (xx hsf) and command throws.

Because he DOESN’T have a ‘pretty mean zoning game’. Every single other zoning/keepaway-oriented character has a BETTER zoning game.

says the guy that thinks that sentinel has the worst beam in the game. if anyone believes that, they’re an idiot.

yeah, go keep focusing and exaggerating on his bad traits while completely missing out the bigger picture.

[Shiizu]

I believe that Arthur’s Golden Armor lasts longer, but that’s just me picking nits. Morrigan’s got serious potential.

You’re right, I forgot about Golden Armor…

[k4polo]

Will say that there is still tons of unexplored potential in this game. That is a good thing.

My theory on my Favorite character(DPH) is she is top tier and will drop to high tier IDK.
She gimps the team still even tho she is so powerful.

Then again a tierlist in this game a little different since there are 3 characters and assists to account for unlike SF.

X character may be super high but synergize better with Y character on the lower end of the list.

[Ouroborus]

The problem is, Sent is really basic. Even back when Sent was “top 5” before the nerf, I would always snap him in, put pressure on and kill him. Sent is like the jack of all trades but master of none. He has no instant overheads except on another sentinel. He has no crazy block strings or anything.

The worst thing is the fact that there are so many things that can crack Sent’s defense. Every character has instant overhead into huge combos on Sent. And Sentinel really only has 3 moves for getting people off. Cr.M, S, and TK Hyperdrive. And the first 2 have way too long startup to be used as a solid get off me option when a good opponent is pressuring you.

he is basic and 95% of the people can’t use him right or have any idea how to play him besides mash j. s and lasers or use him as an assist. people that have mvc2 experience tend to understand and do a lot better with him than people new to marvel.

sentinel has some crazy blockstrings with the right assists and why does he need an instant overhead when he has a command throw and high priority normals? also, lets not forget that his normal throw leads to an easy 50%+ combo off anywhere.

thats just like saying dhalsim should have more combos and a better way to get in on his opponent in ssf4 when completely overlooking his biggest strength (long range high priority normals)

dont forget to rule out pushblock and hsf although its highly situational too as a get me off option.

pushblocking helps him a lot more than it does with other characters due to his air normals and hard drive super. and before the nerf, this shouldnt be a problem since 1.3 million health is enough to survive a nuke.

besides, almost every character in this game have a crappy get off of me option.

[Viscant]

JChen said on stream both justin and floe agree that the #1 character is a tie between amaterasu and wesker.

Personally I think Ammy is the best character of the game since first week of the game.

I think a lot of minds are gradually moving to the same place. I think Wesker is clearly in the top group, it’s just a question of how large we make that group.

Put me on the spot and my listing is

Amaterasu
Phoenix
Wesker
Dante
Akuma

I’m not sure if Zero, Magneto belong in this group (gut feeling Zero yes, Magneto no, but I’m pretty free against Zero and naturally biased) and I think Wolverine and Taskmaster are really really good but are slightly below wherever we cut this group off also. I can be talked into or out of any of these last 4 not listed and maybe even Akuma. But I feel pretty strongly that Wesker is becoming a dominant character.

What makes Wesker good (mixups that force you to choose the correct option/guess right) are things that tend not to go away or get solved, but usually just get better over time as people tinker with setups and make them better or more efficient. The counter matchups he has are fairly obvious but can be deodorized with teamwork and effort.

–Jay Snyder
Viscant@aol.com

[NissanZaxima]

I call them the fab 4:

Phoenix
Magneto
Wesker
Ammy

I feel like Magneto and Phoenix might be slightly above Wesker and Ammy… I would write detailed info on why I think this but it is pointless as it is only very very slightly to the point where they are practically even. I keep hearing Dante but he doesn’t scare me nearly as much as these 4. I have him on the class slightly below with Zero, Taskmaster, and Akuma.

[Strangevision]

I can see Morrigan moving up the list as time goes on. She’s got the tools and assets of someone like Magneto which we haven’t seen being utilized in high level play very much. Her normal air dashes aren’t very quick and she doesn’t do a lot of damage, but her fake tri-jump is really fast and she can mix it up between an overhead, low, or command grab. Astral Vision is also one of the best boost-type hypers, lasting 590 frames which is much longer than other boosts and more than twice as long as Dante’s devil trigger.

Morrigan was a poor mans Magneto in MvC2 funny you should say that.

Morrigan IS actually really good, and you can speed up her tri-dash by sj.addf into attack. She’s going to be really ugly when people start to crack her open, I have her on my back burner at the moment.

TOP 5 IMO:

-Amaterasu
-Magneto
-Zero
-Storm
-Taskmaster

Of course I dont even really believe that list myself to be honest. The game is just so fresh. I think Wesker, Morrigan and Dante are also very strong.

Trish is slept on, but I think she will just end up high-mid because she has no real forced mixup.

[Blazemacroz]

I still can’t see people putting pheonix in the top/god tier. She gimps the team she is on so much that it blows my mind why people put her so high. Being cut off from your meter until you get it to 5 is not the best way I would like to play my team. So many options aren’t available to you with a pheonix team it’s not even funny.

[PuFF]

Sentinel has a 1 frame command grab that you can use to get people out of blockstrings.

Also assists can get people off you.

Sentinel doesn’t need overheads. He has zoning and a command grab. Also with a low-hitting assist you can do easy unblockables from half screen with j.H.

First of all, it’s not 1 frame. That alone tells me you are theory fighting out of your ass. His zoning is decent but not amazing. Unblockables are possible but are hard to set up correctly.

Stay free

I still can’t see people putting pheonix in the top/god tier. She gimps the team she is on so much that it blows my mind why people put her so high. Being cut off from your meter until you get it to 5 is not the best way I would like to play my team. So many options aren’t available to you with a pheonix team it’s not even funny.

But the fact a dark phoenix can reverse OCV a team pretty easily makes it worth hoarding the 5 meters. Trust me.

[Strangevision]

Not to mention if she gets snapped in and killed off your team is now crippled.

People try to compare her to Strider/Doom but Cl0ck and team MSP showed that you can still win with your assist character its all about character knowledge. Everyone is buffed in this game just about everyone can hold their own in a 1 on 1, Phoenix isnt a character that you can “get the most out of before she dies” that same way Psylocke or Strider were in MvC2. When Phoenix is dead your team has a foot in the coffin.

Thats why I dont get teams that are bad at building meter with Phoenix as a last resort.

[dantemustdie]

Morrigan was a poor mans Magneto in MvC2 funny you should say that.

Morrigan IS actually really good, and you can speed up her tri-dash by sj.addf into attack. She’s going to be really ugly when people start to crack her open, I have her on my back burner at the moment.

Of course I dont even really believe that list myself to be honest. The game is just so fresh. I think Wesker, Morrigan and Dante are also very strong.

I’m glad more people are starting to see some potential in Morrigan and are experimenting with her. I think in time she’s going to really grow. She won’t be top 5, but she’ll probably end up at a very respectable place in the tier list.

I think a lot of people were kind of put off from using her due to her… unique mobility options.
That and the fact that 2 of her hypers are almost the exact same as two of Magneto’s, so why not just use Magneto? (Plus DISRUPTAH)

We’ll see, I’m interested in seeing what more people think of her and, you know, actually seeing more then 2 people use her in a tournament setting.

[piskooooo]

I still can’t see people putting pheonix in the top/god tier. She gimps the team she is on so much that it blows my mind why people put her so high. Being cut off from your meter until you get it to 5 is not the best way I would like to play my team. So many options aren’t available to you with a pheonix team it’s not even funny.

You’re using her wrong then.

[Nitro_Noodlez]

I think a lot of people were kind of put off from using her due to her… unique mobility options.
That and the fact that 2 of her hypers are almost the exact same as two of Magneto’s, so why not just use Magneto? (Plus DISRUPTAH)

Funnily enough she has the same fly into overhead mixup magneto has too. Her unorthodox mobility options can be a big turnoff to people not familiar with the character, but at least she can do whatever she wants in most matches.

[Strangevision]

Just imagine if she had her instant beam super from MvC2. Ryu fucking WHO?

I’m glad more people are starting to see some potential in Morrigan and are experimenting with her. I think in time she’s going to really grow. She won’t be top 5, but she’ll probably end up at a very respectable place in the tier list.

I think a lot of people were kind of put off from using her due to her… unique mobility options.
That and the fact that 2 of her hypers are almost the exact same as two of Magneto’s, so why not just use Magneto? (Plus DISRUPTAH)

We’ll see, I’m interested in seeing what more people think of her and, you know, actually seeing more then 2 people use her in a tournament setting.

Morrigan is like a shoto with tri-dash mixup options.

Fireball xx flight xx fireball xx unfluy xx fireball … SRK xx flight…astral vision …weird airdash. Shes so much fun. And that full screen airdash is perfect for running away after air recovery and avoiding dash crossup attempts.

She also gives characters like Dormammu and Storm a CRAZY boost with her meter building assist. She can do a lot on point with trap/lockdown assists.

Does Morrigan really have a weakness. She does pretty good damage, no?

[Nitro_Noodlez]

Does Morrigan really have a weakness. She does pretty good damage, no?

Her damage is decent midscreen (about 580K midscreen for 1 bar finishing shower combo), but alot of other characters can get more for 1 bar midscreen. Her most damaging options are in the corner (fireball fly/unfly loops), Astral Vision/DHC trick, and combos that end in DI of course.

Her ground dash could be a bit faster, and I wish you didn’t have to wait 15 frames before attacking out of it too. Her backdash from the ground is pretty bad IMO too since you have to wait 25 frames before attacking and maybe guarding too?

[Nyoronoru]

Morrigan’s problem is that she’s a big victim of Advancing Guard. Her airdashes and ground dashes are slow, when she gets pushed back she has a hell of a time fighting her way back through assists and projectiles because she can’t continuously force people to block.

After getting blown up so heavily for trying to go for highs and lows and such, I’ve kind of resorted to just mashing out flight-canceled fireballs. The only problem with this strategy is that Doctor Doom assist (no matter which one) blows up this strategy for free.

She needs a good assist to start her game, which is a translation for middle tier or lower.